Sea Turtle Shot In Neck With 3-Foot Spear

[Protondecay123]

You're forgetting a fundamental difference: a pet is used to being handled by humans. Wild animals aren't. For them, the experience is completely alien and very probably a lot more stressful than it is for a pet.

I'm all for conservation and preserving species. But unless the species is critically endangered, it might well be that the "humane" option of taking an injured wild animal to the vet is the least humane option.

But there's no cookie cutter answer to that question.

I think what you are failing to consider is that The Sea Turtle Hospital has been staffed with professional veterinarians since 1986 that are specifically trained to treat "wild" Sea Turtles and I'm sure that the issues you are raising were considered before treatment was started. Part of every medical professional's training is Ethics. Ethics are used in every medical decision. If you ever visit that area of the US, I urge you to pay the Hospital a visit and see for yourself the wonderful work that they have done in healing and returning to the wild injured and diseased Sea Turtles. You could get direct answers to your concerns then.

 

[HalcyonDaze]

Someone page Skink and Serge, there's work to be done ...

Hopefully they do get someone for this; a few moths ago a dive captain up in North Carolina reported a vessel leaving a wreck where they found a speared goliath grouper and that was followed up. Not sure what the law enforcement outcome was.

As far as the whole euthanasia versus treatment bit, I'm all for treating an animal if possible. The Turtle Hospital has been on my list of places to visit when in the Keys; I've just never gotten around to it.

 

[Storker]

I think what you are failing to consider is that The Sea Turtle Hospital has been staffed with professional veterinarians since 1986 that are specifically trained to treat "wild" Sea Turtles and I'm sure that the issues you are raising were considered before treatment was started.

You're quite right that I don't know enough about neither that particular facility nor about how turtles in general react to being handled by humans. It might well be that the turtles are dumb and docile enough that treatment is the best option.

The question should still be seriously considered every time we think about "rescuing" and medically treating a hurt wild animal. I've seen enough "animal lovers" collecting birds after oil spills, making them go through rather extensive treatments before releasing them. The poor birds haven't only been cleaned from the oil, they've also lost the natural waterproofing of their feathers and most of them freeze to death after having gone through a rather stressful procedure.

So some times the best option for the animal is to be put out of its misery, unless the survival of the species depends on the animal going through a lot of crap. Other times, treatment is best for the animal. And it should always be a case-by-case evaluation, not a knee-jerk reaction towards one of the options.

 

[DBPacific]

You're quite right that I don't know enough about neither that particular facility nor about how turtles in general react to being handled by humans. It might well be that the turtles are dumb and docile enough that treatment is the best option.

The question should still be seriously considered every time we think about "rescuing" and medically treating a hurt wild animal. I've seen enough "animal lovers" collecting birds after oil spills, making them go through rather extensive treatments before releasing them. The poor birds haven't only been cleaned from the oil, they've also lost the natural waterproofing of their feathers and most of them freeze to death after having gone through a rather stressful procedure.

So some times the best option for the animal is to be put out of its misery, unless the survival of the species depends on the animal going through a lot of crap. Other times, treatment is best for the animal. And it should always be a case-by-case evaluation, not a knee-jerk reaction towards one of the options.

My thought has always been that if the animal is going to die if nothing is done, and there's a chance to give it a full recovery, then you'd better try to save it. Me personally? I would rather go through a month of extreme stress then be able to go back to my normal life than die slowly and in pain while people who could've done something watch.

Medical professionals have to spend plenty of time on ethics and morals. I would be beyond shocked if this wasn't a conversation that happened.

 

[Scuba_Jenny]

You're quite right that I don't know enough about neither that particular facility nor about how turtles in general react to being handled by humans. It might well be that the turtles are dumb and docile enough that treatment is the best option.

I can assure you with my limited amount of sea turtle work and the vast majority of it being with hatchlings, that they are not dumb or docile. I think this is a fallacy of most sea creatures, thinking sharks here too, that is in need of a serious makeover. Research has documented a lot instances of caring, compassion, awareness, etc...

 

[Protondecay123]

I can assure you with my limited amount of sea turtle work and the vast majority of it being with hatchlings, that they are not dumb or docile. I think this is a fallacy of most sea creatures, thinking sharks here too, that is in need of a serious makeover. Research has documented a lot instances of caring, compassion, awareness, etc...

Certainly one of less discussed discriminations regarding the intelligence and mindset of other creatures/sentient beings. We give them repetitive tasks to perform and testers say " see they are dumber than we are?" Meanwhile the Hawksbill is saying " Yeah, show me how to catch a jellyfish at 1000 meters". There's no doubt, in my mind in the least, of their intelligence and compassion. Sheesh, Descartes set Western Thinking and human compassion in general back hundreds of years by basically an "animals ex machina" argument. And in some ways we still haven't overcome that way of thinking.

 

[Sam Miller III]

FYI
In the beginning ….

Skin Diver magazine; a magazine for skin divers and spearfishermen
Vol1. Number 1, December 1951 (68 years ago)
Article; Spearfisherman enjoy November trip to La Paz
By Ron Drummond (Ron became a world class Surfer - Traitor to diving )
Pages 5,6,7 & 8
Page 8- picture
Paul (Pablo) Hoss ( a divers Diver ! )
Displays a turtle he caught

The morals manners and attitudes have changed in 68 years
All for the best and getting better

SDM

 

[Scuba_Jenny]

(and now to totally derail the conversation.. or is it move it to another direction?)

Certainly one of less discussed discriminations regarding the intelligence and mindset of other creatures/sentient beings. We give them repetitive tasks to perform and testers say " see they are dumber than we are?" Meanwhile the Hawksbill is saying " Yeah, show me how to catch a jellyfish at 1000 meters". There's no doubt, in my mind in the least, of their intelligence and compassion. Sheesh, Descartes set Western Thinking and human compassion in general back hundreds of years by basically an "animals ex machina" argument. And in some ways we still haven't overcome that way of thinking.

 

[Protondecay123]

(and now to totally derail the conversation.. or is it move it to another direction?)

View attachment 539721

Have seen that before and LOVE IT! I checked over the Sea Turtle Hospital website to see if there are any updates. No news but the press release indicated that Splinter will fully recover.

 

[rob.mwpropane]

When I went to the turtle hospital they said a turtles brain is extremely small for it's size. In fact, they said regardless of how long a turtle stays in their care there's never an emotional attachment towards a human by a turtle. As soon as they can they disappear into the sea and they don't look back or "come back to say hi". They do not nurture their young, they do not learn from one another. They're born with all the knowledge that they need to survive and that's about it. I'm not saying there not majestic creatures that don't need protection, I'm just saying there's a big gap between say a dolphin, or a pig and a turtle. Doesn't really matter because at the end of the day I'm a turtle lover. I think they're amazing regardless of their intelligence (or lack thereof).