Rebreathers

[asimpkinsjr]

Ok Got it. I thought that was a generic inline course only.

Just so you know..that is NOT a normal CCR class. When you actually take a normal CCR course, the entire course is UNIT specific. Every unit has its own certification.

Contrary to what you believed and posted last night - every unit, in fact, does have its own course and cert.

Maybe Hollis doing something different, I know they required a class to even take delivery, all my other certs are through TDI/SDI and even a buddy of mine who dives a Prism which is a true CCR did the same course I did with the only modifications being the breakout sessions to build and tear down...just out of curiosity for frame of reference, what agency did you do yours through as I would be curious to see what their curriculum is like?

 

[manni-yunk]

I took the TDI CCR Generic course so to give an idea of what I experienced it was really broken out into 4 parts:

1. 11 modules, with 11 exams and then a final. This information is not specific to any rebreather so you cover pure oxygen rebreathers, closed circuit rebreathers and semi closed all in one course. I did mine slowly over a few weeks but I suspect if you sat down and jammed all the reading and exams into one session its probably 3 days of classwork and tests.

2. A half day Hollis review of your specific rebreather followed by an afternoon taking things apart going through all the components and packing cans.

3. A day of skills work in a pool equivalent to 2 pool dives or more

4. 4 Checkout dives

My point about it not being specific is the TDI course begins substantially by training on all kinds of rebreathers, and its even called "TDI Generic CCR"

The more I read this....the more confused I get. I wonder why a TDI Generic course would have checkout dives on a specific unit? Why would a generic course go through building and taking apart a specific unit? Are you sure you didnt take a unit course and confuse it with the fact that every CCR class starts out with basic CCR education that woul dbe generic?

 

[manni-yunk]

Maybe Hollis doing something different, I know they required a class to even take delivery, all my other certs are through TDI/SDI and even a buddy of mine who dives a Prism which is a true CCR did the same course I did with the only modifications being the breakout sessions to build and tear down...just out of curiosity for frame of reference, what agency did you do yours through as I would be curious to see what their curriculum is like?

TDI......


And I just looked at the requirements for the course you posted....it certifies you to dive.. a specific unit.

 

[doctormike]

I just completed my JJ CCR Mod 1 certification (air diluent) last month through TDI. This is how it works.

I did the TDI generic CCR course online first (pay TDI directly for that).

Then, I did the JJ CCR course with my TDI instructor (half day of assembly and disassembly, half day of pool work, nine dives in a quarry over five days).

I'm assuming the way that it works is that you need to do the generic CCR course first (academics, online only) before you can start the unit specific course with an instructor.

 

[asimpkinsjr]

No, like I said the course completion course I took from TDI was a Generic CCR, thats what is on the course completion reports, etc. It seems they leave it to the dive shop your buying your rebreather from to ensure any customizations are taught for a given unit. I can see why, the certs are coming from the agencies and they are not going to have a cert program for every vendor/unit and at the same time Hollis is not certifying people, they are just ensuring they have the training customizations provided to each dive shop for their units for the build, tear down and checkout dives. But like I said the course did start with 3 days or so of material and testing on air, CCR and SCCR.

 

[manni-yunk]

No, like I said the course completion course I took from TDI was a Generic CCR, thats what is on the course completion reports, etc. It seems they leave it to the dive shop your buying your rebreather from to ensure any customizations are taught for a given unit. I can see why, the certs are coming from the agencies and they are not going to have a cert program for every vendor/unit and at the same time Hollis is not certifying people, they are just ensuring they have the training customizations provided to each dive shop for their units for the build, tear down and checkout dives. But like I said the course did start with 3 days or so of material and testing on air, CCR and SCCR.

Im not going to keep arguing this. Its a fact. The certs are unit specific. If the class is broken up to allow the generic portion to be done in advance, great...but you do get certified on a specific unit. The manufacturers dont certify you...but they wont sell you a unit unless you are certified or going through the instructor that is going to certify you.

You may not like it or agree with it..but thats how it goes. I know one specific CCR diver that has had almost EVERY major CCR out there and know as much as anyone on the planet regarding CCRs...but he never took the cross over class for his current unit and the local instructors will not sell him parts until he is certified on it. He bought it used or he wouldnt own it.

 

[RainPilot]

RAID also has their rebreather levels as generic. When you do the first course, it must be done in conjunction with a speciality course in the unit of choice. After that the succeeding levels must be done on the unit you have specialised in. This means if I change unit at some point I don't necessarily need to do every level over again. All I need to do is the speciality and then meet the experience requirements to open the levels on the new unit.

 

[manni-yunk]

RAID also has their rebreather levels as generic. When you do the first course, it must be done in conjunction with a speciality course in the unit of choice. After that the succeeding levels must be done on the unit you have specialised in. This means if I change unit at some point I don't necessarily need to do every level over again. All I need to do is the speciality and then meet the experience requirements to open the levels on the new unit.

That is how all of the "cross over" training is done. Its unit specific and doesnt reinvent the basic CCR coverage.

 

[asimpkinsjr]

TDI......


And I just looked at the requirements for the course you posted....it certifies you to dive.. a specific unit.

Im not going to keep arguing this. Its a fact. The certs are unit specific. If the class is broken up to allow the generic portion to be done in advance, great...but you do get certified on a specific unit. The manufacturers dont certify you...but they wont sell you a unit unless you are certified or going through the instructor that is going to certify you.

You may not like it or agree with it..but thats how it goes. I know one specific CCR diver that has had almost EVERY major CCR out there and know as much as anyone on the planet regarding CCRs...but he never took the cross over class for his current unit and the local instructors will not sell him parts until he is certified on it. He bought it used or he wouldnt own it.

Manni Im not arguing at all, its simply a discussion...what Im really getting at is the card is a generic ccr card, if you go to buy another CCR and you have a Generic CCR card, are they going to refuse to sell it to you? I don't know the answer to that other than to say I did checkout dives with a draeger diver and he didn't have to attend the build and tear down sessions he just did the check out dives with us. I don't think we are saying very different things so again to me its simply dialogue.

 

[manni-yunk]

Manni Im not arguing at all, its simply a discussion...what Im really getting at is the card is a generic ccr card, if you go to buy another CCR and you have a Generic CCR card, are they going to refuse to sell it to you? I don't know the answer to that other than to say I did checkout dives with a draeger diver and he didn't have to attend the build and tear down sessions he just did the check out dives with us. I don't think we are saying very different things so again to me its simply dialogue.

The answer, as I understand it is, yes - they will refuse to sell it until you have taken, or are signed up to take the unit specific class.

Maybe an instructor will chime in.

That is how I understand it and how many instructors have explained it to me after 5 years of CCR research before I took the plunge.

The generic card may entitle to to the less timely and less expensive cross over course, but you will need to take a course. Every unit is so different, that it actually makes sense.