Police Corruption On The East Side

[waynel]

Hey, how's the diving in Coz? My apologizes for stirring up a multicultarl war. I travel ouside of the U.S. in an attempt to avoid anything "ugy". Please...we will be in Cozumel spending thousands of U.S. dollars (20 of us "residents of Los Estados Unidos) and we just want to have a good time. To paraphrase an old movie: "Is it safe?" If yes, then will will be there no matter what "Americans" from any continent may think about us. Let's just dive.

 

[NancyLynn]

And as safe as diving is anywhere - probably safer than many places since they have so much practice with divers of all skill levels.

Many of the dives are multi-level dives, starting at 90 feet then ascending to a shallower depth partway through the dive. Be sure you are comfortable with 90' dives - and with managing multi-level dives. I'm going with a computer this time, since I wasn't really prepared for the latter the last time, and the table based profiles made me nervous.

 

[deeper thoughts]

Usually when I post a comment the thread promptly sinks like a stone.

I used the phrase "Ugly American" to describe folks who were acting in the manner made infamous by the classic book of the same name - guests in another country who were behaving like drunk, beligerant, fools and who expected such behavior to be tolerated. I used the phrase because it instantly conjures up an image of these fools for anyone who has read the book.

It seemed to me that the thread was sliding toward mudslinging about Mexican communities (unsafe, in general, outside of well bounded tourist areas), police in general (corrupt), and Mexican police in particular (even more so). My own experience in Cozumel was quite different. The only ugliness I encountered were these guests in the country whose behavior conformed to the stereotype I invoked.


Just to provoke a bit more thought about why the stereotype still conjures up such vivid images and emotions . . . How many of us go to Cozumel expecting that residents of Cozumel (for example) will speak English to us rather than Spanish (or other of their native languages), will feed us food that suits our U.S. taste buds (read the food reviews of many Cozumel resorts), will provide beds as soft as those we are used to (read the bed reviews of many Cozumel resorts), and will not consider themselves American (look upthread)?

I guess the language and food issue would apply in some parts of South Florida also but reversed

 

[DIvemaster234]

I had a similar incident back in Oct. But did note report it. Thinking whats the use. I guess I was lucky it only cost me 40 bucks.

 

[ggunn]

Do Mexicans refer to themselves as "Americans" do Candadians refer to themselves as "American"?? No they refer to themselves as Mexican and Canadian (or whatever the Spanish translation of Mexican is) We are the United States of America...American! What else should we call ourselves? United Statians??? So the song "Proud to be an American" do you think the song writers meant to include Mexico too? I don't think so. I think it's pretty safe to assume the poster thought the "ugly americans" were people from the U.S.

FWIW, when I went to Peru to work some years ago, I was advised not to refer to myself as "American" as opposed to Peruvian citizens, as they considered everyone in the Americas to be Americans and they were very sensitive about it. We referred to ourselves as "Norteamericanos".

Also FWIW, while I was there I was embarrassed by actions of my countrymen nearly every day.

 

[Fish_Whisperer]

The diving in Cozumel is some of the best in the world. The people are kind, cheerful, unfailingly polite, gracious, and will go out of their way to help you. Tip generously, be gracious and polite in return, pepper your speech with "Muchas gracias," and "por favor," and you will have the most excellent vacation you've ever had in your entire life. In general, Cozumel is a very friendly, laid-back place, and if you behave with a little class and mind your manners, the people are some of the best you will ever meet.

This has been my experience, each of the three times I've been there, and I can't wait to go back.

I was there for Hurricane Wilma in October of '05, at the Casa del Mar. Many of the staff and their families were staying in the hotel, and waiting to eat until the fifteen of us touristas had gone through and gotten our food. (The served us three delicious meals a day, even on the most basic of supplies, and they were going out in the height of the hurricane to bring more supplies from the trashed restaurant.)

We said, "No... That's not going to fly. The staff and families need to get in line with us. We're all in this together."

Those people are like family.

I love, love, love Cozumel and the people of Cozumel.

 

[Christi]

The diving in Cozumel is some of the best in the world. The people are kind, cheerful, unfailingly polite, gracious, and will go out of their way to help you. Tip generously, be gracious and polite in return, pepper your speech with "Muchas gracias," and "por favor," and you will have the most excellent vacation you've ever had in your entire life. In general, Cozumel is a very friendly, laid-back place, and if you behave with a little class and mind your manners, the people are some of the best you will ever meet.

Very well stated in a small little nutshell

 

[DennisS]

FWIW, when I went to Peru to work some years ago, I was advised not to refer to myself as "American" as opposed to Peruvian citizens, as they considered everyone in the Americas to be Americans and they were very sensitive about it. We referred to ourselves as "Norteamericanos".

Also FWIW, while I was there I was embarrassed by actions of my countrymen nearly every day.

I used to travel all over the world on a ship, with a lot of time in south america. I gave up after awhile. I'd introduce myself as being from the United States, I'd always get, "you mean America?".

I'd say it was a toss up between German and American tourists as far as behaviour.

 

[Blitz]

I feel like I can make an informed comment here.

I have spent over half of my life in foreign countries, all over Europe, Asia, Russia, S. America, etc. There is corruption everywhere; in some places it is a little, some places it is a lot. The level of corruption corresponds directly with what the individual thinks he can get away with.

I have seen U.S. soldiers in Germany scream corruption and police brutality at the top of their lungs when a cop took blood from someone that refused to do a breathalyzer. Another time when the officer told him to cease what he was doing (he said 'halt' and 'stop' in plain enough English) the individual thought that he could back talk the officers there like they do in the states. Bad idea. Period.

I have had to bribe a Moscow cop to let me into my hotel building.... the 'regular doorman' was on "holiday for the night".

I have had more Central American police officers give me guff than just about anywhere else.

Lastly, I have been beaten by Boston city cops...... For running my mouth and being-to be polite-a jerk.

My point is that corruption exists. You can fall victim to it anywhere, but there are things that can be done to minimize your exposure to it.

Stay in well known, well traveled areas unless you have some kind of guide, speak the language FLUENTLY or are with some kind of specialized tour.

Be polite. Always. Whether or not you speak the language, have relatives there or whatever your excuse could be for being rude, be polite. It will help you in the long run, you may be getting fleeced but you will be getting fleeced outside of a jail cell.(usually)

Customs and courtesies are different all around the world. Something that is acceptable here isn't necessarily so. I used an example of back talking police earlier; you can get away with that in the U.S. and maybe Canada. Try that in Germany, Brazil or Russia and you may be in for long couple of days.

 

[driftin' by]

Ugh, and just when I thought this thread was making it way to the proverbial bit-bucket, it's back and IT'S ALIVE! :monster: