Noob entering room, Need to select equipment

[Fishpie]

BP&W's are more difficult to put on in the water......no getting away from that.
They are just as easy as anything else to take off.
But any BC is going to be more difficult to put on in the water than in the boat......I expect you'd only be taking the BC off to get out and not entering the water only to put it on.
As for the weight belt.......how much weight are you used to wearing? How thick of a wetsuit? How cold was the water? What material was the tank?
If you are used to diving in colder water with thick suits you'll not need as much weight.
Wear a stainless back plate and take of another 6 or 7 lbs.

I'll also second what several others have said about removing a weight integrated BC in the water....nice for the diver a huge pain for the person doing the hauling. Yes, the pockets can be handed up but I seen more than a few dropped by accident in the process.

[halocline]

BP&W's are more difficult to put on in the water......no getting away from that.

That's simply not true, the hogarthian harness is a BREEZE to put on in the water, it's just a different technique. You get it positioned right and slip your arms in. There are no clips, but it's much less cluttered and much easier to sort out in the water, at least that's my experience and I've had quite bit of experience demonstrating doff and don in the water (OW classes) with both jacket BCs and hogarthian harnesses on BPs.

To the OP; by now you've received all sorts of recommendations from pretty experienced divers. The only way you'll know what's best for you in terms of BC style is to try out a few. In general you will not get your best advice in a typical recreational dive shop; they're there to sell what's in stock.

BTW, to paraphrase what I said before, if your wife "likes the security" of a jacket BC but has only tried one on in the shop, on land, in street clothes, she has no idea what it will be like in the water.

Regarding your regulator purchase, you've also gotten a lot of advice. I'll just re-iterate the fact that if you buy DIN regs and are renting tanks, you will regret it. Count on it. If HOG is coming out with a yoke option, (it appears so) and you want HOG regs, definitely choose that option.

Have you figured out the boat situation? I.E. will you have someone on board while you're diving? If not, I would respectfully suggest that you re-think your whole diving project. There are few things IMO that really are dangerous in OW diving; but diving offshore with nobody in the boat is one of them. There are plenty of ways to get separated from your boat; currents, navigation, someone decides to "borrow" it, a mooring line (or worse, anchor) gets detached, or maybe just something happens on the dive and you're tired or sick and need help getting aboard. Think about it, or if I'm wrong about your plans, I apologize.

[Fishpie]

Sorry, but a BP&W is more difficult to put on in the water than a jacket style BC especially for an inexperienced diver. Not much, I'd agree, but there are a few extra steps. Mainly involving the crotch strap.
Saying this, it's been my BC of choice for 15 years.
It's also been my student gear exclusively for the last 10 years.
Certainly wasn't trying to put off the OP from getting one......just pointing out the fact that he most likely won't be putting one on in the water.

[Blue Sparkle]

So a few more comments and questions.
1) very important. How easy is it to get into a BP/W while in the water?

I can give you my perspective. I've used two different bp/w rigs: One Halcyon Eclipse (rental) and one DSS (mine). Both have the most basic harness, with no additional clips or ez-in type things. I wondered at first, because I had taken my first OW class (years ago) in a vest BC with full Fastex buckles, etc. And here I was in OW class again (had gone four years and only made two dives since first OW class so re-took it), with the only bp/w and never having put it on before that day. But it went fine. Doff and don actually seemed easier than I remembered - maybe because the straps are a bit "stiff" and tend to stay "open" so you can slip your arm in? I don't know but it seemed fine (also note that you don't set up the shoulder straps to be "tight" as they don't need to be).

Then I got my own rig and again, all seemed fine.

But then, last February, I totally wrecked my shoulder. And on top of the injury I got "frozen shoulder." I couldn't even comb my own hair and put it in a ponytail, and getting things like coats on and off was murder.

By June I REALLY wanted to go diving. I figured I might have to put a buckle in my harness webbing because my mobility was still pretty bad. I decided to just bring the buckle(s) and my sewing kit along, and see how it went. I did loosen the shoulder straps (symmetrically) a bit more than usual. The first day I rented a tank from the shop and just got into a nearby canal along with my BC (not on me) and then tried donning, doffing, and "diving." It worked okay - actually easier than I thought it might - and so the next day... real boat diving!

