Hold on Wait a Minute

[TSandM]

I'm of two minds about this. On the one hand, if a diver buys gear before he or she knows much about the diving they'll be doing, they may buy the wrong things and have to replace them. And shops often do have a tendency to steer people toward the gear with the highest profit margin, and not the gear that actually works the best for their particular diving application.

On the other hand, I bought all my gear immediately upon finishing my OW class, and what that did was permit me to dive -- a LOT -- right away. Being able to get in the water frequently both helped with my utter lack of talent in the sport, cemented my interest in Puget Sound marine life, and brought me the mentor who is largely responsible for me continuing to dive. If I had had to rent gear for every trip out, I would have done far fewer of them, and I suspect in a short time, I would have tired of both the expense and the annoyance of having to get gear and return it.

So, if the diver is not unhappy with the idea that the gear he buys initially may well be replaced, it may not be a bad idea to acquire equipment that allows more frequent diving. But a bit of research -- and this is one of the things ScubaBoard is best at -- will help avoid the very high ticket, low additional value choices.

 

[Steve_C]

With gear including tanks, if somebody wants to go diving, we go. Later when convenient I drop tanks off at LDS for a refill. Very little hassle.

Without gear. There is trip to shop to get gear. Trip back to shop. These have to be done within a day of the dive. Costs money. Costs a lot of time and trips to the shop and inconvenience.

I dove a lot more early on having my own gear. I am also within 30 minutes of a quarry so some of this diving is literally on 5 minutes notice.

I also like to own everything that connects my lungs to my air supply and also the computer. Even when traveling and just doing a dive or two on a business trip, I bring my own regs, computer, mask, beanie and camera.

 

[tracydr]

We offer classes with students renting from a local shop. We don't sell gear and we don't do many classes, especially since my husband is currently doing his P.h.D. I would like to know, though, when fins became part of personal gear? I didn't have to purchase anything when I took my class in 1995. I ended up buying a bunch of used gear after my class, from an Army person, up at Ft.Lewis. I rented from the Ft.Lewis shop for awhile, except for my mask, though.
I would have loved to have purchased a drysuit while I was up in WA but I was a poor intern and new to the Army so I didn't have much money. Life would have been much different with a drysuit, although I only got a couple of days off a month, anyhow.

 

[GDI]

Good point

Nice post GDI. I would like to expand on one item...



I would like to add to this. If your body type is outside of the norm, then you might be better served expanding your basic purchases since rental gear may not fit you properly. More to the point, buying a wetsuit that you know fits will make your trip and diving more enjoyable.

I am 6' 9" tall and skinny. Not all rental gear is the same. A friend of mine is average height, but he was a competitive bodybuilder. Rental wetsuits did not fit him. So if you fall outside the "norm" there might be some other purchases that would benefit you.

---------- Post added September 13th, 2013 at 08:21 PM ----------

A couple of the things the OP says seem obvious--things any non diver should logically know. On the other hand oh, OTOH--I'm learning), I wouldn't have bought that new steel 120 tank during OW class had I known about walking any distance or negotiating seaweedy rocks with that thing on my back.

Here is a point I just thought of reading your post. As tech Instructor I often have people arrive for training with equipment that is "questionable" to the objective of the class (example deco or cave diving) I "recommend" improvements they should consider, I tell them they can listen to my recommendation or to what the environment tells them.

At times if their equipment is way out of wack for the training I provide them equipment suitable for the class which often leads them into the right direction of what to buy. ( I try to cover this issue before they show up but sometimes it takes seeing things for real before the message gets through). I do not force brand names but rather recommend equipment characteristics and feature considerations, local markets may not favour specific types, but then there is the internet (??)

 

[tenacious]

I think there are a few ways to look at this. I have never been scuba diving, however I have ordered pretty much all my gear already. I was told by many people not to buy anything, rent first etc. I am sure that is great advice for 95% of people, but I don't believe I fall into that category.

I am a firm believer that everything in life is a hustle. I can walk into 1000 dive shops and hear how I should buy what they are selling, but how am I (a brand new diver) able to differentiate between what i should actually buy and what just made the store a few more dollars? I have found that the most honest opinions come from those not trying to sell you anything. I researched brands, reputations, limitations,etc, and spoke with divers with nothing to gain one way or the other to get their recommendations before I bought anything.

I am in the process now of "interviewing" potential instructors to get me certified. I fully intend on getting certified with my own gear, not rentals. Some have hinted that this is not the norm, and may be frowned upon. I will simply refuse the services of any instructor not willing to train me on my gear. To me, I am paying for the experience and knowledge that the instructor has to properly teach me how to dive safely. I can waste 2 hours learning how to operate and adjust a rental BCD and regulator that I will never see again, or i can invest that time into the actual BCD and regulator that I will be diving with hopefully for many years. I think it will be better to get questions, concerns, adjustments, etc. hatched out in the presence of an expert who's time I am paying for, rather than figuring it out on my own. I see this as beneficial for myself as well as the instructor, I am not seeking a discounted certification fee since I am bringing my own gear. so I learn and get familiar with my gear, and they get paid a rental fee but don't have to rent me anything.

