Who is responsible for what?

[Riger]

..... It is up to the individual diver to research their instructors, charter operators, guides, travel agents etc etc. and ultimately make the decisions about whether to get on the boat and then get in the water......

In a perfect world I agree 100%, however, I remember being so overwhelmed in the beginning (even at the age of 41) that I just took everything for granted. It was not until I first perceived a dangerous situation that my wife and I thumbed our dive in what we thought was a "rebellious act", that I realised that ultimately we dive alone.

Now we aim towards independence at every turn.

I feel sorry for those who get hurt whilst they are still in the "overwhelmed" stage.

Best Regards
Richard

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

Jim, thanks for writing this.

Mods? Make this "stickie", or I'm busting out the Aquaseal

Best wishes.

 

[Seanpaul]

Jim, and you thought you were gonna get railed on... you had no idea! ;-)

 

[scubadude79]

Thank you so much for that info. I am sure it will make some students go back to their instructors and be more open about asking or to further develop their skills.

As for the students out there... Please follow JimLap's advice and seek more education and skills. Not only will it make you more comfortable and safer, but it will allow the sport in the alien environment to be more fun.

 

[gcbryan]

Great post Jim.

I'm continually amazed at how a new diver (or any diver) can do something as unnatural as breath underwater and take things for granted and feel that somehow someone else can keep them safe. You would think that natural survival instincts would kick in and one would naturally be cautious until enough knowledge/skill/experience was gained to be competent in the water

You are responsible. If you aren't comfortable without the DM being in the water you shouldn't be comfortable with the DM in the water. If you aren't comfortable don't dive until you are comfortable.

A new diver doesn't need to be uncomfortable. Go on a few 30 foot dives with great conditions until you are comfortable. No diver should get into the water if they aren't comfortable.

 

[MtnPlayVA]

If you aren't comfortable without the DM being in the water you shouldn't be comfortable with the DM in the water. If you aren't comfortable don't dive until you are comfortable.

I don't agree with this - how does one become comfortable if they don't get in the water and dive?

A new diver doesn't need to be uncomfortable. Go on a few 30 foot dives with great conditions until you are comfortable. No diver should get into the water if they aren't comfortable.

A few 30 foot dives in great conditions isn't always possible. Dives to 30 feet may make them comfortable at 30 feet but then what? Having a DM present while trying new dive locations is a great thing. Should that person be responsible for every aspect of your dive, no. But new divers like myself can not possibly learn if we don't have a DM or mentor to show us the ropes.

I am all for training - I've taken quite a few classes since OW in July 08. Do I feel comfortable in the quarry where I dive a lot, sure. Do I feel comfortable in the ocean? Not at all. How do I gain that experience - I've done it by diving with a group. I don't expect them to protect me but I do look to them for their experience.

 

[gcbryan]

I don't agree with this - how does one become comfortable if they don't get in the water and dive?


A few 30 foot dives in great conditions isn't always possible. Dives to 30 feet may make them comfortable at 30 feet but then what? Having a DM present while trying new dive locations is a great thing. Should that person be responsible for every aspect of your dive, no. But new divers like myself can not possibly learn if we don't have a DM or mentor to show us the ropes.

I am all for training - I've taken quite a few classes since OW in July 08. Do I feel comfortable in the quarry where I dive a lot, sure. Do I feel comfortable in the ocean? Not at all. How do I gain that experience - I've done it by diving with a group. I don't expect them to protect me but I do look to them for their experience.

One becomes comfortable by diving with a good buddy in decent conditions. A DM is not a mentor or a dive buddy when leading a group. Of course your first dive in newer conditions is not going to be as comfortable as more well known conditions but if you dive to 60 feet in a quarry and are comfortable you don't make your first wall dive in the ocean to 100 fsw with only a DM leading a dive.

You need a good dive buddy and a dive plan. If the DM leads the group deeper or in someway violates your dive plan...don't follow...that was my point.

 

[TheScubaBOB]

Isn't this like saying that time spent in a pool is worthless?

I have as much pool time as I do Open Water time (for now, that will change by the end of the summer).

How do I benefit from the pool time?

1) Getting comfortable with my gear.
2) Relaxing while breathing through the regulator.
3) Practicing the mask removal & clearing in a "safe" environment.
4) Fine tuning my weighting (for fresh water of course).

I will not wear a piece of gear in OW without having first donned it in a pool.

I don't agree with this - how does one become comfortable if they don't get in the water and dive?


A few 30 foot dives in great conditions isn't always possible. Dives to 30 feet may make them comfortable at 30 feet but then what? Having a DM present while trying new dive locations is a great thing. Should that person be responsible for every aspect of your dive, no. But new divers like myself can not possibly learn if we don't have a DM or mentor to show us the ropes.

 

[wsacdiver]

If your not comfortable and capable of doing a dive, from start to finish and including the planning phase, totally solo then why do it with a buddy? Thats generally along the lines of what I say. Pretty much sums it up IMO.

I absolutely 100% agree with this. I agree with diving with a buddy, but you should never depend on them being there for you. You have to be self-sufficient.

 

[awdemeo]

great post really opens your eyes to the safty people over look. people really need to be aware of how they are getting trained i know a family member got trainded from a shop and when i went diving with them for the first time (me being traind by a diffrent shop) i was giving him tips and helping him with skills that the instroctors only touched on that were important skill to have like how to astablish boancy and how to avoid a run away assent.
thanks Jim