No solo diving in overhead environment

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm not sure that's the case, as I don't see any need for additional restrictions on/training for rec-level solo divers. You seem to, but maybe I'm misreading what you mean when you say that you're thinking that all solo divers must have some kind of "tech training"?

 

[NAM001]

Since i like a good argument. I want to say that solo is not a technical skill per se' . I view it as,,,, solo it a way of diving where you replace your buddy through use of redundancy and skills. Sounds like tech but its not. If i am diving at 40 ft doing a normal rec dive it is a recreational solo dive. I am diving with in the constraints of recreatinal diving but by my self. My buddies air has been replaced by a pony, ect. Should i go solo at 150 ft. I say no. unless your are equiped to have, on you, all buddy provisions that your buddy would normally provide if needed. although in the big picture,, the buddy role is the same where ever you are. However the services expected to be provided by the buddy changes,, as well as how they are rendered. 'for instance, for deep diving, if one buddy calculates deco and the other shoots the buoy then when solo you have to both functions. These specific examples are not necessary to a 40 ft dive hence the buddy roles are different. So does a recreational solo diver have any business doing a solo tech dive. I say no. If you are trained to dive tech solo that is a different matter. I will agree that solo like tech diving requires a much higher unserstanding of things than the casual rec diving practiced by most. with in that difference lies the demon that will get you.

"This thread reaffirms my position that solo certifications should require tech training, so that rec divers don't decide they're tech-qualified. "

I do not think technical training should be required for solo diving. Diving within in your training and limits is a boundary easily understood by both rec and tec divers. There are plenty of examples of technical divers who overestimate their qualifications and abilities and engage in dangerous diving practices.



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[Six Feet Under]

I went to go dive at Ginnie this past week - probably the last 3-4 times I've dove there, my buddy and I have checked in at separate times, or I haven't had one at all. This time, the girl behind the counter (I assume manager/ownership level employee) refused to check me in unless my buddy and I were standing there together at the same time. She said "oh, you're only open water certified?" as if to imply if I had any level of cave certification she would allow me to solo dive (presumably in a cave). All I wanted to do was get some more bottom time practicing kicks and basic skills near the end of my camping trip I took with my girlfriend (not a certified diver, yet).

Baffles me how it would be okay for me to solo CAVE dive, but because I only held an AOW certification, it wasn't okay for me to kick around and shoot a buoy in 15-20 feet of open water when I'm wearing a drysuit, wing, double 100s, an AL30 pony, and have a spare mask stuffed in my thigh pocket.

 

[oldschoolto]

After reading this thread, My head hurts....

I started diving in 1973 solo.... Double hose, J-valve, navy tables, no SPG or a BC.... Worked my way by reading and slowly working my way deeper and then in too deep solo wreck dives.... I was lucky to have a few talks with Mike Sandaloaf (Spelling) on do's and don't....

Training does not mean crap.... If the trainer is a pea brain.... I see divers that I would not trust in a kiddie pool with dive master cards... I'm sorry that I have such little faith in the system that has come about.... Everyone is bad mouthing the other guys course and ratings.... As long as we want to make diving open to everyone and it's as safe as riding a bike.... Divers will do stuff they have NO clue about... All the ratings in the world will not save your life..

Jim...

 

[NAM001]

I am confused by you tinking that they would let you solo cave and not aow cave. The issue was are you trained to dive solo or not. Cave had nothing to do with it. The cave cert comes in to whether you can have a light with you when you dive.

I went to go dive at Ginnie this past week - probably the last 3-4 times I've dove there, my buddy and I have checked in at separate times, or I haven't had one at all. This time, the girl behind the counter (I assume manager/ownership level employee) refused to check me in unless my buddy and I were standing there together at the same time. She said "oh, you're only open water certified?" as if to imply if I had any level of cave certification she would allow me to solo dive (presumably in a cave). All I wanted to do was get some more bottom time practicing kicks and basic skills near the end of my camping trip I took with my girlfriend (not a certified diver, yet).

Baffles me how it would be okay for me to solo CAVE dive, but because I only held an AOW certification, it wasn't okay for me to kick around and shoot a buoy in 15-20 feet of open water when I'm wearing a drysuit, wing, double 100s, an AL30 pony, and have a spare mask stuffed in my thigh pocket.

 

[Six Feet Under]

I am confused by you tinking that they would let you solo cave and not aow cave. The issue was are you trained to dive solo or not. Cave had nothing to do with it. The cave cert comes in to whether you can have a light with you when you dive.