I have joined this board and a few other local dive groups in the area I am moving to and have gained a ton more knowledge than I had coming into this. Right now I firmly believe I made the best choice for me personally. It very well could be the opposite for some or most people. I doubt I will get everything spot on perfect, but I would think that almost nobody does.

 

[TMHeimer]

tenacious, Looks like you have a good approach. I wouldn't worry too much about using a shop BCD for the course. I had no trouble figuring out the minor differences from that and the one I bought. And I'm the furthest thing from being mechanical. For the most part, they all have the same function--air in or out. The differences are straps, D rings, weight pocket set up, LPI design, etc. Not rocket science.

 

[tenacious]

thanks TM, I bought a BP&W setup so that's kind of why I want to use it instead of the rental jacket. I talked to a dive instructor tonight and he said that he doesn't have a problem training me in my own gear, so that is encouraging!

 

[tdtaylor]

After my first pool dive, my daughter and I bought a large amount of our equipment beyond that required for the class. Wetsuit, regs, BC, hoods. I should first state my daughter is studying Marine Biology, so most likely she will continue to dive, and our thinking was she should have her own set of equipment.

It made the classes more satisfying diving with our own equipment (this may have been more mental), and as TS&M mentioned it meant that after finishing the course we dove quite frequently thereafter. The shop we dove with (disclosure- as of tomorrow I will be a Dive Con with them) carries good, solid equipment at a good price. We were not pushed in to buying any particular equipment, and at the time, it was suggested we might think about waiting. We were shown the advantages and weaknesses of several types of each equipment, what would work best with the type of diving we would be doing, etc.

3 out of 4 times, I dive the equipment I originally bought and love it. My daughter, in two years, has about 85 dives on her rig and is very satisfied. Now I will say, partaking in both warm and cold diving, heavily involved in UW photography, and traveling a lot, my equipment has expanded quite a bit to additional reg, ponys, drysuit, etc., but my core group of original equipment is still with me and going strong.

As to my disclosure- now being on the staff of this LDS as a DiveCon, it has been made clear the philosophy of when and how to sell the the customer. The way I was treated is exactly how the Owner expects us to treat the customer. The customer who is unsure is allowed to try the equipment in the pool. And the Owner will spend a lot of time making sure the customer understands their equipment. Unfortunately, I am acutely aware that not all shops in the area act in this way. Before I committed to this shop, I actually visited about 6 shops, making small purchases, doing the usual shoot the breeze, so I do have a feel for their philosophies.

All this said, the problem is the new diver typically does not have the knowledge to decide if they are with a good LDS or not. In my case I have 5 or 6 to choose from, and other new divers may have one to choose from. With this line of thinking, I would urge waiting at least until the end of OW Certification, so you can learn whether you are compatible with the shop. In my case, I think I was much more lucky than good

Terry

 

[TMHeimer]

tdtaylor, Excellent point that your daughter would most likely continue. Aside from studying Marine Biology, there are those who have been water bugs for years. In this case, the decision should be what to buy, not if to buy right away. In my case, I wanted to wait until I did one pool session to see if I had any ear problems, then I bought.

 

[yarik83]

As someone who bought my "dive package + OW + Nitrox" when I got certified in 2007 I will generally agree with the statement that buying personal gear should be left in hands of the diver but unfortunately any newbie is walking into a dive shop looking like deer in the headlights so it is very easy for LDS to push virtually anything on them. It is not just that they push (and usually have a 25-50% markup thing going too) but they also do so through deceptive tactics.

This is exact word for word sales pitch as I remember it of a LDS in the florida keys when I was getting my air filled there:

"...and you know since you are down under water, how cool would it be to take pictures or videos of what you see? We have this cool mask that can let you do that. All you do is just press this button here...."

By some sheer miracle people from that group were also staying in my hotel which was quite a bit away on another island in the keys so I got to hear the end of that conversation.

Customer was sold a mask without dry fitting it. Needless to say mask did not fit well and customer did not find out until under water. To add insult to injury the camera in that mask was a crapy-o-la camera and all of his photos came out either blury or sideways or too exposed or under exposed... and tiny sd capacity card that was sold with the camera filled up after about 5 minutes so ... there goes... all that vacation footage they were "pitched". And that is the thing. LDS failed to deliver training on the camera or helping to choose the right mask for the face or educating people that photography is something that should be left for divers with more experience... certainly not during their open water course.

But back to the price of gear. I have been to a lot of dive shops over the years and 9/10 times anything privately owned has a 25-50% markup price. About half the time gear sold is out of date by about 3 or 4 generations. Most importantly I have actually seen LDS turn away customers that came to get certified with someone else's gear (ie friend's).

Have I had to do this all over again I would have still picked my exact gear setup. As a matter of fact that is exactly what I have done. I have 2 virtually identical scuba setups with same everything.