oxygen narcosis

[nimoh]

I don't understand what Tech vs Rec has to do with this? Just because you're wearing split fins doesn't mean you're less likely to die of exposure. I know this is in the "Basic" forum....but the point is the same. The OP asked about oxygen toxicity/narcosis as if they were the same thing and didn't clarify. A small discussion broke out involving the fact that since O2 is toxic WELL before narcotic pressures, the point is moot. This is fairly true in a recreational/basic forum. My point was simply expanding on something.

However, what has NOT been discussed is what the OP actually meant or why they are asking. In the world of trimix diving, O2's narcotic properties are VERY important. In the "Basic Scuba" forum, they're not. What I've been trying to establish is what the OP meant. The question showed CLEAR lack of an understanding of the basic concepts/jargon of oxygen toxicity and narcosis.....so what does op MEAN and what is op ASKING?

I think what the OP was asking is that how is it possible to suffer from oxygen narcosis when you can't breathe oxygen at high enough partial pressures to experience oxygen narcosis.

 

[mala]

I don't understand what Tech vs Rec has to do with this? Just because you're wearing split fins doesn't mean you're less likely to die of exposure. I know this is in the "Basic" forum....but the point is the same. The OP asked about oxygen toxicity/narcosis as if they were the same thing and didn't clarify. A small discussion broke out involving the fact that since O2 is toxic WELL before narcotic pressures, the point is moot. This is fairly true in a recreational/basic forum. My point was simply expanding on something.

However, what has NOT been discussed is what the OP actually meant or why they are asking. In the world of trimix diving, O2's narcotic properties are VERY important. In the "Basic Scuba" forum, they're not. What I've been trying to establish is what the OP meant. The question showed CLEAR lack of an understanding of the basic concepts/jargon of oxygen toxicity and narcosis.....so what does op MEAN and what is op ASKING?

maybe you could explain to me when,on a trimix dive I am likely to encounter oxygen narcosis?

 

[victorzamora]

maybe you could explain to me when,on a trimix dive I am likely to encounter oxygen narcosis?

You don't suffer OXYGEN narcosis. You suffer narcosis. Whether or not oxygen contributes to that narcosis is another question. Is like saying you have a small stomach, and you can only intake a small volume of liquids. Nitrogen is like hard liquor. Helium is like water. Is oxygen narcotic? Well, if you have seven shots of liquor and a shot of beer, you don't know if the beer contributed. it did, but you're not sure. To drink enough beer to get you drunk would kill you, so you can't prove it for sure. That's the conundrum facing oxygen.

So, to answer your question of when it matters: it matters when performing END calculations for a really deep trimix dive and there is very little nitrogen. That is where oxygen's contribution to toxicity becomes a concern. However, oxygen narcosis is like saying football bat. You make no sense, and prove you're under informed.

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[fdog]

It is completely unscientific, but well in the past, because I was curious, I did two identical profile dives to 100'.

One dive was with 32%; the other was with 21/11.

There was a huge difference. It felt cleaner, and no buzz, and the math problems were faster and more accurate on 21/11. The 32% dive, well, schnockered would be the technical term I guess.

So, at least for my body, oxygen has a narcotic effect.


All the best, James

 

[mala]

You don't suffer OXYGEN narcosis. You suffer narcosis. Whether or not oxygen contributes to that narcosis is another question. Is like saying you have a small stomach, and you can only intake a small volume of liquids. Nitrogen is like hard liquor. Helium is like water. Is oxygen narcotic? Well, if you have seven shots of liquor and a shot of beer, you don't know if the beer contributed. it did, but you're not sure. To drink enough beer to get you drunk would kill you, so you can't prove it for sure. That's the conundrum facing oxygen.

So, to answer your question of when it matters: it matters when performing END calculations for a really deep trimix dive and there is very little nitrogen. That is where oxygen's contribution to toxicity becomes a concern. However, oxygen narcosis is like saying football bat. You make no sense, and prove you're under informed.

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I bow to your greater trimix experience.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

You don't suffer OXYGEN narcosis. You suffer narcosis. Whether or not oxygen contributes to that narcosis is another question.

Far from being another question, whether O2 is narcotic is the whole point of this thread. At least one study discussed in the thread I linked to above said it was, and several times more so than N2. Someone with Heliox experience would probably provide the best anecdotal evidence, but fdog's post supports O2 being narcotic and/or being an enhancer of N2 narcosis.

 

[victorzamora]

My point isn't that Oxygen isn't narcotic. There are THOUSANDS of threads on here with people bickering in both directions. I very much believe that oxygen is narcotic. I even believe it's approximately AS narcotic as Nitrogen. If nothing else, that will make my Trimix diving more conservative. I have no trimix experience, I'm not trimix certified, and I've never breathed Helium out of anything other than a party balloon.

My point was about OXYGEN NARCOSIS. There's no such thing. That's like getting beer drunk. You don't get beer drunk. You get DRUNK, off of the narcotic effects of one of the properties of the beverages you drink. You suffer from narcosis due to the properties of the gas you breathe off of. My example with drinking and having a small stomach is a great parallel to this debate. You can't go deep enough on pure Oxygen to suffer from narcosis due purely to oxygen. However, you can suffer from narcosis less so if you replace some of the oxygen with helium......as was said by fdog. When OP asked for a situation where it mattered, fdog's dive is a PERFECT example of when oxygen WOULD need to be taken into account when considering narcosis. fdog's END was not 100ft. It was much shallower than that, due to the oxygen being replaced.

The point still remains, "oxygen narcosis" does not exist. Also, narcosis and oxygen toxicity are two unrelated things.

OP: Instead of being snarky, clarifying your question would help us give better answers.