Cancellation of booked trips

[Blackcrusader]

Thanks for the offer. Our boats/engines/compressors/tanks are probably the last things we would sell however. We have quite some land with full ownership we will try to sell some parts of. And maybe some of our cars. Another solution we consider is to try to find a partner who would like to live and work in Indonesia and could invest money to cover the costs until we can start again. With 3 resorts we could use some extra input anyway. Firsts we will have to see how the situation worldwide develops. In the meantime I wish all affected by this extreme situation all the strength you need.

My wife lived in the Philippines for five years and we were discussing maybe move there in the future and invest into a dive center. There are going to be a lot of failures in this industry. Having a resort with dive center is nice. You wrote

"Another solution we consider is to try to find a partner who would like to live and work in Indonesia and could invest money to cover the costs until we can start again"

For myself as an investor the problem I come across is that many dive centers have no proper accounting documents so no lists of inventory and their current value, many rent properties and don't own a lot of assets except the dive gear they rent out and perhaps some cheap vans and compressors, and some small boats. Then of course there is the issue of what an investor can actually own when it comes to a business, such as land buildings etc which is not possible for many countries.

 

[Indah]

My wife lived in the Philippines for five years and we were discussing maybe move there in the future and invest into a dive center. There are going to be a lot of failures in this industry. Having a resort with dive center is nice. You wrote

"Another solution we consider is to try to find a partner who would like to live and work in Indonesia and could invest money to cover the costs until we can start again"

For myself as an investor the problem I come across is that many dive centers have no proper accounting documents so no lists of inventory and their current value, many rent properties and don't own a lot of assets except the dive gear they rent out and perhaps some cheap vans and compressors, and some small boats. Then of course there is the issue of what an investor can actually own when it comes to a business, such as land buildings etc which is not possible for many countries.

You are right. The best way is to start a PMA or buy (the shares) of an existing one. This is the website to start informing yourself about the regulations is: https://www.bkpm.go.id/ Only Indonesian citizens can have full ownership of land. Both Indonesian and foreign companies can only lease land. I am a Indonesian citizen since 2008. My wife is Indonesian and our resorts are built on land we have in our own full ownership (SHM). Foreigners cannot be an offical partner/shareholder in an Indonesian company (CV), only in a PMA. An foreign company (PMA) can own buildings and other assets. We have 3 CV and 1 PMA. The PMA I started in 1999. For more information please send an email: rob@wedaresort.com

 

[John Bantin]

These are strange times. When it's finally over, the world will be a different place. The last 70 years have been a golden age of economic growth. It's been global. Many of us will soon be living in reduced circumstances, whether we live by salary, investments, or annuities. Those in the developing countries will suffer most. Imagine your life changing so that instead of working in a dive resort you have to go back into the forest and make sago just as your grandparents did. You won't even be able to buy cigarettes anymore. Bleak? I'd say so.
Stay home, stay safe and don't risk yours' or your loved ones' lives. It's not over until it's over. You haven't lost the money for a dive trip. That was already spent. You've lost the experience.

 

[Ministryofgiraffes]

i wonder if PADI etc are allowing DMs to put their certification/license annual dues on hold...

 

[Antaboga]

i wonder if PADI etc are allowing DMs to put their certification/license annual dues on hold...

There is a petition going on at change.org for exactly that.

Sign the Petition

 

[Diver Rick]

For what its worth, here's our experience with refunds/credits/cancellations for a 4 week trip to Indonesia, planned 1.5 yrs in advance for May 2020.

- Return flights North America to Jakarta, with EVA Air, were refunded in full at our reqquest, no problems.
- 9 Day trip at Misool Eco Resort, had been paid in full. No refunds, but "credited" us with 24 months to re-use. Bonus: it was booked at 2019 rates and they are allowing us to re-book at our 2019 rates. About a 20% gift.
- 8 day trip on Mermaid II. 25% deposit paid, balance was still owing. No refunds, but credit to re-book up to 24 months to use as well.
- several hotel rooms for airport layovers and 4 days in Bali all booked using Expedia. All refunded in full via Expedia. Very smooth process and refunded within weeks.
- Finally, flights with Garuda Airlines for Jakarta to Sorong and back. No refunds, and had to be re-booked by June this year, and used by June 2021. Therefore this rendered our 24 months credits above useless, unless we wanted to kiss goodbye about $800 of Garuda flight costs.

Results: We were able to re-book both Misool & Mermaid for June 2021 with compatable dates to get to both and use the Garuda credits in time. Will re-book the EVA flights asap, and various hotel rooms later.