The whole first week I jumped into the water with just my mask, fins, and weight belt on (2# so not dangerous), and then donned my rig in the water. The only problem I had was sometimes the free end of the waist strap would get behind me or the crotch strap would get behind me and they would be hard to reach. My buddy gave me a hand (it would not have been hard for me if I had not had lack of mobility on that side). At the end of the dive, I then doffed my rig in the water and got aboard. Again it went fine.

The second week I "graduated" to donning my rig aboard and jumping in fully clad, but I still doffed in the water and handed up. I'm just mentioning this because it was a lot more situations of "imperfect" conditions vs. just doing it sitting on a boat bench.

So I never did put a buckle in, and it wasn't a problem even with one "bad wing." I had the shoulder straps a bit looser than usual, but not a lot. The rig was still not moving around on me while diving (I hate that). That's not to say everyone would have the same experience, but just to give you my perspective.

Since I have yet to see one/ or try one on first hand, it is kind of hard to imagine how you put it on. if I clip it on like a BCD then OK if I have to step into it and then tighter straps, that could be hard floating around in the water.

What I found was that yes, if the rig was floating, it was difficult. I would simply let a bit of air out of the wing, so that it would start to sink (but only slightly) and then it would be right "there" and not hard to slip into.

What I do (same on the boat) is let my arms slide down into the shoulder straps. That's vs. reaching way back with them like I would to put on a coat. Then I pick up the crotch strap, feed the waist strap through it, and buckle it up. Then I'm in. Once you have the straps set (which I only change if I'm going from no wetsuit to wetsuit, or have a shoulder injury) then there is no adjusting when you don the rig - you just get in and buckle it up (the tightness of the waist band you do control each time, like fastening a belt on a pair of pants).

2) I really do not want to wear a weight belt. That was is my number one complaint with the diving I have done so far. I just find it very very uncomfortable. So where do I put the ditchable weight? Is there flexible wieghts something that would mold itself to you, I.E. sand like?

There are "soft weights" which are essentially like bean bag pouches with lead "beans." I like a weight belt - and it can be nice to have weight off the BC - but in the keys in summer diving (which you mentioned you are planning to do for starters) you probably will not have an issue with putting some weights right on your BC. You may not even need any if you have a steel backplate, but if you do you could put pouches on the waist band or on your cam bands (depending on where you need it for trim).

So far my wife does like the idea of a BCD,

Just a note: BP/W, back-inflates, and vests are all "BC's" It's only if you dive without any sort of inflatable buoyancy compensation that you are not using a BC (which you probably would not do at first).

She like's the idea of feeling secure in a jacket. However the jacket that she likes so far (Mares Hybred) is pricey and that combined with the slight more that we are spending on the Regs, makes things higher that I wanted to budget. I do not see her really out growing it.

For myself, in the grand scheme of things, the BC being one I like is so important that I would spend whatever it took (obviously not thousands, but within reason) to get one I liked and that fit well. That said, is she sure she would like it in the water vs. on land (where they seem to have features that would be wonderful for backpacking but maybe end up being not so useful in the water?)

No vest BC's fit me well, so I can't relate on that angle (except that I disliked diving until I had a BC that did fit). I will say that I, personally, feel more comfortable in my BP/W than I did in vests, but maybe that's because they didn't fit me well. On me the tank slopped around a lot with them, and I felt all bunched up under the arms.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that if your wife really would like the Mares best, then, if I were her, I would get it for sure. If she's not sure.... then it would of course seem like a lot of money spent for something less than ideal.

Blue Sparkle

PS: One last note:

I wonder if she would like a cheaper mares that looked similar from the pics would be good for her... Pegasus.

I had to come back to say something after thinking about this. I hope you will not be offended. I'm just speaking in general as a female who has seen a number of couples wherein the woman became disenchanted with an outdoor sport or activity --- and not about you specifically as I don't even know you.

Anyway, what I'm beating around the bush to describe is that I would often see a couple getting into, say, downhill skiing. If it was the guy's idea (or he had already been doing it but alone), he would study up on gear and then get some really fantastic skis, boots, and clothing -- and then either give his wife his old stuff, or buy her some more "beginner" gear because after all she was not that "into it." Later (after she quit) I would wonder how it would have gone if she'd had "the good stuff." I'm sure in some cases it would not have made a difference; but in others it was probably a factor.

