SEI AOW course requirements

[Ith]

I have the chance to go to the Keys for a weekend of diving with a local dive group. During this trip the dive outfit we are going with has an SEI instructor who is willing to go through the advance skills with us on the dives. I'm not sure if he is just giving us instruction or if we would be earning an actual AOW certification. Since so many folks are going from our group and this group has a long history of making this trip about three times a year, he is only charging $25 per person for his time.

The trip has a total of 7 dives, with one being a night dive and at least two wreck dives. One of the wrecks is the Duane. I have heard that this is a difficult dive. I currently have less than 25 dives under my belt. Would this dive be too dificult for me? I'm 31 years old and in fairly good shape.

When I looked at the SEI website, it didn't list a minimum number of dives required for an AOW card or any classroom time. It seemed to only require classroom time for Advance Plus. Is this correct? Does this sound shady to anyone or is this kind of thing done regularly? I looked at a thread started by Jim Lapenta and his description of the AOW class was much more in depth than doing 5 dives and some skills.

[Jim Lapenta]

Let me start by welcoming you to the SEI Diving forum. I am one of the mods for this forum. The standard SEI Diving AOW course is not much different than many other AOW courses. The AOW plus does require classsroom. AOW does not. This is something that is being looked at by our training dept. You may not know the full history of how SEI Diving came to be and I will not go into it in this post. Read some of the older threads for info on that.

There are requirements for the AOW course like any other agency. Navigation, Night, and Deep are required. A total of dives must be done for this cert and the other two can be chosen from the following - Night, Deep, Navigation, Boat, Environmental, Drift, Search and Recovery, UW Photo, Computer Assisted Dive, or Wreck.

What can also be done is dives that the instructor has developed and received permission to offer. They can also include skills that the instructor has demonstrated to benefit his/her students. In this way as long as standards are met the instructor is free to add skills and knowledge and test on that knowledge for certification. In fact we are encouraged to add material and skills.

The AOW course I offer is MY AOW course and is what I choose to teach. I spent nearly a year developing it, deciding in the dives, what skills would be included and getting approved to teach it. Some of the skills took a bit of convincing to get ok'd. I wrote my course based on the needs of the students who were coming to me and the skills they possessed or did not possess.

Your SEI instructor does not have to offer the level of training and skills that I do, but he can if he chooses. I have been pushing for us to increase our requirements and skill levels and am very active in course development for the agency. I saw a need for the type of course I offer and was fortunate enough to belong to an agency that allowed me to do that.

So to answer your question as to it sounding shady- No I would not say that it is. I would say that what he is charging you barely covers the cost of the card if you are getting one. If he is just offering some skills help then that is all he is doing. If it is a course you will need to sign waivers and releases, fill out a medical, a student folder, etc.

If he is just acting as a mentor then that is something different. But if it were me and I was being compensated in any way I'd be getting the paperwork done. If for no other reason than for insurance and liability purposes.

I don't know what is being included in the instruction you are getting if it is indeed formal instruction. So I can't say if it meets standards. I offer non certification workshops on a regular basis. Some people do not need or want to take a course to improve on a skill. So I don't force them to. But if it is outside of my normal routine I do deserve to be compensated for my time and see no issue with that. Long I know, but without more details it's hard to answer for your specific situation.

[Ith]

Thanks for the reply Jim. My OW cert was PADI, so I am not familiar with SEI. All the information that I have is second hand. I have not yet spoken directly to the instructor. The reason he is offering is because we will be doing the required dives with his outfit so he figures we ought to go ahead and get the cert since we are doing the dives anyway.

I'm glad you were able to help me with this. Knowing what the agency requires and what an individual instructor can do is a big help. Since I had seen your post about the Oct AOW course and everything you had included, I was a little worried about what I was getting into. However, since you explained that you offer an indepth (pardon the pun) class that most others don't, I feel much better.

[Jim Lapenta]

No problem. I do realize that I did not address one part of your question. That about the dive on the Duane. The Duane is an advanced dive. It is around 120 to the sand with much of the main deck at 100-105. There is a lot to see in the 60-80 range as well. I've been on it in no current conditions and when the current was running at 2 knots or so as estimated by the boat captain. If the latter I;d be hesitant about taking an AOW student with no deep or current experience on it. In no current it would be a great dive. You need to ask yourself if you are comfortable with this. Having a good buddy would be crucial and close supervision by the instructor a must. Just going on the dive with the group would not be my idea of a proper way to do it.

[Ith]

I'll have to decide on that day to do the Duane or not due to the conditions. I am not comfortable enough right now to go below 60 ft and I've only have any real current experience once before and that was in a shallow area of a jetty, where I could easily climb out on the rocks if I needed to. I have no idea what the current was running at, but it was a difficult swim back to shore. I'll be sure to take your advice under consideration for that dive.

[DMarelli]

This is your Instructor. The Advanced Open Water certification is really something that makes you an advanced diver but it does meet the standards used by other agencies, at least the ones that follow the RSTC minimum standards. What AOW does is give you experience in doing 5 additional dives and working with an experienced Instructor who will mentor you and build your confidence. There are additional advanced courses that incorporate classroom and diving skills if you are interested in those.

SEI Diving was formed in 2008 by leaders (including me, who is on the SEI board) from the YMCA Scuba program. YMCA decided to drop scuba and we determined to carry it forward. We are (by extension) the oldest national certification agency and we have the highest standards of any national US agency. We do not do 1 weekend certifications or resort certifications, unlike the major marketing scuba training agencies. So you can be assured that you will be under instruction / mentoring of a highly qualified instructor who is very interested in your 1) safety, 2) comfort, 3) confidence, and 4) fun.

Yes, the Duane can be a challenging dive, but many current open water divers consider any dive with current or even the slightest wave a challenging dive. A diver with the proper mental attitude and equipment and minimum fitness level can easily dive the Duane. I have led hundreds of students from Florida Sate University to the Duane, and because of our superior training through YSCUBA (and now SEI Diving) I have never had a student fail to do the Duane dive and have a good time doing it. You will be in good hands, and when the time comes to dive the Duane you will be ready! If you need to contact me directly call 850-443-2177.

Dan

[Mike D]

Ith,
You will be in good hands with Dan. This will be a great experience for you to learn a lot.
Welcome to the SEI family, you will not be disappointed.

[Ith]

Thanks for the post Dan. I'm looking forward to the trip.

[Jim Lapenta]

Had you said who your instructor was my answer would have been much shorter . Had you said you were going in his program I'd have said " have a ball!" I'm used to getting students for AOW from non SEI instructors and they leave much to be desired in many areas. Dan would not be taking you if he didn't think you were ready. Knowing you are one of his students makes a big difference.