Need opinions on my particular situation

[JarrodS]

Hi, I'm new to the forum, but not diving...

My wife and I were certified (her NAUI, me PADI) some 25 years ago. Neither of us have been SCUBA diving for the last 15 years, since shortly after we had kids and moved inland.

Fast forward to today - we have two teenage boys who we love to free dive with. They are ready (begging actually) to get certified. So we are going to do it at the end of the month. I'm considering two options:

1. PADI online, plus pool skills/boat dives/final certification at a shop in the Florida Keys for them. Refresher course for me and wife, also in the Keys alongside the kids.

2. PADI referral course for the kids, locally, then final checkout dives in the Keys. Same refresher course for me and wife, alongside kids.

Back in my day we sat in a classroom and did the whole thing from start to finish with one instructor. So I'm looking for opinions/experiences/pros/cons of these two options.

How I see it:

Option 1 has the advantage that the wife and I can study alongside the kids during the e-online sessions, and we will be able to be stronger on theory since I'm sure that we've long since forgotten much of the important detail, and only so much is going to be "refreshed" in a one-day course.

Option 2 has the advantage that it takes one less day of our precious vacation time in the Keys (the kids will already have pool skills under their belt), and *they* will get facetime with the instructor during their theory training.

At this point I'm not sure which is the more responsible thing to do. I'm leaning towards #1. I'm a reasonably experienced diver and could probably help them fine on the basics, if they have questions. Plus I found this forum if something comes up that I can't handle

What would you do and why?

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Without getting preachy, here is my short version. When my son got certified I was a DM. I made sure I had nothing to do with his education other than be there for a few pool sessions. I did not go on his checkout dives. I did not want to put any pressure on him or on myself. I chose an instructor I trusted and he had a lot of face time with him.

As an instructor I want to have as much face time with students as possible. It's why I teach a course that has 16 hours in the classroom. I can offer an OW cert that has on line learning and do. It does not reduce time in the classroom. I use the time saved to add material that is not covered in the on line portion and make sure that the on line education is not only remembered but is understood and absorbed as well. The computer only knows if they give the right answer. It doesn't see the lights in the eyes go on that means they understand the material.

Back to being a dad. I can just imagine sitting over my then teenage son's shoulder at the computer. Then trying to "help" him with stuff he is doing. That would have gone over like a large turd in a punch bowl. Having had a teenage son get certified and having certified teenagers I can say one thing. Parents should not be as involved as they think they should be. The education should be between the kids and the instructors. I make that very clear with all my junior divers. Like kids, when it comes to scuba training, parents can be there, be supportive, and help out WHEN ASKED. Otherwise stay on the sidelines and be the parent. Let the instructor teach.

I'd also encourage you to look at local training options for everything with a good instructor. That way you lose no vacation time to being in class.

 

[TSandM]

I'd like to propose a third option: You all take the class together at home, and dive together in the Keys. Having been certified 25 years ago, and not having dived in 15, you are sort of beyond rusty, and a one-day refresher, as you have already considered, is not going to be a very thorough class. Taking the course with your sons is a bonding experience, as well, and you will have a good sense of how confident and skilled they are. My husband did this when I got certified, and he felt it was well worth while.

 

[Colliam7]

Both Jim and Lynne have given very good suggestions.

I'd also encourage you to look at local training options for everything with a good instructor. That way you lose no vacation time to being in class.

Having been certified 25 years ago, and not having dived in 15, you are sort of beyond rusty, and a one-day refresher, as you have already considered, is not going to be a very thorough class.

I don't have a particular problem with eLearning - the students I have worked with who have completed eLearning have been well-prepared. But, what has made the process work, at least in my experience, has been the fact that I have still have had the time and ability to work with them, beginning with a review of the academics, then during Confined Water training, then during Open Water dives. From that perspective Option 2 in particular is very much an undesirable option.