Again, I'm not saying this is you; for all I know you are getting a faded, garage-sale BC and she's getting the latest and best (And too, she could get the Mares and hate it and then be sorry she spent so much.)

[highflier]

Thanks for the comments
some replys
When achor or drift I would have somebody on boat. There are some shallow reefs that have moring balls and ussually quite a few boats and ppl. I snorkle them often with nobody on the boat. one of them is 2 miles off shore but there is a light house out there, so I could swim to that in a event that the boat was sunk/stolen etc....
As per other comments
1) wife will get what she wants I will get what I want. She wants this stuff as much as me infact she told me to figure it out and get the stuff. Yes she needs to try on other bcd's I was asking if it was even worth while to try on the Pegasus
2) Integrated weights. well if I hate belts then other hassles are worth it. Most of the time I am the captain and the mate so I will have to send weight up some how my self.
3) Yes getting in with with BC on... getting out without it. Just doing the best I can do to consider all options. Maybe the next boat will be better.
4) I really wish we could try gear on but in the real world the stuff I can get my hands on will be limited at best.
5) weights... we were trained to use a little weight as possible. I was diving with just 8LB on and it was marginal. Wife was using 10 and had issues if there was any air at all in BCD. SO I guess she will need about 15. Belt did not bother her as much as me. But she still wants integrated weights.
6) not worried to much about pockets at all. activites that we plan on include Photography and spear fishing (maybe) Oh and lobstering during season of course.
7) We got padi cert at same time. She likes to dive. but does not like the whole diveboat line up get off etc.... when we shore dove in hawaii she had a total blast, that the first and only dive we did it on our own. Just rented the gear drove to a popular dive spot (2 step on the big island) and geared up and away we went.
8) If there is anyone in Marathon Florida that is willing to let me see and try a bp/w of theirs, I would be happy to give them a ride out to the dive spot and play captian while they dove.
9) Wife like the idea of a jacket BCD is what I ment. She does not like the idea of a bp/w setup. but then she has never tried it.
10) BS, your shoulder sounds like mine. been getting worse for 2 years, 1 year ago it was 60% frozen. first doc appt to look at it Dec 30. I am guessing it is a town rotator. I can not through a baseball at all nowwa days.
11) I personally think that things are slowly changing to DIN. The local dive shot said they rent din. I of course would have the spin on adaptor, I want to see how the tank and all fit me as I don't want to be wacking the back of my head on the first stage. That said when we travel, I like to travel light and may just rent all the gear. Of course I have to lie about my medical, as I missed out on the chance to dive during several carabean vacations as they would not let me dive with diabetes. It's under control and a blood issue not a breathing issue. For that reason I really do not have a great desire to get into Decompression dives. If I feel low blood suger comming on I can signal dive buddy and call the dive over
BTW BS. The rental BCD jackets did not fit my wife well at all, she to is short waisted. But on land she did say the hybred had a good fit and was comfortable. But like I will find a place for her to try one in the water....right the only reason she got to try this one on is a customer was picking up the one he ordered. They do not keep them in stock.

Highflier

[orenbvip]

I would just call around (dive right in scuba, or dive cave adventures, etc) and just ask them if they can give you a deal on the Epic set. Chances are they will especially if you will buy 2 sets. Don't forget scubatoys.com will give you 10% off for SB member and they carry the express tech. but I'd try Dive Right Into Scuba first.

[Blue Sparkle]

4) I really wish we could try gear on but in the real world the stuff I can get my hands on will be limited at best.

I hear you on that one. Unless you are lucky enough to be around an active dive community with gear to lend (I'm not), at some point you have to make a leap. Makes it all a bit fraught at first.

Wife was using 10 and had issues if there was any air at all in BCD. SO I guess she will need about 15.

