Four dead in Italian cave

[Dive Bug Bit Me]

If I got this right, there are ten untrained divers with a single guide. Contrvening who knows how many standards, the guide takes them two chambers back into a cave with no hope of keeping control of the group if something goes wrong. Heck, even here in Africa that is considered criminal negligence.

Yes the divers should have known better. However, someone who holds himself out to be a diving professional and tour opperator should be expected to have procedures in place that rely on more than dumb luck. He should also be expected to choose the dive sites that are suitable to the client's training. The clients, who may be unfamiliar with the dive sites are paying for his knowledge of the better (safe) places to dive.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I have heard from three of my Italian contacts two had more info and one of those sending me more. His message was the papers are not putting out the full truth. Not surprising. There were also a total of 8 diver deaths in Italy according to my other contact. The four in the cave who were in fact led in a group to the second cave through a smaller passage. The second cave had a great deal of easily disturbed sediment and vis went to zero almost instantly when the entered it. The rest of the deaths they are still sorting out, occurred in different areas, and one looks like a cardiac event on the surface after a dive.

But again these four were divers being led by a guide into an overhead environment. Four divers not trained for any type of overhead. Please think about that before allowing yourself to be led by someone you really do not know into somewhere you have never been.
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[UnderSeaBumbleBee]

Thanks for the update Jim. So were the other 4 deaths part of this same group that died at a later time or other dives not related to this cave dive?

 

[Sunny2012]

I have heard from three of my Italian contacts two had more info and one of those sending me more. His message was the papers are not putting out the full truth. Not surprising. There were also a total of 8 diver deaths in Italy according to my other contact. The four in the cave who were in fact led in a group to the second cave through a smaller passage. The second cave had a great deal of easily disturbed sediment and vis went to zero almost instantly when the entered it. The rest of the deaths they are still sorting out, occurred in different areas, and one looks like a cardiac event on the surface after a dive.

But again these four were divers being led by a guide into an overhead environment. Four divers not trained for any type of overhead. Please think about that before allowing yourself to be led by someone you really do not know into somewhere you have never been.
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Very sad news, I feel for the families. After recently watching "Sanctum" the thrilling extreme cave diving movie Sanctum (2011) - IMDb by James Cameron, I will stick with simple swim throughs and such and leave the caves to others searching for the edge.

 

[DandyDon]

I have heard from three of my Italian contacts two had more info and one of those sending me more. His message was the papers are not putting out the full truth. Not surprising. There were also a total of 8 diver deaths in Italy according to my other contact. The four in the cave who were in fact led in a group to the second cave through a smaller passage. The second cave had a great deal of easily disturbed sediment and vis went to zero almost instantly when the entered it. The rest of the deaths they are still sorting out, occurred in different areas, and one looks like a cardiac event on the surface after a dive.

But again these four were divers being led by a guide into an overhead environment. Four divers not trained for any type of overhead. Please think about that before allowing yourself to be led by someone you really do not know into somewhere you have never been.
Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

Thanks for the update Jim. So were the other 4 deaths part of this same group that died at a later time or other dives not related to this cave dive?

I think Jim said "four in the cave" and "rest of the deaths they are still sorting out, occurred in different areas, and one looks like a cardiac event on the surface" - the last one maybe being this one: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/425345-one-dead-one-injured-capri.html I came across that last one only because it was linked in one of the stories on the cave accident. I suspect many of the accidents in that country do not make US news listings so we don't see them unless otherwise linked or listed.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Very true Don and thanks for pointing out that the others were not related. And yes it is true that we do not hear of a lot of things that go on over there. One reason I keep up with my friends over there to stay abreast of this stuff and can usually find out better info. Often takes a few rounds with translation to get it right but my Italian is getting a little better while their English is improving.

 

[UnderSeaBumbleBee]

Thanks for the clarification. I just wanted to make sure that I did not misunderstand what you posted.

 

[mdax]

Good lesson for those alive to read it. Don't EVER trust a dive master/guide to take you into overhead environments you are not trained and equipped for. Many cave divers hate that these activities continue, however the certification agencies do little to stop them. Think for yourself!

 

[usmarinekurt]

Ouch

Knowing ones limits can get obscured when fun and ego mix together.
DM and the divers made poor decisions and learned a lesson the hard way
id like to think I would have used better judgement but who really knows what one will do until it is actually happening

 

[fdog]

This recent thread: Chandelier Cave - safe for AOW diver? may be instructive in light of this incident. It certainly raises some salient points on both sides of the coin.


All the best, James