Option 1 is often considered, and not infrequently regretted, by families, who find that trying to combine scuba training with a vacation interferes with, and undermines the quality of, both. And, that depending on the shop / resort they choose, the commitment of the instructor to developing them as divers is, shall we say, tastefully muted.

As an instructor, I would not be comfortable putting you and your wife through (only) a refresher course. Way too much time has passed since certification, and your most recent diving experience. Take the entire course, take it with the kids if you wish, but take it. In fact, I am working with two families right now - in both cases, parents and two teenage children - where one of the parents was previously certified, and realizes that they were far too rusty to safely return to diving with only a 'refresher'. And, in both cases, the elapsed time since their last diving is considerably shorter than 15 years.

If you want to become divers (for the first time, or again), do so the right way. If you simply want to be a family of underwater tourists, on vacation in the Keys, the four of you could do a Discover Scuba activity, and probably have a lot of fun, for little time and minimal financial investment

 

[scubadada]

Hi JarrodS,

I was certified in 1970 by the LA County Underwater Unit and then dived actively in Southern California for 10 years, mostly shore/beach diving, probably about 150 dives. I then did not dive for 17 years. When my son turned 12, we took PADI OWD together on Grand Cayman. We've been diving together for 18 years and will be doing the M/V Spree Wreck Trek in the Florida Keys at the end of the month.

When my daughter turned 12, my wife and she did PADI OWD, again, on Grand Cayman. The entire family has been diving together for 13 years now, though it is increasingly hard to get all 4 of us together.

So, I'm in favor of a plan that looks like TSandM's. I would do the PADI OWD course locally as a family. You could certainly do the classroom and pool locally. I think it is probably better to do the OW dives in a reasonably comfortable environment. If your local diving satisfies this, you could save the vacation time for more post certification diving. If not, you could do the check out dives in FL at the beginning of your vacation and still have time to get in a fair amount of diving. You didn't say where you will be in the Keys, I, perhaps incorrectly, assumed Key Largo. There are many fine instructors, folks on SB would be glad to help you find a good operator and instructor.

Diving is a great family activity, enjoy,

Craig

 

[FinnMom]

Without getting preachy, here is my short version. When my son got certified I was a DM. I made sure I had nothing to do with his education other than be there for a few pool sessions. I did not go on his checkout dives. I did not want to put any pressure on him or on myself. I chose an instructor I trusted and he had a lot of face time with him.

As an instructor I want to have as much face time with students as possible. It's why I teach a course that has 16 hours in the classroom. I can offer an OW cert that has on line learning and do. It does not reduce time in the classroom. I use the time saved to add material that is not covered in the on line portion and make sure that the on line education is not only remembered but is understood and absorbed as well. The computer only knows if they give the right answer. It doesn't see the lights in the eyes go on that means they understand the material.

Back to being a dad. I can just imagine sitting over my then teenage son's shoulder at the computer. Then trying to "help" him with stuff he is doing. That would have gone over like a large turd in a punch bowl. Having had a teenage son get certified and having certified teenagers I can say one thing. Parents should not be as involved as they think they should be. The education should be between the kids and the instructors. I make that very clear with all my junior divers. Like kids, when it comes to scuba training, parents can be there, be supportive, and help out WHEN ASKED. Otherwise stay on the sidelines and be the parent. Let the instructor teach.

I'd also encourage you to look at local training options for everything with a good instructor. That way you lose no vacation time to being in class.

Like a turd in the punch bowl! Wow, I got my eyes wet reacting to that excellent description of how very *thrilled* an offspring of a certain age can be about our help, involvement, advice or mere existence ;-)

But yes, I agree on taking a step or two back to let both wife and kids have entirely their own experience and decide entirely for themselves how they feel about scuba.

Later when you travel, take a step or two back at those times as well. We adults might never be as welcomed into the company of locals as these younger people will be, and it won't happen if the kids seem more like extensions of you than younger, more approachable individuals. Let them learn to have their own adventures so they will keep doing so long after we are too old.