So, assuming travel and pandemic situations allow us to go next June, I think we did okay. If we are able to get the EVA flights at similar rates, we will not be out any money.

Like everyone else, disappointed we couldn't go on our trip (20th anniversary present to ourselves) but now looking forward to next June!

 

[Ministryofgiraffes]

that's not a bad result...I'm still fighting with Philippine airlines a bit as they cancelled my connecting flight from Manila to Bali and will offer a voucher, but are claiming at this stage it is not 'COVID related'...although they claim not to have a reason for why it was cancelled, just not due to covid because that would meant hey would have to honour their 10% extra.... so they wont extend me the 10% extra offer to cover potential increases in ticket prices for next year....at this stage.

Other than that, all the bali accommodation have been great with cancellation/rebook for no extra charge. Palm living have been particularly flexible...I suggest anyone considering renting a villa in the future goes to them first...

 

[Ministryofgiraffes]

and don't even get me started on Avianca who cancelled my flight and refuse to refund as 'COVID is not their fault....'

 

[Indah]

For what its worth, here's our experience with refunds/credits/cancellations for a 4 week trip to Indonesia, planned 1.5 yrs in advance for May 2020.

- Return flights North America to Jakarta, with EVA Air, were refunded in full at our reqquest, no problems.
- 9 Day trip at Misool Eco Resort, had been paid in full. No refunds, but "credited" us with 24 months to re-use. Bonus: it was booked at 2019 rates and they are allowing us to re-book at our 2019 rates. About a 20% gift.
- 8 day trip on Mermaid II. 25% deposit paid, balance was still owing. No refunds, but credit to re-book up to 24 months to use as well.
- several hotel rooms for airport layovers and 4 days in Bali all booked using Expedia. All refunded in full via Expedia. Very smooth process and refunded within weeks.
- Finally, flights with Garuda Airlines for Jakarta to Sorong and back. No refunds, and had to be re-booked by June this year, and used by June 2021. Therefore this rendered our 24 months credits above useless, unless we wanted to kiss goodbye about $800 of Garuda flight costs.

Results: We were able to re-book both Misool & Mermaid for June 2021 with compatable dates to get to both and use the Garuda credits in time. Will re-book the EVA flights asap, and various hotel rooms later.

So, assuming travel and pandemic situations allow us to go next June, I think we did okay. If we are able to get the EVA flights at similar rates, we will not be out any money.

Like everyone else, disappointed we couldn't go on our trip (20th anniversary present to ourselves) but now looking forward to next June!

Do you expect that travelling will be back to normal June 2021? I mean, would you come to Indonesia when the people would not have a vaccine yet. I really wonder how many live aboards will be still in business if they would not have guests for a year or more. Actually, the same is true for the resorts. I cannot even imagine what will happen to domestic flights.

 

[Ministryofgiraffes]

Do you expect that travelling will be back to normal June 2021? I mean, would you come to Indonesia when the people would not have a vaccine yet. I really wonder how many live aboards will be still in business if they would not have guests for a year or more. Actually, the same is true for the resorts. I cannot even imagine what will happen to domestic flights.

Not that you were asking me... but yes..I do expect everything to be pretty much back to normal by next year. That doesn’t mean I think all the same operations will be in business or the airlines will all necessarily have the same design on the tail and wings, but there will be flights and there will be dive boats and there will be scuba operations.

I think some operations will not survive. Namely the ones who were financially weaker going into this or the ones that were not effectively managed or were very short sighted and did not offer reasonable flexibility to booked divers for reschedules. I’m not sure their reputation will recover enough for them to win the new business they will need during and after the recovery. Divers are a loyal bunch who do their research and they will flock to the operations who were flexible. There is now concrete evidence of the operations who claim to be all about customer service and professionalism etc, but when the **** hit the fan they all shrugged and said ‘not our problem, go and get a refund from insurance’ ..I think they will really struggle to win back trust from divers.

airlines may go bankrupt, but someone else will buy those planes and reactivate those routes quicker than you think.

Cozumel/cancun floated the idea of opening on June 1st, Delta airlines announced they would fly the route from June 1st and several people said they were wasting their time as no one would go, then 72 hours later they had to close the bookings for June as they had far more passengers booking than they had expected...with no vaccine in sight..

already in Canada/UK/USA there are mass gatherings and people completely ignoring lockdown any opportunity they can get...so I expect it will go one of two ways. Either back to or very close to back to normal or mass human extinction.
I’m probably fine with either at this point..: