Recompression Chamber Under The Boat?

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Sounds like the OP was discussing missed deco stop to me.

I was asking whether a missed deco-stop or safety-stop, while being asymptomatic during the SI, was reason enough to terminate the next planned dive i.e. what are the risks involved?


I recently bought a used dive computer, and when I accessed the log, I found the computer had log a dive where it went into violation mode. Reading the computer manual, I noted that it will enter "conditional violation mode" if a diver ascends above a deco-stop, but if the diver a descends back to the deco stop within 5 minutes, the computer will continue to function without entering the "permanent violation modes". Just as a diver ascends a little bit to relieve Nitro-narcosis, the thought entered my mind, why not try to descend, and spend some time at depth, in order to help avoid "the risk" of DCS. Obviously, they're two different animals, but in my admittedly flawed scenario, the diver is asymptomatic and is only worried about the probability of DCS. I don't expect anyone here to advise a IWR; I just wanted to know if it could be done, and if so, why are they not attempted. If someone were to ask me the same question, some time in the future, I could now make a convincing argument as to why it's a bad idea.
 
I was asking whether a missed deco-stop or safety-stop, while being asymptomatic during the SI, was reason enough to terminate the next planned dive i.e. what are the risks involved?

Deco Stop = Yes. Tables procedures and computer lock-out exist to cover this scenario. Blown deco means 24-48 hours no diving, whilst monitoring for occurrence of DCS symptoms. Doing otherwise would mean that potential late onset of DCS symptoms would allow the diver to consider it safe to get back in the water, severely worsening their situation upon subsequent ascent.

Safety Stop = No. This isn't a mandatory stop, so missing it doesn't present an unacceptable risk of DCS. However, it is up to each individual diver to assess their personal risk factors and balance those against the level of safety and assuredness they wish to apply to their diving regards DCS.

Basically, If you miss a deco stop, you assume you might be bent unless proven otherwise (24-48hrs to confirm).
If you miss a safety stop, you assume you are ok, but make prudent decisions afterwards in case you got unlucky.

...why not try to descend, and spend some time at depth, in order to help avoid "the risk" of DCS....the diver is asymptomatic and is only worried about the probability of DCS....I just wanted to know if it could be done, and if so, why are they not attempted.

Recreational divers generally aren't trained to conduct decompression. They are trained to avoid it. If such a diver failed to avoid that situation in the first place, then it is doubtful that they had the skills and capability to attempt more complex 'missed decompression' procedures.

In addition to concerns over diver skill-set, capability and logistics for conducting missed deco procedures, there are also issues regarding the 'mechanics' of bubble formation that may not be addressed by swift re-descent. Issues such as PFO complicate the matter even further.

Given the low risk presented by marginally over-staying a recreational NDL, there would be few benefits to be gained from enacting a 'missed decompression' procedure. A better option would be to remain out of the water and monitor for symptoms. Immediate hydration can be a critical factor - and this cannot be achieved if the diver remains in the water. If the diver did subsequently present symptoms, they can be more readily diagnosed out of the water and swift treatment provided.

Under such circumstances, it is more beneficial to provide the diver with 100% O2 and hydration at the surface, than for them to re-descend and complete minor deco. However, the same counter-argument exists that such treatment can serve to otherwise mask the presentation of symptoms and delay diagnosis and resolution through appropriate medical care.

Within the auspices of technical diving training, missed and omitted decompression procedures are taught. This is because the levels of saturation are much higher, increasing the likelihood of a far more severe, life threatening, and immediate presentation of DCS. In addition, it is assumed that technical divers completing missed decompression will have access to high % oxygen rich mixtures for that decompression. Note: this is dealing with missed deco, not re-compression as a treatment for presented DCS.

Whilst rapid evacuation and hyperbaric treatment is still the primary goal, technical divers have to ensure their survival within the time-frame to reach that treatment - hence missed/omitted deco procedures. Recreational divers are not likely to encounter the need for such survival measures.
 
Slight hijack, but I remember reading a few years ago about an invention which was basically a collapsible plastic tube that a bent diver could crawl into onsite (with his surface oxygen, if available) and then it would seal up, you put a tank on the attachment and open a valve, and voila - it was pressurised to 3 ATM.

It was marketed as a way to stabilise divers whilst they were being transported from more remote locations to a chamber, but it certainly struck me that putting someone on pure oxygen at an equivalent depth of 20 meters for 45 minutes or so might fully resolve their symptoms before you made it to the chamber.

However, I never come across mention of this invention since. Does anyone know if it is out there? It would be ideal for places like the BVI, where the nearest chamber is a good hour or so boat ride away.
 

Collapsible single occupant chambers have been around at least since the 1960s, though heavier than these. Though they are more desirable than IWR, they still have a lot of limitations compared to a typical 54"+ double-lock. Aside from all the support issues that argue against both, fabric pressure vessels are a pretty serious explosion risk in themselves — not as much from fire/O2 as simple pressure envelope failure. Instead of losing a diver, the vessel and everyone onboard are at risk. It is a difficult problem.

Collapsing Torpedo Chamber.jpg

Single occupant habitats don’t have the explosion risk, but handling and having enough weight to sink them are huge problems. The support problems are many times worse than IWR since it is difficult for a safety diver to help. I don’t want to throw water on any ideas, just help everyone think it all through in case solutions can be stimulated.
 
This got me thinking about habitats. Commercial divers often use a stage lowered by a crane or A-frame handling system that basically has an open-bottom plastic bubble that they can escape to in case of a surface supply failure or conceivably remove their mask or hat and breath. Something like his might be worth considering for an IWR system in remote locations.

Diving-Bell.jpg

You would still need to do the IWR on a mask in the water to prevent the bubble from filling with pure O2 exhalations, but a support diver could stick their head into the air-filled bubble and pull them off the mask in case of O2 induced seizure. Of course you could just yank their hose in and pull them back to the surface on surface-supplied O2 to a mask. Probably impractical but I thought I would throw it out there to see if it sparks a clever ideas.

The basic problem with a submersible habitat is enough weight to make it sink. A 32" diameter x 72" cylinder displaces about 33½ Ft³ or ~2,150 Lbs of water. That means ~2500 Lbs has to be stored onboard and attached to this thing before filling it with air. Cutting that to maybe a third is still a problem, but closer to doable.
 
OMG this thread contains some seriously dangerous suggestions.

Undertaking IWR without training, planning, specalised equipment and teamwork is completley and utterly retarded. Not because some instructor doesn't want noobs doing it. You need to have a proceedure in place, know that everyone can and will do thier job and have the right equipment (oxygen, full face mask, IV fluids, harness, thermal protaction).

IWR is a serious undertaking and unless you like headbutting your knees before drowning it's just not an option for the untrained.

And anyone who thinks that dropping back down on a tank of air or nitrox is going to do them any good is wrong.
 
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Where was anyone in this thread suggesting IWR to the untrained and unprepared? My reading is quite the opposite.

Mine too. I'm thinking that the thread is definitely serving to illustrate the potential complexities and logistical preparations needed before a diver could even contemplate IWR etc
 
OMG this thread contains some seriously dangerous suggestions...

And I believe a number of people have countered any suggestions that may have been construed as dangerous. Perhaps we've missed something. Would you be kind enough to point us to where we slipped up?



Where was anyone in this thread suggesting IWR to the untrained and unprepared? My reading is quite the opposite.

Mine too. I'm thinking that the thread is definitely serving to illustrate the potential complexities and logistical preparations needed before a diver could even contemplate IWR etc


Me too, fellas. In fact, I think you both did a pretty good job of pointing out the folly of anything approaching IWR. Thank you for your input.
 
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