 

[Diver0001]

Option 2 has the advantage that it takes one less day of our precious vacation time in the Keys (the kids will already have pool skills under their belt), and *they* will get facetime with the instructor during their theory training.

What I think is good in your situation is that you've seen the theory before and can go through it with your kids. That will help all of you and get you at the same information level to start with.

As an instructor I really like to have time to talk about the theory. The stuff in the book is part of what you need but another part is to translate theory into practice (things in the real world don't always go the way it's in the book) and make it relevant for the diving conditions where you live. The book won't do that. If you have enough experience to be able to make that link for your kids, then go ahead. Personally, as I said, I like to have a grip on this.

Doing pool skills locally and finishing the course at your vacation destination may or may not save you a day. Not all instructors are created equally. If you have a good local instructor then it will probably save you a day but I wouldn't automatically assume this.

As for the refresher course, if you ask me, it might be better to "dive along" at the least or to recertify together with your kids if you haven't been diving for 15 years. A lot of it is going to depend on your skills and previous experience but I wouldn't dismiss this option just because you already did the course at some point in the past.

R..

 

[JarrodS]

Wow, lots of terrific feedback already. Thanks everybody. Although, I'd be lying if I didn't admit that I'm disappointed that many of the responses boil down to "neither." I didn't go into detail before, but doing the entire course where we live is very unattractive to me for various reasons. The main one (that I just found out in the time since I made the first post) is that at the local dive shop that has classes scheduled for between now and our trip, the instructors give you the theory as "homework", and don't spend hardly any face time with students until the pool sessions start. So that bit of info entirely removes my option #2 above. The other reason I was not in favor of doing the whole thing locally is that there are no good places to dive here (that's an understatement), and my own experience was that the check out dives were the ones that still stick in my memory the most. I want my boys to have that experience, too. Perhaps I'll take some of the advice given above, and take a step back at that stage to let them have the final certification experience as brothers, with my wife and I staying ashore. I can certainly see benefit to that.

Furthermore, I spoke again on the phone to the dive shop in the Keys and posed the same question to them. The response was that they are happy to do either method, but the instructors prefer to have the pool exercises done with them, so they have a feel for the particular needs of each student before they leave the controlled environment of the pool. That made a whole lot of sense to me. Again in favor of my option #1.

Finally, you all have reinforced the idea that 15 years off makes us more than just rusty. However, we do free dive together reasonably frequently, every year or every other year, in the Keys or somewhere on the gulf coast. So it's not *quite* been an entire 15 year hiatus away from diving altogether. Just the SCUBA part.

So all signs point to option #1, although some of the responses have planted the seed of having all four of us do the full e-Learning certification method as we'd originally planned for the kiddos. Or at least my wife and kids. She seems a lot more hesitant to pick up where we left off than I am. She also did a lot less diving that me back in the day. And I'm a lot more likely to be the floating object in the punchbowl than she is. :-D

Edit: Since my first post, I also dropped all our equipment off for servicing. This is finally happening, and I feel like a kid on Christmas Eve.

 

[scubadada]

Hi JarrodS,

Heck of a 1st 2 posts. Do whatever is best for your family. Best of luck in your diving future

Best, Craig

 

[RJP]

I always wonder why people consider doing a scuba class while on vacation to be "wasting valuable time."

There is no reason that learning to dive should not be as much fun as "diving" itself is. Most instructors don't get this... and a lot of students/divers don't either.

All of you doing the class will keep you all together, which is obviously and important part of a family vacation.

I suggest you call the shop back and re-frame your question: "We want to have fun on our vacation - including during the certification process - can you guarantee that we'll have fun doing the confined water sessions with you?"

If they hesitate for even a moment, find another shop/instructor.

If you can't find a shop that will guarantee that you'll have fun learning to dive with them... shoot me a PM. I'll fly down to the Keys and do an OW class for your kids, and you and the wife can join us as a refresher for free. (If you and wife want to get a brand new OW c-card in the process it's easy enough, and cheap, to process the paperwork for two more certs.)