Is AOW necessary?

Should Advanced Open water be required?

  • Yes

    Votes: 27 33.3%
  • No

    Votes: 20 24.7%
  • Not if a diver can prove sufficient experience

    Votes: 15 18.5%
  • An ''Evaluation'' type course should be offered that could award the AOW Cert

    Votes: 11 13.6%
  • Other, please explain below

    Votes: 8 9.9%

  • Total voters
    81

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If I had my own dive shop, and was able to teach classes my way, I would teach OW and AOW at the same time. As far as I'm concerned, OW is an introductory course designed to teach you how to breath underwater and to handle some emergencies. This only trains you to dive to depths no greater than 60 ft. OW only focuses on the basics of every skill such as neutral buoyancy and compass navigation. It will take more dives and possibly more instruction to master these skills.

From what I've seen, maybe 20 percent of divers who take OW will still be diving after the first year of certification. That being known, would I still want to waste the time and money to teach the extra classes to someone who will not use it after a couple months???

AOW (from a PADI standpoint) goes on to teach the basics of deep and navigation as well as 3 other specialties of your choosing. It builds on the knowledge and skills you picked up in OW.

I am a believer that every diver should be OW, AOW, and Rescue certified at the very least. Who knows, you may go on your first dive ever after OW certification and have your buddy panic and have an air embolism on the way up. Basic OW training doesn't train you to deal with that. You can build rescue skills in with the OW course, or better yet, train everything there is to know about rescue during the OW course. Now you're looking at additional time spent in the classroom and on dives not to mention the cost necessary for the instructor to make it worth his while.

Times have changed from when people first started getting certified and classes are getting a lot shorter. Now days, courses are set up to build upon each other, so if you skip one step, you won't learn everything on the next step. And these dive operations that require AOW to do some dives, I agree with them 100%!! I don't care if you have 500 dives to 100+ ft, they don't know that for a fact and would require a quick checkout dive to demonstrate your skills. If you want to see a logbook to prove experience... well, I'll show you my true logbook, or the one I'll make up with thousands of dives including decompression dives, trimix, cave, ect. Anybody can fill out a logbook, but for liability purposes, having the AOW card in your name and in your hand is the best way to go.

So YES. I think divers should have AOW.
 
had to...

Peter La Fleur: [after Patches hits Justin in the face with a wrench] Yeah, uh, Patches... are you sure that this is completely necessary?
Patches O'Houlihan: Necessary? Is it necessary for me to drink my own urine?
Peter La Fleur: Probably not.
Patches O'Houlihan: No, but I do it anyway because it's sterile and I like the taste.
Peter La Fleur: ...Okay.
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First I am sorry for your poor experience in your AOW course. It does not have to nor should it be that way... Frankly when I and many of my friends teach the course and I have many many times, I ensure the diver participates in 4 core dives, Night, Deep, Navigation, Drift and one more which we choose together.

Does this difference make them an "advanced" diver, I dont know but it certainly gives them experience and better prepares them for different dive environments.


But to answer the OPs question yes I think it should remain a prerequisite to Rescue and above(including (MSD).
Cheers,
Roger

