Halycon Eclipse BPW a good buy at ~$700?

[mblazer]

As a relatively new convert to a BP/W, I am routinely amazed by the level of sniping that crops up every time someone asks for a recommendation or comments on a particular brand. HOG does seem to generate more of that sort of thing than others. I certainly understand brand loyalty, but the foaming at the mouth does get absurd. For those who seem to have that impulsive need, all I can say is: Psyco - Lighten up Francis - YouTube

Anyway, I did a lot of research, and looked at several different brands, before I decided on a DSS rig. I now own two - an SS plate (with integrated weights) and 35 pound wing for single tank drysuit diving and a kydex plate with a 17 pound wing for warm water travel diving. I'm soon heading into doubles, and bought a DSS 49 pound wing for that (so technically I now have 3 setups). I bought the first one because, as I mentioned on another post a while back, when I called to ask questions, Tobin, the owner of the company, spent a good 20 minutes on the phone with me making absolutely sure that he understood my needs and I understood his recommendation. That sort of personal, one-on-one customer service is virtually non-existent in our country today - whether it's dive gear, golf clubs or camera equipment. There is a lot of really good gear out there, and it is often comparable in terms of build, quality and function. My personal buying choices will always come down to service -- and while my experience with BP/Ws is admittedly limited (I do not own either Halcyon or HOG gear), I have rarely seen the kind of service DSS provides in any industry. That's all I need to know.

 

[chrpai]

There are also several people here with an impulsive need to attack everytime they see the word Hog.

The funny thing is both sides likely share 95%-99% of the same train of thought. If PullMyFinger and I were on the same boat we'd probably be equipped virtually identical with the exception of a few trademarks here and there. In the water we probably dive exactly the same way.

 

[mblazer]

There are also several people here with an impulsive need to attack everytime they see the word Hog.

The funny thing is both sides likely share 95%-99% of the same train of thought. If PullMyFinger and I were on the same boat we'd probably be equipped virtually identical with the exception of a few trademarks here and there. In the water we probably dive exactly the same way.

Not funny - maybe ironic. But either way, this impulsive silliness, whether in defense or in support, always detracts from the question posted by the OP. I come on here to learn, and sometimes even to provide a few answers or share an experience. I don't come on here to read cock fights. After 5 pages of this one, I wouldn't blame the OP if he thought this was a waste of his time.

 

[Locus]

Not funny - maybe ironic. But either way, this impulsive silliness, whether in defense or in support, always detracts from the question posted by the OP. I come on here to learn, and sometimes even to provide a few answers or share an experience. I don't come on here to read cock fights. After 5 pages of this one, I wouldn't blame the OP if he thought this was a waste of his time.

Quite the contrary. I belong to forums for a few of my other hobbies and I'm accustomed to the inevitable flare-ups like this one (though maybe not quite so intense as this, but diving is a passionate hobby after all). Often there is a lot to be learned reading between the lines of brand loyalty and sore feelings. Sometimes, especially in such a detail-oriented sport, it's easy to get lost focusing on the little things like brands, but I'm sure everyone in this thread is conscious that there's a lot more that unites us than divides us, which is why we all post here in the first place.

...Anyway...

The 40lbs wing on that setup is likely overkill for me, so I wouldn't consider paying nearly the asking price. Would it be worth it to lowball, or should I just pass it over? The weight pouches on this Halcyon aren't a selling point for me either, due to this:

On a dive yesterday my girlfriend (a new diver) was at 45' when she lost a 10lbs integrated weight pouch from her jacket bcd without realizing it. She had a major struggle to stay down, which she thought was just due to a newbie buoyancy control issue. She didn't realize until after she had aborted the dive and gotten back on shore that the weight pouch was missing. I've read about this happening before, and it has really turned me off the idea of having integrated ditchable weights. I think I would rather have the bulk of my weight integrated in my bpw and wear a belt with 10-15 lbs that I can ditch in an emergency.

 

[aorr]

From the Halcyon weight integrated pockets that I've seen, there is zero chance of them coming out. They're buckled in there and you'll have to deliberately release the buckles to ditch the weight.

-Andy

 

[Dr. Lecter]

If you don't need it, don't settle for it -- even if it saves you $100 or so now, it's not a good deal if you're pushing an oversized wing through the water every dive when you don't have to.

I'd look at a DSS or a used H plate (DSS seems to have some neat innovations and I've heard nothing but good stuff about quality/finish, but it's hard to beat the quality of a H plate), in whatever material suits your diving (for single tank, probably steel -- AL is really more for doubles that are already heavy as Hell).

As an added benefit for what you said you like the idea of, the DSS plates let you bolt weights directly to the plate, meaning you can move more ballast onto the plate without the added distance between you and the tank that a weighted STA would cause.

From the Halcyon weight integrated pockets that I've seen, there is zero chance of them coming out. They're buckled in there and you'll have to deliberately release the buckles to ditch the weight.

Sorta true. The buckle doesn't fully cover the mouth of the pocket; one end is attached to the weight pouch and the other buckles the pouch into the pocket. There's zero chance of you losing one, to be sure, but falling out of the pocket and dangling below you in an annoying manner was for many years a feature of the H pockets. The current version (weight pocket is vertical, perpendicular to the waist belt) is much less prone to it than the older versions (weight pockets are horizontal, parallel to the waist belt), but they still do it on occasion.

 

[ams511]

If you don't need it, don't settle for it -- even if it saves you $100 or so now, it's not a good deal if you're pushing an oversized wing through the water every dive when you don't have to.

I agree with the but don't cut the buoyancy close if you are on the boarder line go a size higher.

I'd look at a DSS or a used H plate (DSS seems to have some neat innovations and I've heard nothing but good stuff about quality/finish, but it's hard to beat the quality of a H plate), in whatever material suits your diving (for single tank, probably steel -- AL is really more for doubles that are already heavy as Hell).

The H plate has a very nice finish but I am uncertain if it is worth the price charged. If you can buy a blem or a lightly used plate go for it. A HOG plate could be rough but a file can smooth the edges and you can add a sleeve to the webbing to reduce any chaffing.

As an added benefit for what you said you like the idea of, the DSS plates let you bolt weights directly to the plate, meaning you can move more ballast onto the plate without the added distance between you and the tank that a weighted STA would cause.

Only the steel plates allow this, not the kydex plates.

 

[buddhasummer]

Quite the contrary. I belong to forums for a few of my other hobbies and I'm accustomed to the inevitable flare-ups like this one (though maybe not quite so intense as this, but diving is a passionate hobby after all). Often there is a lot to be learned reading between the lines of brand loyalty and sore feelings. Sometimes, especially in such a detail-oriented sport, it's easy to get lost focusing on the little things like brands, but I'm sure everyone in this thread is conscious that there's a lot more that unites us than divides us, which is why we all post here in the first place.

...Anyway...

The 40lbs wing on that setup is likely overkill for me, so I wouldn't consider paying nearly the asking price. Would it be worth it to lowball, or should I just pass it over? The weight pouches on this Halcyon aren't a selling point for me either, due to this:

On a dive yesterday my girlfriend (a new diver) was at 45' when she lost a 10lbs integrated weight pouch from her jacket bcd without realizing it. She had a major struggle to stay down, which she thought was just due to a newbie buoyancy control issue. She didn't realize until after she had aborted the dive and gotten back on shore that the weight pouch was missing. I've read about this happening before, and it has really turned me off the idea of having integrated ditchable weights. I think I would rather have the bulk of my weight integrated in my bpw and wear a belt with 10-15 lbs that I can ditch in an emergency.

I'm a big fan of splitting my weights, with steel plate I wear 3kg, ditchable, on a belt and 1kg, non ditchable, on top tank cam band. If wearing a canister 2kg on weight belt. Enough to ditch in an emergency but enough on my rig not to make me suddenly super buoyant. I think having all your weight in one place is a recipe for potential trouble particularly if its non ditchable YMMV.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

I don't think a new H plate is worth the $200+ they want for it, but I'm happy to buy them used for $75-100 or so.

 

[buddhasummer]

Agree.

Anyway all plates start to look pretty ratty if dived enough H or not. I have no problem filing down sharp holes/slots if required. I've owned 6 different plates and have had to take a file to 4 of them.