Dive Table Question

[olstykke]

I'm just recenltly certified (SSI).

I was considering listing this as Is diving Safe, but I'm not trolling. I want to get all the facts and takes on the situiation I can.

I'm starting to wonder if scuba is really safe.

I've been considering purchasing equipment (You may have seen my regualtor question http://www.scubaboard.com/t89338-to...t-is-the-newbie-question-for-a-regulator.html ).


A couple of things have happend that have brought this question to the fore front:

A couple who got certified with me. She suffered a DCI. I do not know the specifics. They were under a Dive Con. They claim she did a safety stop and proper ascent. I'll Leave it at that.

One of my instructors at the shop said "It's not a question as to if you'll have a DCI, but when"

When researching dive computers. If you look and read the pdf for suunto, they talk about how they are the only company that has RGBM. That cummulative effects of nitorgen are bad, not well understood, and not accounted for in other systems. That they are the only company to take that into consideration.

**Note: I can't locate the pdf file, I think they changed their site this is wahat I found ( http://www.suunto.com/suunto/main/a...older_id=9852723697223422&bmUID=1110429386709 )

Before I found this information, I was reseaching how the tables were developed.

I like the price of the oceanic atom and features.

THe Suunto computers were a little pricey, and I looked on ebay for used. of the 10 hits, 4 said they were giving up diving because they suffered a DCI.

So I can see it is not a simple question.

But is diving safe.

It may be better if someone can give some comparisions of risk. For instance, is diving riskier behavior than driving?


Granted Suunto is one company, but in a way they are using a "fear" tactic.

Are the tables Oceanic uses, based on data and studies done in 1987 dated, and therefore less safe?

What are the chances of one suffering a DCI?

One of the exam questions states that nothing can gaurantee that DCI will not happen, but these procedures greatly reduce the chances.


So yes to those who read this, I have becone a scared rabbit.

 

[Wildcard]

Don't be scared. It's safe. Mind the basics, assend slowly, keep breathing, don't push the limits. It's not 100% safe but close.

 

[Uncle Pug]

Safe is a relative thing. Saturday morning before meeting OE2X and Lamont for a couple of dives off the Whaler I stopped by the airport to watch my son do his first skydive.

I was thinking, "I'd sure hate to see him go splat." Not that it was very likely, but I'd still hate to see it.

After he was safely down and grinning from ear to ear so big I thought the top of his head might fall off, he said, "That was the most fun I've ever had." Which was kind of a bummer since it meant he liked skydiving more that scuba diving.

So I went on my way and cheated death with OE2X and Lamont in what turned out to be small craft advisories. We were diving from an anchored 17' boat in building weather but since none of us had drowned before doing this we weren't worried. Well maybe Lamont was worried but he doesn't let on. Actually, while pulling anchor we were taking waves over the bow to the point the Whaler started filling up with water.

Anyway... later I learned that in the jump just after my son a young man spun into the ground with *excessive speed*... seems he turned too low with a too small a canopy.

So... safe is a relative thing. It is probably safer for you to watch Oprah.

 

[diverbrian]

I look at it this way...

I am more at risk driving to my dive sites than I am doing the dives. As to the statement that the instructor made about DCS. Not quite.

Some people "redline" every limit in life and never seem to get tagged (although when they do push it too far, the results tend to wind up being more severe). Some people try to be ultra safe and never take a risk. Then some car running from a cop hits them when they are crossing the street (after having double checked both ways).

So, you can't completely guarantee safety under the water. You can significantly reduce the risks to a manageable and acceptable level. If you educate yourself, that will help to answer your questions and make you a safer diver.

So, the issue is "What do YOU consider acceptable risks in your life?" Only you can answer that question for yourself.

 

[Snowbear]

I loved skydiving.... someday when I can afford yet another expensive hobby, I'm gonna have to do it some more. I never felt unsafe. Well.... maybe once... when I came in too fast and tripped over that tree.... but except for that....

I also really enjoyed flying ultralights. I didn't feel unsafe doing that... except for the time I stalled one at 15'.... and the time I couldn't get out of a left turn and kept losing altitude... and the time... well... you get the picture. Funny thing is, there's actually a better chance I'll be doing that before I'll skydive, since ultralighting is more of a solo activity

I've been injured a lot more from horses than from those activities most folks think are dangerous - like scuba diving, sky diving, ultralighting, motorbike riding, firefighting, snowmachining, skiing, driving a car, mountain climbing, ice climbing....

When my time's up, it really doesn't matter what I'm doing ~ there will be nothing I can do to stop it, so as Mike F's signature implies - I'm gonna enjoy the ride! I'm not worried about dying, but I would really prefer not to have any more non-fatal injuries inflicted upon me, so I will do the things I do as safely as possible.

 

[diverbob]

I read somewhere, but I cant remember where, that Scuba is equal to bowling in terms of injuries. It is as safe as you make it. Getting into your car and driving to work has a degree of risk in it, but millions of people do it every day.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Scuba is an adjustable risk sport. So diving is essentially as safe as you choose to make it and that can range from very sedate to very extreme depending on where you choose to set your personal limits.

Deco is not an exact science and there are no guarentees, but if you start out conservative and maintain slow ascent rates, your body will usually give you some hints before you get into trouble. I no longer dive with US Navy tables but I still do deco dives using more conservative bubble models and enriched deco mixes. I feel better when I get out of the water with them and that is something you can monitor and assess as you go along.

Personally, I don't take uneccesary risks but I also don't mind when my diving invokes a little fear inside me. In any extreme sport it's the fear that keeps you sharp and keeps you safe - and that feeling of sharpness and focus is half the fun.

 

[Stryker]

Well you know, they get some nasty shoulder strains in bowling... sometimes crippling.. haha

Diving in and of itself isnt very dangerous. With the technological advances we have had since the old days of diving, equipment is much more reliable, and provided you stick to your training and dont get anxious to push the limits you should be alright.

BUT -- remember that around 50% of all cases of DCS happen WITHIN the limits of the tables. This means that something else had to have happened during the dive besides just going into decompression.

There is a reason you have to be certified before you go dive... so you minimize all injuries and fatalities. Sure you will get both of those, but dont be stupid and you wont fall into either of those catagories...


And by the way Uncle Pug, I can relate with the skydiving story with the exception that "I" was the one diving, and I had a parachute malfunction on my first jump... didnt really hit me til I was on the ground "smiling so big the top of my head would fall off" hahahaha....

 

[theskull]

One of my instructors at the shop said "It's not a question as to if you'll have a DCI, but when"

I might agree with this if he were speaking to someone whom is regularly making dives to 300 ft.

However, many thousands of divers make many hundred thousands of dives without ever having a DCI within recreational limits (less than 130 feet, no required decompression).

Any of the current stock of dive computers will enhance your safety if you use them conservatively, make slow ascents, and make your safety stops. I prefer the Suuntos for their ease of use both in and out of the water, but do not consider them to have a better algorithm for safe recreational diving.

I dive nearly every week and consider it one of the safer things I do. Safer than driving to the dive site, safer than riding my bicycle on the 2-lane roads with the cars whizzing by, safer than climbing a ladder with a 5-gallon bucket of acid in one hand (job-related).

Use common sense, honor your training, and ENJOY your diving!!

theskull

 

[Stryker]

Safe except when we enter places we arent supposed to right theskull? haha sorry I just had to... believe me ive made plenty of stupid moves myself... sometimes I feel this board gets too serious so have to throw in some comic relief...