I am in the middle of my Advanced open water right now. Either I am an incredible, highly evolved mind, or this is one of the biggest "certification" pranks on the planet. I find absolutely no challenge in the educational materials - I can take PADI's tests and pass them with 100% almost every time, without even reviewing their material. I am hoping that the dives are going to require me to do SOMETHING challenging. I actually wanted to become a better diver, and that is why I started the advanced module. I am now understanding why people branch out to other certifying agencies. I work in an industry where paper certs are common, and I watch unqualified people take down corporate enterprise networks every day. However we can fix a network. We probably cannot fix a diver that has been lulled into believing their skills are better than they really are by this advanced class and ends up in a situation that they were not prepared for. I took the Nitrox class in about an hour, and passed it easily without trying. Only new info in that class was the gas calculation which I already had from Wikipedia. Trust me, I am not bragging. I am at best an average diver, and I am no "great mind" I never thought I would say this, but I think I am going to be turning to GUE or a similar agency for future certifications. I understand that they have a much more rigid program. As I progress in diving skills, I am certain I am going to want to take on more challenging dives as my skills improve, and I want to be REALLY ready for it. I don't think Open Water cert should be a barrier to entry into diving, like the Morse Code tests used to be a barrier into Ham radio. (you now no longer have to know morse code to get an operators license) What I take issue with is calling something "advanced" when its really more like a review. Maybe I will feel differently when I get the mandatory dives logged, but I have done all the mandatory dives undocumented already, up down and sideways. Dont get me wrong,I think PADI is a great, friendly place/way to start diving, but beyond their open water cert, I think its a waste. If it took real skill, then yes I think its a great idea. Hopefully I dont offend anyone with this next comment, but my PADI experience so far is making me question all of their upstream certs such as rescue diver, and even Divemaster and Instructor.
 
If I had my own dive shop, and was able to teach classes my way, I would teach OW and AOW at the same time. As far as I'm concerned, OW is an introductory course designed to teach you how to breath underwater and to handle some emergencies. This only trains you to dive to depths no greater than 60 ft. OW only focuses on the basics of every skill such as neutral buoyancy and compass navigation. It will take more dives and possibly more instruction to master these skills.

From what I've seen, maybe 20 percent of divers who take OW will still be diving after the first year of certification. That being known, would I still want to waste the time and money to teach the extra classes to someone who will not use it after a couple months???

AOW (from a PADI standpoint) goes on to teach the basics of deep and navigation as well as 3 other specialties of your choosing. It builds on the knowledge and skills you picked up in OW.

I am a believer that every diver should be OW, AOW, and Rescue certified at the very least. Who knows, you may go on your first dive ever after OW certification and have your buddy panic and have an air embolism on the way up. Basic OW training doesn't train you to deal with that. You can build rescue skills in with the OW course, or better yet, train everything there is to know about rescue during the OW course. Now you're looking at additional time spent in the classroom and on dives not to mention the cost necessary for the instructor to make it worth his while.

Times have changed from when people first started getting certified and classes are getting a lot shorter. Now days, courses are set up to build upon each other, so if you skip one step, you won't learn everything on the next step. And these dive operations that require AOW to do some dives, I agree with them 100%!! I don't care if you have 500 dives to 100+ ft, they don't know that for a fact and would require a quick checkout dive to demonstrate your skills. If you want to see a logbook to prove experience... well, I'll show you my true logbook, or the one I'll make up with thousands of dives including decompression dives, trimix, cave, ect. Anybody can fill out a logbook, but for liability purposes, having the AOW card in your name and in your hand is the best way to go.

So YES. I think divers should have AOW.
I agree with all the things that you feel divers should have, I just don't see that they get any of them from the AOW course as it is now constituted.
 
I agree with all the things that you feel divers should have, I just don't see that they get any of them from the AOW course as it is now constituted.

It's like college,... Something you have to do before you go to grad school or enter the real world but won't teach you much about real work.
In order for most technical instruction one much obtain an advanced status.
At the very least, my aow instructor is now my dive buddy for technical dives.
 
In college I learned a lot about the real work that I did after I got out, more than I learned in Grad School where I mainly added technical skills.
 
In my PADI advanced course I had the choice of the following topics:
Deep Diving
Altitude Diving
AWARE Fish ID
Boat Diving
Deep Diving
Diver Propulsion Vehicle
Drift Diving
Dry Suit Diving
Multilevel and Computer Diving
Night Diving
Peak Performance Buoyancy
Search and Recovery
Underwater Navigation
Underwater Photography
Underwater Videography
Wreck Diving

I had to pick five and I decided on Deep, Peak Performance Buoyance, Night Diving, Wreck Diving, and Underwater Navigation.

So I feel your advanced course can be used in many different directions but I learned about deep, wreck, and night diving.
 
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