Which BP/W system to buy?

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fnfalman, I would suggest taking your first technical diving class in doubles before rendering such strong opinions on a subject you obviously know so little about...

Why should I take a technical diving double tank class? I have zero interest in that sort of diving.

Besides, I'm not rendering any strong opinions at all. I simply made the comment that Mr. Hires uses quick adjustable harness for his BCD. From my very limited experience & knowledge in SCUBA, I understand that he is he is some sort of authority on technical diving. I could be very wrong. Perhaps Mr. Hires doesn't know squat about technical double tank diving. Perhaps he needs a lesson from such an auspicious diver such as yourself on technical diving and double-tank handling?:idk:
 
fnfalman, here is another picture that uses your logic.
Richie Kohler in an adjustable harness and using a OMS bungie wing.
I don't exactly subscribe to the good enough for them so good enough for me theory but under similar conditions given proper training and experience I'd like to think I may make similar choices.
 

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I think this thread has gotten sidetracked because of misunderstanding.

Nobody is stating that 'comfort' harnesses or shoulder releases are dangerous.

Nobody is stating that you cannot or should not utilise these configurations if you wanted to.

However, some members of the forum (myself included) who have considerable experience in teaching students how to use this kit... or who are involved in actually designing and manufacturing this equipment... are stating a few facts that aid understanding about the pros and cons of certain configurations.

This contrasts with less experienced divers, who contribute assumptions and estimations to the discussion. Whilst interesting and valued, these are not based on any real evidence or personal experience and, thus, should not be presented as factual, definitive or 'canon'.

To clarify, from my understanding, this is what has been stated factually in this and other threads on the subject:

1) Single-Piece Harness is easy and safe to remove and replace, under any diving conditions, providing that the correct techniques are used (as applies to any scuba skill).

2) Elaborate and expensive designs of harness are not necessary for most divers.

3) Elaborate and expensive designs of harness have drawbacks and risks which don't exist with single-piece harnesses.

4) Divers with manifested physical impairments to the mobility of the upper torso/shoulders may benefit from extra releases in the harness, if they cannot perform the correct techniques due to that impairment.

5) Divers should not seek to compensate for incorrect/sloppy diving technique, by changing their configuration to more elaborate harness designs or adding extra releases. This is a short-cut with very low reward and can lead to a very weak and lazy mindset in the diver.


Some thread contributers have taken to posting random photos of well-known divers using different configurations. This is absolutely pointless, unless they can also contribute why those divers chose those configurations. It proves nothing and adds nothing.

Hope that clears some issues up :)
 
Why should I take a technical diving double tank class? I have zero interest in that sort of diving.

Besides, I'm not rendering any strong opinions at all. I simply made the comment that Mr. Hires uses quick adjustable harness for his BCD. From my very limited experience & knowledge in SCUBA, I understand that he is he is some sort of authority on technical diving. I could be very wrong. Perhaps Mr. Hires doesn't know squat about technical double tank diving. Perhaps he needs a lesson from such an auspicious diver such as yourself on technical diving and double-tank handling?:idk:


He's essentially getting paid to wear a comfort harness. It's basically advertising.


Already a few years of my diving regularly, in different locals and entering the professional ranks as a diver and you keep claiming I have no experience.

I haven't witnessed the aforementioned banter amongst you guys in the past. However, a few years and a title doesn't lend much credibility. I've seen instructors that were horrendous divers and seemed to know just enough to keep the title. Share what you know but don't support it with your title, years of diving or (like most others) number of dives. It doesn't do much in the way of support.

Okay....now y'all can get back to it. :D
 
5) Divers should not seek to compensate for incorrect/sloppy diving technique, by changing their configuration to more elaborate harness designs or adding extra releases. This is a short-cut with very low reward and can lead to a very weak and lazy mindset in the diver.
Is it a slippery slope, Andy, or does the "very weak and lazy mindset" come as soon as I add the quick release? Will it completely negate the strong and energetic mindset that suddenly emerged when I adopted the continuous webbing? :D
 
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Andy
1) The point is that some of us disagree and find the quick release harness to have some advantages to many divers under certain conditions and we find these harnesses just as safe under more ideal conditions.
2) Althought these more eleborate harnesses may not be necessary for many or even most divers many good experienced divers do find them worth the extra cost and use them under many conditions. (the pictures demonstrate that)
3) the reverse can be said and has been posted one piece harnesses have drawbacks and risks that do not exist with quick release harnesses.
4) No arguement here we agree that divers with disabilities do often benefit from these but I'll add that divers without these disabilities do use these harnesses and enjoy diving them. They very rarely end up on craigslist or left in the closet.
5) I'll even agree with this but add that the diver must be the final judge of their needs and what devices allow them to properly mitigate the risks associated with our sport.

I'll add a #6:
6) Divers progress in there knowledge and experience at different rates. Some bring other experiences that do apply to diving while others are just sponges that learn fast and practice often. To put it plainly there are some very good well rounded and knowledgeable divers that are as skilled as divers with many times the number of dives as some of their peers. On the other hand... There are many divers that have logged thousands of dives, even some instructors that simple should be ignored and or avoided.
 
I'm not claiming anything. I'm just a pissant rec diver who don't know a Hog harness from a donut wing.

I simply say that apparently adjustable harnesses are good enough for the likes of Lamar Hires and Jarrod Jablonski to use for their diving, and that anybody who fancies himself or herself to be the superior diver than these two people should contact DR and H to let them know that these two don't know what the heck they're doing when it comes to scuba diving.

You seem to have a viral hatred for anything that remotely resembles DIR or 'tec'. You have your right to your opinion but what brought it on?
 
Okay....so here's a question: What if someone has a one piece webbing with a buckle laced into which, when unbuckled allows an extra couple inches of slack? It's not really a failure point in that if it breaks, the harness is lose but not broken. In fact, it could even be tightened underwater to take out the slack if laced properly.
 
He's essentially getting paid to wear a comfort harness. It's basically advertising.




I haven't witnessed the aforementioned banter amongst you guys in the past. However, a few years and a title doesn't lend much credibility. I've seen instructors that were horrendous divers and seemed to know just enough to keep the title. Share what you know but don't support it with your title, years of diving or (like most others) number of dives. It doesn't do much in the way of support.

Okay....now y'all can get back to it. :D

I agree that they may get paid to use a brand of gear but practicing a sport or making a living at a sport that has inherent risks limits how far your choices will vary for your comfort level. I'm sure he could have just as easily used a one piece harness with the company logo embroidered in the webbing.:D
As for your comment to me I agree and seemed to have addressed that with my prior post before reading yours. My giving any time base was prompted by Andy's suggestion that I have no experience in this thread and dealings with Andy on other threads over the years. (yes, we have a history)
 
Okay....so here's a question: What if someone has a one piece webbing with a buckle laced into which, when unbuckled allows an extra couple inches of slack? It's not really a failure point in that if it breaks, the harness is lose but not broken. In fact, it could even be tightened underwater to take out the slack if laced properly.

Yep, I've seen it done and heard of others doing it.
Like I said each diver must access what works best for them.
But this myth that most other more complicated harnesses get sold on craigslist or left in a closet is just rediculous.:rofl3:
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/

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