Predive check, preventable accidents

[fisherdvm]

Well, to demonstrate some of the worst rental equipments in the USA, and why you should always check your gears, rental or not before a dive...

My nephew, a novice, rented BC and reg from a well known dive shop in key largo (they are allowed to feed the fishies there!).

He got the first BC - the dump valve string was cut off. I told him to get another one with a working dump valve. The guy at the shop said, all the dump valve on all the remaining rentals have the string cut off... But finally found one with a string on a dump valve.

Before we boarded, I told him to manually inflate his BC. It wouldn't inflate. Then we found a loose inflator hose elbow. Tightening it up, the BC inflated fine. Then we pull the butt dump valve, and the string was frayed, and had a ball of knot that keep it from closing. I pushed it back in with my finger nails, so it closed, and told my nephew not to use it. Now we know why all the strings on the remaining BC's were cut off!.

We check his reg cap to make sure they are tight. The octo cap was soooo looose, it required at least 3 complete turns to tighten. Might have caused a flooding if it were his primary....

Then we boarded the boat. Of the 5 divers in our boat, 3 encountered bad o rings on their tank (30% bad tank O ring). My nieces BC had such bad corrosion on the inflator hose valve, that it took 3 of us multiple tries to remove the inflator hose from it after the first dive.

When we dove, my nephew floated to the top toward the end of the dive. We couldn't figure why, as we did a check out dive the day before. He told us that the dive shop equipment guy refused to give him 20 lbs of weight, and insisting that he needed only 16! As a beginner, my nephew did not dare to question. I can see where a resort can insist on adding weight to a diver, but not to subtract it!!

We heard that other people had problem with the equipment guy to, my self included. He said that he did not have any weight belt in my size, but once I looked through a pile of disorganized belts on the ground, I found one within 1 minute...

He refused to find the exact weight my sister needed to balance her BC weight, insisting on larger ones that would have caused an imbalance.

The only other dive place I found with such bad rental gears was in Freeport, Bahamas. My same nephew was issued both a defective BC (major leaks), and a reg with ripped mouth piece. Fortunately, the dive master traded his BC and reg for him... It is still his fault (my nephew) for not checking it before we boarded.... But how many people actually do? I can expect bad rental gears in other countries, but not in the US.

The moral of the story - a predive check is absolutely essential on all dive gears, and you are responsible for your own proper weighting before a dive.... Even new gears have loose inflator elbows, dump valves.... And sand and vibration can cause regs to stick or come loose.

 

[rawls]

One remedy that may be possible has to do with the certifying agency the resort dives under...Have your nephew notify the agency and inform them of the problems. Your nephew may not have certified under that agency or that dive shop but the agency the resort operates under also does not want the shop to be teaching students using faulty gear. for instance...PADI bashing aside...if the shop operates under PADI they want to hear about these things, regardless of whether he was PADI, NAUI, SSI, YMCA...certified or not. They want to know if a shop or resort is using defective gear. You can best believe they will check into it. I'm pretty certain the other agencies will as well. If they are using 2 or more different agencies then call all of them.

IMHO, we as divers have a responsibility to report these things which will indirectly help to keep others safe when they dive, especially new divers. Some may disagree with this but we are all brothers and sisters in our love of diving and we can look after each other by reporting dives shops that are not doing the same. You can best believe that if your nephew had these problems then others have too. By reporting these things he may indeed be saving a life...And yes...ALWAYS do a thorough predive safety check...

 

[wreckchick]

I'm not going to address any of the other issues, however, as it relates to weighting...

I have seen some people come up with outlandish amounts of lead that they claim they need and I have summarily refused to provide it for them. There is no way on earth that 100# woman in a shorty needs anything close to 16# or a 160# man with no exposure protection needs 20#. I don't know the body shape of your nephew but with my experience, I can see why in SOME circumstances someone might not provide the amount of lead someone asks for. If he sank without trouble at the beginning of the dive, then unless he was OOA/LOA at the end, there shouldn't be any problem with 'bubbling up'.

Rachel

 

[fisherdvm]

He's about 160 lbs, full 5 mm wetsuit with boots. Needless to say, 20 lbs might be excessive. But there is no reason to force him to wear 16 lbs, as he was not able to maintain a safety stop at 800 psi. Better to be overweighted than floating on the surface, waiting to get whack with a propeller.

That's why we had a predive check the day before, and he was having problem keeping under at 18 lbs with 500 psi, that's why we told him to dive with 20 lbs the next day....

Just because you can enter the water, does not mean that you have sufficient weight to be neutral at 20 ft with 500 or less psi.

A diver is ultimately responsible for his own weighting.... Even if you rented the suit, it is better to be overweighted, if you are not sure what to dive with.

I would rather be overweigted by 4 or more lbs, than be underweighted and risk getting the bends or getting hit by a boat.

 

[Mike Newman]

It's not uncommon to find fault with rental equipments. But, just as it did here, a careful function check on issue - followed up by a thorough pre-dive safety check - will usually allow you to avoid major problems. I NEVER dive without a pre-dive check - at best I save embarrassment, at worst, one day it will save my life....

The issue of bad service is one that should be taken up, courteously, with the manager or owner of a dive centre. They will usually go out of their way to help, once they become aware of problems - and they hate being blindsided by an Agency enquiry over an issue they had never heard about.

Weighting for a diver is a very individual thing. The advice in all the sources is given as guidelines. There is NO substitute for a real weight check in the relevant conditions. It is nobody's business, no matter how great their experience, to challenge the weight requested by an individual who has reached their decision about their requirements - after a proper weight check. That said - it's very easy to screw them up. E.G by finning or sculling while conducting the check or by failing to empty the BC completely. One big issue is failing to add weight for air consumed, if your check has been done with a full tank.

Long Quick Reply - but all to say - keep on doing those safety checks - they are vital....!

 

[wreckchick]

The biggest mistake divers make when it comes to weighting is failing to exhale completely. Being overweighted by 4+ pounds is really too much.

Were these guided dives or not?

R

 

[ianw2]

4 pounds of excess lead equates to .064 cubic feet of air to float it. That would be a bubble in the BC of less than 1/2 a gallon.

While I agree that that is too much air to waste on floating 4 pounds of lead that is not needed, it is an easily manageable volume.

It never ceases to amaze me how much some people are interested in the "proper" amount of weight someone ELSE should be carrying. There are so many more variables than "10% of your body weight plus 5".

I happen to be a floater. With nothing on but my swim suit, I float in saltwater with a waterline! Seriously! At 6'2" and 250# (hey - round is a shape), in a 7mm exposure suit with my rig, fins, etc. It takes 30# of lead to maintain depth at 20FSW with 500 PSI in my AL80. With 28#, I can't maintain my safety stop without working at it.

If the person has done a proper weight check and knows how to do the check and how to get below the surface, they are the ones who know how much weight they need.

Why does the subject of other people’s lead amounts come up so often?

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Why not name the dive shop? It does no good to complain if you don't name names.

I also have absolutely refused to provide the amount of lead that a customer has requested. One time, on a boat, I tried to explain to the stupid tourist that he needed much less lead and he wanted over 20 lbs with a 3mm shorty.

I finally went to the bridge and told the capt. that I flat out refused to dive with the guy if he wore the weight belt that he had assembled for himself. In this situation, the capt talked some sense into the guy and we did our dives.

 

[SteveAD]

The very common occurrence of crappy rental gear is why I ALWAYS travel with my own gear.

 

[spectrum]

I find it hard to believe that the shops certifying agency would care about rental QC. Standards violation of the actual training go unchecked all the time. This is an agency non specific comment.

He should have been given the weight he asked for, period. At that stage in his diving he is better off 4 pounds heavy than 2 pounds light. I've carried extra weight for others, above what I need and it's not the end of the world you just need to manage buoyancy with a little more intensity due to the extra bubble volume.. It's not ideal but not a crisis either. If he in fact had any extra at 20 pounds the time to determine this is with an end of dive weight hand-off.

As for the rest of the problems it's a case in point for making the effort to schlep your gear with you and not rely on resort equipment. I don't know if I'd bother with dive travel, domestic or away if I didn't have at least reasonable confidence in using good gear. So far we have always gone with all but cylinders and lead. I bring my own belt with a buckle I know and keepers I want.

Pete