I would be a bit cautious on that one. I had a similar problem at around 16# (couldn't get down), added weight to counter it, and finally was diving with 21#. Turns out it just made everything harder (more up/down, etc.) Once I got my own gear I went almost instantly from 21# to 10#. Ahhhh. Much better. I have since trimmed a bit more, but nothing that dramatic I think one thing that helps is that my BC does not trap air or have much inherent buoyancy. Also, I was able to relax and not do anything unconsciously (finning, etc.) to keep myself from sinking.

7) We got padi cert at same time. She likes to dive. but does not like the whole diveboat line up get off etc....

I found that intimidating as well, because I was used to snorkeling off my own boat, at my own pace, with no crowd. I don't have my own dive boat, but now when I am doing boat diving (there is no shore diving to speak of in the Keys) I favor six-pack boats. Since my buddy and I are two, there can be at most four additional people (and sometimes its less if the boat is not full). That helps a lot.

we shore dove in hawaii she had a total blast, that the first and only dive we did it on our own. Just rented the gear drove to a popular dive spot (2 step on the big island) and geared up and away we went.

I had a tiny taste of that when I made a dive at a Florida spring. Quite nice! I think I would really enjoy Bonaire because it is (or can be, rather) all shore diving.

If there is anyone in Marathon Florida that is willing to let me see and try a bp/w of theirs...
Wife like the idea of a jacket BCD is what I ment. She does not like the idea of a bp/w setup. but then she has never tried it.

I don't know when you plan to buy gear, or when I will next be in the Keys, but if it worked out I would be happy to let your wife try out my Small size bp/w (I'm short-waisted too). I even have an extra so we could both dive (well, I would need to get a set of cam bands, but I will probably do that anyway).

For you, you could possibly rent a bp/w from Silent World in Key Largo. At least as of a couple of years ago, they rented "Standard size" Halcyon bp/w. That's how I first tried one. (And it might be good enough for your wife to get the idea - it worked for me - although unless they have the Small size for rent it will be a bit tall.)

BTW BS. The rental BCD jackets did not fit my wife well at all, she to is short waisted. But on land she did say the hybred had a good fit and was comfortable. But like I will find a place for her to try one in the water....right the only reason she got to try this one on is a customer was picking up the one he ordered. They do not keep them in stock.

I hear you on that! I tried on every Small and X-Small women's BCD I could get my hands on (which was around 8 different ones) and none of them fit well (which, btw, Diver's Direct in Key Largo did have around 6 Small and X-S women's BC's in stock to try on). I finally figured out none of them were really going to work for me, and then I found out about the bp/w, which fits me great, so that's what I got. I think I mentioned this up above, but if your wife simply doesn't like the idea of the bp/w, and isn't interested in one, have you looked at the Zeagle Zena? It's more like a corset fit and you can mix and match the various fit components, size-wise. I wasn't aware of them when I was shopping, but now if I were "forced" to go to a vest or back-inflate BC I think that's what I would try.

[highflier]

BS, we will be there in March. Maybe you need to plan a dive trip

I really wanted gear for that trip, I may have just the regs and then rent tanks and BC's

She defintily needs more wieght with the rental BC's With a minumalistic setup maybe not. But on one dive (at the end when her tank was getting low), during accent, I had to grab her fins and create as much drag as I could to slow her down. Once she started up there was no stoping her. Lucking the accent was a reasonable speed but I was worried about what was on top. I.E. boat ect. Cause even I could not stop her, But I did slow her to 1/3 the rate it would have been.

Highflier

PS. BS we used to keep our previous boat (would have been a good dive boat) on the C&D canal. Did lots of crusing in the Cheasapeak bay. Do you dive this area? I never really had a interest in diving in that water.

[highflier]

Just updated my avitar. Its the logo and name of our boat. Having it custom made by a friend.

Highflier.

[Blue Sparkle]

BS, we will be there in March. Maybe you need to plan a dive trip

Well I definitely DO need to plan a dive trip. Getting very dry

we used to keep our previous boat (would have been a good dive boat) on the C&D canal. Did lots of crusing in the Cheasapeak bay. Do you dive this area? I never really had a interest in diving in that water.

No, all my diving has been in Florida so far - mostly the Keys. There may be some diving around here, but I haven't really tried to find it (and I don't hear much about it). It's fairly murky/muddy from what I can tell. I travel (or may move) to dive.