Deep 6 is NOT a "Self Service" model

[Scuba Scott]

I teach the course about this reg. It's open to you as well as any person.

The availability of the course is not a concern, return on investment is. I also have no interest in servicing other brands that are not popular in my area. Not that the equipment isn't good, is just that I would never make enough servicing certain brands to cover the expense of getting authorized to service them.

I'm sure you teach an excellent class on this but as these regs are a very simple design that I am already familiar with, if I ever get to spend any time training with you I think there are some other things you could teach me that would be a much more valuable use of our time.

 

[JackD342]

If I change the oil in your car and you end up getting hit by a train later that day because "you thought you could make it" that isn't my fault and nobody would ever try to say it was.
If I service your regulator and you run out of air on your single-tank 40M dive because you never bothered checking your air or your time I can pretty much guarantee a lawyer is going to come looking for me.

If you would be willing to send a written service authorization based on my other authorizations I would gladly advertise Deep 6 service. I actually have one of your service manuals and your reg looks just about identical to a brand I service all the time so my comfort level in doing the work is not a concern. The authorization would ease my liability concern.

I often think about that metaphor, and it makes a lot of sense. But it is still not quite the same.

The issue is not whether or not I think I am able to supply the same level of service and expertise as the next guy with or without specialized training, it is a matter of my ability to defend that service in the (fingers crossed) event that something occurs where a diver or their family point a lawsuit my way. I don't get to decide liability, that is what the courts do. If a manufacturer has a "trained and authorized" program, any decision I make outside of that becomes much more difficult to defend in a court of law. Even if a manufacturer provides training but does not REQUIRE training, that becomes a weak point in the defense of an "untrained" provider.

I think the inherent risk and the general expectation of who can perform what service in the automotive repair industry is just not an apples to apples comparison with dive. And I think generally accepted practice weighs heavily in that kind of litigation. (I'm NOT a lawyer, just prudently cautious)

 

[EireDiver606]

In the beginning ….

About 40 years ago my son was 12 years old. Sam IV had been raised in a pioneer diving family surrounded by divers and diving all his life. He had attended summer BSA camp at Catalina Island, had some time on his hands and needed a challenge. I called the then instructor Bryan Miller (a dear friend but not related) and asked if it was possible to enroll 12 years old Sam IV in the week long 40 hour equipment repair course? The response was positive so Sam IV packed a lunch jumped on his bike and peddled through the then mild Orange county traffic to US divers and the equipment repair course.

He returned home the first day excited has I had hoped he would. Over dinner he chatted about his new found companions in the course by first name ( a family no no - adult were to be addressed as Mr. or Miss, but these were his adult classmates and he was a young adult) He was amazed that he had more dives and had been diving longer than any others in the class- but this was 40 years ago and diving was just beginning to migrate past the SoCal borders.

Every day he returned home with a memento from US Divers, a tee shirt, a sweat shirt, fins, mask and snorkel and finally a youth size wet suit. Apparently the word had got out among the company officials that he was the youngest ever to take the US Divers repair course and they wanted to reward him.

Several weeks after the completion of the course he received a telephone call from US Divers There was a fellow who would like to meet him - could he drop by tomorrow ?

As 12 year old adventuresome boys did and I assume still do he took off with out a word to his mother and I to US Divers.

Waiting at US Divers was Jacques Cousteau who met him, congratulated him on being the youngest ever to complete the company sponsored repair course him and gave him an autographed copy of his latest book. Sam IV was some what impressed .with his new friend Zeek ( JY Cousteau)

And that was the way it was -- a long time ago from US recreational diving's birth place which has now spread to the hinterlands of the US and the world.

Sam IV ? He competed his Eagle scout a few years later, became a NAUI (Life) and PADI instructor, ER & Hyperbaric doctor and is now a director of the local regional hospital.

Sam Miller, III

Awesome story Sam. Not many can say they’ve had the pleasure of meeting Jacques Cousteau!

 

[Lorenzoid]

If I service your regulator and you run out of air on your single-tank 40M dive because you never bothered checking your air or your time I can pretty much guarantee a lawyer is going to come looking for me.

If the case involved a reg brand you were "authorized" to service, would that same greedy, over-zealous lawyer simply decide not to go looking for you once he learns you have "authorization"? I suspect the idea that being "authorized" to service a particular regulator brand helps insulate a shop from liability is something made up by the reg mfg industry.

 

[txgoose]

I assume that it would be fairly big news in the industry, are there documented cases of a reg tech being found negligent in a diving accident?

A person can be sued for anything. Is there much precedence for reg techs being found negligent? And of those cases, how many were negligent because they serviced a reg that they hadn't received some level of certification for? I have no skin in the game, but it seems like it would be information widely circulated if it was an even remotely regular occurrence.

For that matter, are regulator sets regularly tested by some official group after an accident? Are reg sets generally collected as evidence after an accident?

This might be a big digression. I've just don't recall ever seeing information posted related to any lost negligence case. Well, I don't know that I've read about a case ever being brought against a reg tech. Surely in our sue happy environment (USA) someone has.

 

[Scuba Scott]

If the case involved a reg brand you were "authorized" to service, would that same greedy, over-zealous lawyer simply decide not to go looking for you once he learns you have "authorization"? I suspect the idea that being "authorized" to service a particular regulator brand helps insulate a shop from liability is something made up by the reg mfg industry.

No, I'm sure the lawyer will still come looking for me. My liability insurance is much more likely to cover me though if I did something I was authorized to do. I'm no lawyer so I don't know if it will help or not so I just do the best I can do and hope it is enough. If the industry made it up then they fooled me. What do you think the chances are of getting someone who knows nothing about diving to believe it if they can make me believe it? Those are the people I have to look out for.

 

[JackD342]

NOTHING completely insulates ANYONE from a lawsuit in this country. Which is why there is so much focus on managing liability to maintain the most defensible position possible.
Having all your ducks in a row may discourage a legal action, but more important is to be able to successfully defend one that is brought.
I for one would not want to be a "test case" of whether "authorized" is meaningful or not.

And while it may sound like I am arguing a specific position, that is not the case. I am just trying to clarify the real world environment in which we operate - especially for folks that think liability is an optional or mythical concept that is easily ignored.

 

[cerich]

For every shop that only services brands they are dealers for Another does all brands.

Shops get to choose their level of comfort

 

[The Chairman]

but as these regs are a very simple design that I am already familiar with,

Yes, they are. Most LDSes I know, take whatever work they can get. Some won't, but most will.

 

[Scuba Scott]

that is easy and change you example from oil to brakes.

OK, In my example I am not at fault in either case. If an engine blew up because of a faulty oil change or a faulty brake job caused a crash I would be at fault and insurance may cover that because I was doing work that I am qualified to do based on what is accepted in the industry.

In my example of unauthorized service, my insurance may decline to pay for my legal defense even though my work was not the cause of the injury. I would likely be found not liable but would go bankrupt proving it.