LDS vs on-line purchase?

[scjoe]

Why do you want to support a shop charging 20% over MSRP?

 

[jeepchick]

My LDS has always cut me deals, especially when I am buying several things at once. There has never been a time that I have gone in to buy something and they haven't come close to matching another LDS or the internet. One other thing you have to consider is that if you do buy from the LDS, if something goes wrong with that equipment, they are more likely to take care of you with a return or service, where the internet vendors are not always as likely to make it easy to remedy a problem. There is something to be said for that!

 

[DeusVerto]

Last time I bought a new car, I went to the local dealer to do a test drive and decide on options. I then shopped around for best price. Last stop was again the local dealer to see if he could match the best price.

Why should more expensive scuba purchases be any different?

It shouldn't. But at some level, you have to assume that your various "brick and mortar" car dealers will provide comparable levels of service. However, your analogy is a bit of a non-sequitur. The question wasn't about shopping among competing full-service retail dive shops, but a LDS versus an Internet dealer.

 

[redacted]

It shouldn't. But at some level, you have to assume that your various "brick and mortar" car dealers will provide comparable levels of service. However, your analogy is a bit of a non-sequitur. The question wasn't about shopping among competing full-service retail dive shops, but a LDS versus an Internet dealer.

Not really a very clear distinction. Most internet scuba retailers also have a local (brick & mortar) store. Many LDSs also have an internet retail operation even if it is only used gear sold on ebay. LDSs that actually completely shun internet sales are dinosaurs that need to evolve or be left behind by the survivors.

 

[scjoe]

An LDS that is marking up its inventory 20% over MSRP is doing so to gouge those customers that don't haggle over price, otherwise they would offer their goods at a fair price to begin with. 20% over MSRP is probably a violation of their agreement with the manufacturer. Most allow for 10% up or down and cut off people who don't comply. Markups by LDSs over MSRP for readily available goods are not the norm.

As far as equipment problems and returns, internet sites such as LeisurePro, Scubatoys and Scuba.com seem to have as good a rep as the average LDS. These sites have probably been bashed by people on SB, but no more so than the bashing of LDS service.

 

[RU4SKUBA]

If I drive 15 miles to the nearest LDS and their prices are too high I feel zero guilt for buying online after sizing and price checking. Besides, every penny I save on Leisure Pro (and its a LOT) goes directly into diving, so why should I feel even a trivial amount of guilt?

Since the dive shop owners are big boys and girls, and know the consequences of their gouging, they can learn to live with their place in the business community.

 

[CT Sean]

It shouldn't. But at some level, you have to assume that your various "brick and mortar" car dealers will provide comparable levels of service. However, your analogy is a bit of a non-sequitur. The question wasn't about shopping among competing full-service retail dive shops, but a LDS versus an Internet dealer.

A more accurate analogy would be electronic / photography gear. I can buy a Nikon lens for roughly 530.00 at B&H Photo - an online dealer (a very good one) with a B&M (brick n mortar) store in NYC (just like a certain Scuba supplier that some people love to hate). OR I can go to my local photo shop and get it for MSRP of around 630 (not talking places like Best Buy - though they usually charge the same MSRP).

Nowadays, there are plenty of people who wouldn't think twice over ordering electronics online vs. from an independent brick and mortar dealer. I wonder if those same people would decry the purchasing of scuba gear online?

In fact, having spent a fair amount of time browsing photography and home theater forums, I can't recall ever seeing a post discussing whether or not one should buy online vs locally. Whic should not imply that they don't exist, but it's definitely not the weekly occurrence that it is here.

*edit* for clarification I am not talking about buying gray market camera gear - I'm talking about fully warrantied stuff.

 

[DeusVerto]

Not really a very clear distinction. Most internet scuba retailers also have a local (brick & mortar) store. Many LDSs also have an internet retail operation even if it is only used gear sold on ebay. LDSs that actually completely shun internet sales are dinosaurs that need to evolve or be left behind by the survivors.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. The person who learns his craft, has a depth of experience, and offers a full range of services is quite different from some guy who throws out a site with some pics and a price. The two business models are very different, and while some might do both, one does not beget the other.

One example Sports Authority, although you could argue they do not do "full service" of anything like we expect a LDS to do (and don't even sell SCUBA gear really). The retail chain and SportsAuthority.com are NOT even the same company. (the former merely licenses their name to the latter).

My LDS has an indoor pool for testing gear, does trips to the local lake, offers classes, lets me try on things, does air fills, etc. That all costs money. The internet guy has to cover none of that overhead, so sure he CAN sell it cheaper (often they don't actually DO it).

Local dive shops are not ever going to "evolve" into what they are not and do not need to become. Obviously, if you don't see value in what your local dive shop does, then don't buy there. But if you do, and you want them to treat you like a good customer, you have to be one. Dive shop owners are human beings too, and they appreciate loyalty.

That said...I order almost everything I can on-line. Books, appliances, electronics...the list is endless. Why? Best Buy and Walmart add no value whatsoever for me. I have been shopping Amazon since 1996. But again, there is no brick-and-mortar retailer of those items anywhere who can do anything but trade the item I want for my dollars. I don't want their advice, they can't service the product, and they won't let me take the item out of the box much less test it, so there's no point - there's no value add.

Local dive shops are a different species.

 

[CT Sean]

OK one more thought - I wonder how many people post this question less for guidance and more for justification to make the online purchase.

My opinion is, if you want to buy online then do it and don;t feel guilty about it. Just make sure you do your homework and if a manufacturer's warranty is important, that you are buying from an authorized dealer. Also be aware that if/when you need service, there's a chance of running into a petty LDS that refuses to service your gear on the grounds that you didn't buy it from them.

 

[tech3324]

Thanks guys for all the excellent responses to my question. Just to clarify a few points:

The shop in question is not in the Ventura area. Like I said, the shop is "somewhat near me" but not really local.

I do value the services and facilities that a local dive shop offers, and if this item had been available at MSRP it would be in my gear bag now. It's the 20% over that made me hesitate, and I still haven't bought either on line or at this shop.

I'm a little reluctant to bargain on this item just because I don't do it well. Last time I made an offer (not at this shop) the response was "the price is as marked, this isn't a swap meet". Hey, I'm a sensitive guy and that hurt.

Thanks again for the discussion.