Smoking on a dive boat

[Tigerman]

I agree that intoxication and diving would be a completely unacceptable combination. Atleast the kind thats not caused by breathing compressed gas..

When it comes to breathing gases, thats not even remotely compareable to smoking cigarettes. Wrong concentrations of the various gases and/or pollutants can kill you almost instantly - smoking will NOT and most likely even wont in the long run..
If smoke killed as efficiently as some people like to claim there wouldnt be a single grandparent left in the world..

 

[fred3798]

In these days of advocating for our rights, we have lost the ability to tolerate our neighbours. Lots of things in society interfere with my enjoyment of the right to do what I want to do when I want to do it. Some things done by others may even be bad for me or expose me to risks. We have tort laws to ensure compensation when we actually suffer injury. But my goodness we have become a thin skinned intolerant bunch who demand personal enjoyment regardless of the affect on others' rights to enjoy their lives. I don't smoke any more. But the notion of always requiring others to provide me with a smoke free environment is too selfish for me. I tolerate car and bus exhaust, noise, construction and all manor of inconvenience that are part of living together in society. Relax and be prepared to be inconvenienced a bit for others. You'll live longer and happier with less stress and aggravation which are far greater risks than some second hand smoke.

 

[gcarter]

And would be completely inappropriate on a dive boat!

Second hand tobacco smoke makes me nauseous. It has the same effect on several people I dive with. I don't think it's too much to ask that people don't make me physically ill when I go diving. Smokers can get their fix with gum, patches, and other aids. They don't have to light up.

It's a strange dichotomy I see in divers who are smokers - anal about the quality of their gas but expose themselves and others to the products of incomplete combustion from smoking (a mini compressor flash in every puff). One would think that the logic that drives them to be concerned about the gas they dive would bleed over to a concern about the toxins in the tobacco smoke.

The reality is that the more you expose yourself to something dangerous without suffering consequences (and potential consequences years in the future don't count for this purpose) the easier it is to minimize those consequences. Sorta like doing trust me dives of whatever sort, escaping unscathed, then thinking additional training isn't really required after all.

I have been on dive boats with women who have bathed in perfume before leaving the hose. I find it just as if not more offensive - while acknowledging your issue with smoke, it does not bother me as the strong smell of perfume probably doesn't bother you. The issue that caused me to post in this thread is the belief of some that there is nothing more offensive than the smell of tobacco smoke, that it is universally reviled, and that there is no comparative. Neither statement is true.

What IS true (IMO) is that many smokers could do a better job of being considerate of non-smokers, and that non-smokers could equally do a better job of allowing reasonable accommodation INCLUDING checking the status of an op as part of the selection process. Vote with your wallet.

 

[TMHeimer]

Agree with the last two posts. Must be us compromising Canucks.

 

[Santa]

I think smoking on a boat is bloody annoying, it adds to all the other things that might make you queasy, and I honestly find even the smell of farts more agreeable.

Anyway my favourite dive haunts are remote places in Asia, and sometimes Egypt, and while there seem to be a general unspoken agreement not to smoke while kitting up, usually the rest of the boat is fair game and somehow its up to us customers to negotiate what is reasonable.

Im fairly sick of the misconception that just because were outside, smoke somehow does not bother and just rise magically straight up into the air and evaporates - as most streets, stations - and dive boats effectively are or form wind tunnels causing smoke to drift along.

Im 41 and have been quietly but intensely bothered by smoking since I was a child, and never raised a single complaint although the smoke made me sick to my stomach in cars, busses, trains, at meetings, at work, in pubs, at parties and in other peoples homes, on my clothes and in the hair and on the lips of girls. Its not even mainly a health issue with me, and certainly not a moral one, I just really, really dislike the smell. The change that I guess started in America and has largely spread to Europe has been such a relief and the few times I run into a smoky pub these days makes me wonder how I ever survived, but I guess my desire to meet girls was just stronger than my distaste, back then ;o)

However the change not seem to have really spread to more remote parts of the world where the majority seems to smoke if they can afford it, and that culture seems to spread the dive boats and get taken up by western customers happy to find a smokers last sanctuary on the edge of the world. Im hoping that will change. I sympathize with the smokers problem, but I also feel like I've more than paid my dues on that score by now, and paying for diving and accommodation I REALLY could do without smoke.

 

[dfx]

You know, to be 100% honest, I would say that if I happen to pass someone on the street out here in rural Nova Scotia while I am smoking my pipe, I estimate there is probably a 30-40% chance they will say "Gee, I LOVE the smell of a pipe". The only thing that proves is that you are completely wrong in saying "Nobody likes the smell of smoke!" Perhaps cigarette or cigar smoke only? I can't comment on that.

I was talking about cigarette smoke, yes. I find cigar smoke slightly less annoying, but not a lot. Pipe smoke can be pleasant if present in moderation and for a short while, but I still wouldn't want anyone blowing pipe smoke in my face. I would definitely not ask anyone to start smoking pipe because I like the smell, I would not move closer to anyone smoking pipe because I like the smell, etc. Hardly anyone would, I'd say. Can you imagine anyone saying something like "look, there's somebody smoking pipe over there, let's go over there so we can smell it better"? I can't. Other than some stupid kids, maybe. Probably those who start smoking later on. Yes, I'm exaggerating now as well.