I had no interest in going in the caves because I'm not certified to dive in an overhead environment yet, and don't want to do so without proper, quality training. I only wanted to spend more time in open water fine-tuning my buoyancy and trim because I haven't had the drysuit too long, and I have my cavern/intro class in a few months. I see your point (reference my confusion at what she was saying) now that I re-read my original post, and I'm sure the rule is in place because of insurance regulations, but it's stupid that you have to have a card that cost several hundred dollars to obtain just to be able to dive alone when you have the necessary equipment to be self-sufficient twice over and the water is barely deeper than a swimming pool.

This has been a frustration of mine since I started diving two years ago, I only have three other friends that dive, two of whom are only AOW as well and they almost never get wet anymore. The last one is willing to go regularly, as diving is his main hobby, but our schedules only mesh well enough that we get to go a few times a month at best. Most of my initial diving was done in areas I could get to by boat (all freshwater springs) and solo because I had no other choice (well, besides paying $80 to do one or two single tank dives on a boat after driving 2-3 hours minimum to get to their shop).

Only other place around here I can think of where I could do such a thing would be the Rainbow River, and I'd have to rent either a fishing boat or a canoe since I don't currently have one of my own...

 

[tstormdiver]

I'm sure the rule is in place because of insurance regulations, but it's stupid that you have to have a card that cost several hundred dollars to obtain just to be able to dive alone when you have the necessary equipment to be self-sufficient twice over and the water is barely deeper than a swimming pool.

Just because someone has the equipment, does not mean they have the appropriate skills or the right mind set to use the equipment when the SHTF & panic starts to set in. I learned a very valuable lesson on equipment vs skills & mind set a few years ago. It nearly cost me my life. That incident pushed me to seek the proper training & to learn & practice the proper skills to do the dives I wanted to do. They all 3 do go hand in hand. The runs may not be any deeper than a swimming pool, but one can drown in only a couple inches of water. I am not saying you are or are not at that point,... I do not know you, but I am saying that all 3 parts- equipment, skills & mind set must be in order to conduct dives safely & properly. Believe me I understand your frustration at not finding buddies,.... I went through that for the first 2-3 yrs of my diving career. It does get better, if you are willing to reach out to others.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

it's stupid that you have to have a card that cost several hundred dollars to obtain just to be able to dive alone when you have the necessary equipment to be self-sufficient twice over and the water is barely deeper than a swimming pool

No argument from me, but let's be clear: you don't have to have anything to solo dive. If you want to solo dive in someone else's water, though, you can play by their rules, convince them to make an exception, or go dive elsewhere. I've had no problem making use of the latter two approaches, but I suppose it varies depending on your options. You can't even get a good doubles fill of really deep bottom mix for the cost of a solo class, though, so if it's holding you back just do the silly class already - might even be useful.

 

[NAM001]

I will just make a blanket assumption that the ins guy did not write the policy for the ginnie conditons. It was most probably , minimise your liability by forcing the buddy system uppon entrance unless otherwise trained. Or insure divers do not with your knowledge dive beyond thier trained abilities. Aow says diving with buddy. solo says diving without buddy. N fla is a tough place to dive unless you are caving it. and yes ginnie is not much more than a big pool. At least at the ball room area. My first trip there had me driving all over looking for the ball room. all I saw was swimmers in waist deep water and thinking I am certainly in the wrong place. I do think that it is expensive there but it is a good time to work on skills ect. perhaps you could try out vortex springs, that may be more to your liking/ objectives. and its not that far to go to.

I second the sentiment of the post above. you can learn the hard way or the easier way. Especially if you are a n fla diver. Get the solo and the cavern certs or be ready for a drive and still have to deal with "where is your buddy".

I had no interest in going in the caves because I'm not certified to dive in an overhead environment yet, and don't want to do so without proper, quality training. I only wanted to spend more time in open water fine-tuning my buoyancy and trim because I haven't had the drysuit too long, and I have my cavern/intro class in a few months. I see your point (reference my confusion at what she was saying) now that I re-read my original post, and I'm sure the rule is in place because of insurance regulations, but it's stupid that you have to have a card that cost several hundred dollars to obtain just to be able to dive alone when you have the necessary equipment to be self-sufficient twice over and the water is barely deeper than a swimming pool.

This has been a frustration of mine since I started diving two years ago, I only have three other friends that dive, two of whom are only AOW as well and they almost never get wet anymore. The last one is willing to go regularly, as diving is his main hobby, but our schedules only mesh well enough that we get to go a few times a month at best. Most of my initial diving was done in areas I could get to by boat (all freshwater springs) and solo because I had no other choice (well, besides paying $80 to do one or two single tank dives on a boat after driving 2-3 hours minimum to get to their shop).

Only other place around here I can think of where I could do such a thing would be the Rainbow River, and I'd have to rent either a fishing boat or a canoe since I don't currently have one of my own...

 

[Doc Harry]

No solo diving in overhead environment.

That's not for you to decide.
Stop telling us what to do or not to do.