I didn't mean to "pipe" in here, but when you mentioned perfume that's just a magic word for me. It wasn't that perfumes "weren't good for me" back then, or that I simply didn't like the smell. In fact, I rather liked the smell--in winter, when ragweed was gone and so were all of my allergies to EVERYTHING --even my own SPIT (not kidding). But perfume put me into allergy misery for hours if it were mid June to Sept. But also, I realized I was in a very tiny minority of people affected severely and immediately from these smells--and from smoke, etc. We have to differentiate between situations like these and what annoys smokers and non-smokers about each other. People CHOOSE to wear perfume, and they choose to smoke. I maintain that smoke on a dive boat will not severly affect a majority of people. The small minority (like me), will, and have on the old thread, swear up & down that I am mistaken. It will annoy quite a few, and as we have read, a fair number said it's not that big a deal (unless it's a liveaboard).

We're not talking about "severely affecting". It stinks. It's annoying. It's annoying to pretty much everybody who doesn't also smoke. In fact I've even heard some smokers say that they don't really like the smell of other people smoking. Some people may not mind much, but you can be sure they'd like it better if there weren't people smoking around. How can you even begin to compare this to perfume? That's not even like apples and oranges, those have at least some things in common, they're both fruit, round, edible and taste sweet. Comparing smoking to perfume is more like comparing apples to cruise ships.

As discussed, one can always not go on a boat that allows smoking anyway.

And then go where instead? On a non-smoking boat? I haven't seen one yet, have you? Do you know why non-smoking laws have been pushed out and enforced for bars and restaurants and such? Because without them, there wouldn't be any of them around which didn't allow smoking. Non-smokers would have the choice of either putting up with the stench, or staying home. Those are not good options.

“If you don't like the smell of campfires, then you really shouldn't go camping.”

It is hypocritical to complain of cigarette smoke while unnecessarily burning wood, creating smoke for no good reason.

Ehm, no? People aren't complaining about smoke per se, they're complaining about cigarette smoke. What's really hypocritical is that they still allow smoking while on your lot (if that's true, haven't checked it). Either ban it completely, or don't at all. A smoker's corner in any area is like a pisser's corner in a swimming pool...

And last I checked, marijuana is very much used for personal pleasure. It is smoked. It is thought by many to be at least equally unpleasant a smell as tobacco smoke.

Yeeees, aaaand....?

 

[Tigerman]

...
We're not talking about "severely affecting". It stinks. It's annoying. It's annoying to pretty much everybody who doesn't also smoke. In fact I've even heard some smokers say that they don't really like the smell of other people smoking. Some people may not mind much, but you can be sure they'd like it better if there weren't people smoking around. How can you even begin to compare this to perfume? That's not even like apples and oranges, those have at least some things in common, they're both fruit, round, edible and taste sweet. Comparing smoking to perfume is more like comparing apples to cruise ships.
...

No, cigarette smoke is annoying to you because you LET IT be annoying to you. Most people are actually fully capable of ignoring it..
Apples and oranges might be fruits, cigarette smoke and perfumes are scents. Cruise ships is a mode of transportation, so if you want to bring that in youll have to talk about the SMELL of cruise ships...

 

[boulderjohn]

No, cigarette smoke is annoying to you because you LET IT be annoying to you. Most people are actually fully capable of ignoring it..
Apples and oranges might be fruits, cigarette smoke and perfumes are scents. Cruise ships is a mode of transportation, so if you want to bring that in youll have to talk about the SMELL of cruise ships...

I'm not sure I get your point. Are you saying that all scents and aromas have been identified as being carcinogenic?

 

[261311]

In the defense of dfx, I really think an example of going camping and crying about burning wood is mute. You go camping and expect burning wood because that's half the fun. I actually count that as one of the parts of camping, having nice fires with friends. Being untreated it isn't poisonous and sometimes, pending the type of wood can actually smell nice if you're not directly down wind. However, burning garbage and weeds/ gardening stuff is equally inconsiderate. My dad does this all the time and I always end up feeling like I want to hit him because I have to close even my own windows on a nice day.

Weed, perfume and other products are kind of a different story here since it's not the "topic" at hand but are also great examples of things I may not like the smell of (specifically perfume [I can't stand when people re-apply and shower in the stuff]). I find walking past apartment buildings at night or x area that has weed tokers to fundamentally suck. I'd rather deal with a lot of smells with a brighter smile than that, especially if those in question, like what seems to be popular where I live, smoke Kush. If I wanted to light a skunks ass on fire, I'd do so and probably have a bit more fun. It also travels a lot further, it's a potent smell. However, that aside.

Might be something to keep in mind that in the free open world, having someone smoke outside a store isn't a huge deal. It sucks, yes, but be a bit more situational and try and meet them halfway. I hold my breath and walk right past them, little inconvenience to me and they're trying to do their part by keeping it to one area. Enclosed smoking in tight spaces are probably counted as the issue imo. There has to be some point where the non-smokers realize that those we're "battling", especially in Canada (since we're all here now eh) have already had their habits pounded into the ground by laws. They can't smoke anywhere but at home and outside, and some places such as rental establishments may not allow smoking. We don't need to repeatedly force feed information about how cancerous, nasty or gross a smokers habits are. Talk to a bunch of smokers, little think the enjoyment they get from it is life changing, many want to quit. There's a good portion who don't even smoke in their homes because they don't like the smell. So, while they're on their path to helping themselves out, we could get off their shoulders and make the already stressful part of quitting just a tad easier. They're not going to do it for us, any smoker will reinforce that. They do it for them and those they love.

 

[nimoh]

No, cigarette smoke is annoying to you because you LET IT be annoying to you. Most people are actually fully capable of ignoring it..

many people are allergic to cigarette smoke making it much more than an annoyance.

I don't smoke, so avoiding smoking on a liveaboard is not an issue for me, but if I were on a liveaboard with a fellow passenger that was allergic to peanuts, I would probably avoid eating peanuts, but if that passenger thought it wouldn't be an issue eating them on the stern, I might have a few.