Kay Dee
Contributor
More likely you'll "know" other people may think you are contributing little and sound like an ass...
EXACTLY the kind of comment I would expect from you Mr Hammer.
Pay it no mind Doc.
Free Speech and Moderation: from Filmmaker Rob Stewart dies off Alligator Reef
- Thread starter Doc Ben
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EXACTLY the kind of comment I would expect from you Mr Hammer.
Pay it no mind Doc.
Sigh.
Welcome to SB @Doc Ben . I hope you have a long and happy stay here. In order to increase the odds of that (the happy part mostly) I would suggest you have a good read through the Terms of Service (the ones you accepted when you joined) as well as the Special Rules for various forums linked in the forum title, before you commit your thoughts to the screen. If you have queries or inputs about moderation on this board, Feedback would be the appropriate forum. A search there first may answer your questions though.
I don't know about you, but where i am from it is considered fairly rude for the FNG to storm in telling people how they are doing everything wrong. When I became a member I lurked for about 6 months before I felt i had enough of a handle on things to contribute to the conversation. When i became a moderator it took me a couple of weeks before i felt that I could provide helpful feedback and longer before i began trying to change things.
YMM, of course, V. To address some of your issues:
Reading is fundamental. What Frank (@Wookie ) was saying that since he had no problem with HIS posts being deleted, you shouldn't have an issue with HIS posts being deleted.
Yes, because Frank is an ethical human being he has admitted his biases openly, and like all moderators he is recused from moderating threads he is active in. When posting as a user, he is treated like a user. Full stop.
He has no requirement to disclose his role in the investigation. To anyone outside , possibly, a courtroom. The fact that he has stated as much as he has is already an indication to me of his character. Speaking of which, a tip for new people: if you aren't sure what someone is about, have a quick look at their number of posts vs the likes they have received. It is VERY rare for a long time poster here to have more likes than posts.
Again with the reading.He is saying the EXACT OPPOSITE i.e. the rules applied even though he is a moderator. He is a human being, in his role as user he made some comments that were not appropriate for whatever reason, and they were deleted. It should be a comfort to you that mods are modded like any other user. In fact, the person with the most moderations on them is the owner of the Board.
Frank is a moderator and valuable contributor.
You won't get banned from the board for this kind of thing, Doc. Multiple breaches of the ToS with ignored warnings, threats against other members and racism/bigotry are about the only things that can get you banned. The last 2 instantly, the ToS stuff will be preceded by a lot of coaching, warnings, forum bans, temp Board bans and then a permaban from the whole Board.
By your judgement, the same argument could be made for deleting your comments. What will happen is that, after submitting this reply, I will hit the "Report" button which will send it to the Mod back room. There it will be discussed and a consensus decision taken. I have no idea what that would be since I (and Frank) are not going to be involved in the discussion since we may have a conflict of interest.
If the decision is to, among other things, delete this post for being OT or whatever, I will be fine with that. Like Frank was about his posts before.
Since tone is notoriously hard to judge on the internet, please read this as being a bit exasperated but genuinely trying to help a new member of our community better understand the lay of the land.
Welcome to SB @Doc Ben . I hope you have a long and happy stay here. In order to increase the odds of that (the happy part mostly) I would suggest you have a good read through the Terms of Service (the ones you accepted when you joined) as well as the Special Rules for various forums linked in the forum title, before you commit your thoughts to the screen. If you have queries or inputs about moderation on this board, Feedback would be the appropriate forum. A search there first may answer your questions though.
I don't know about you, but where i am from it is considered fairly rude for the FNG to storm in telling people how they are doing everything wrong. When I became a member I lurked for about 6 months before I felt i had enough of a handle on things to contribute to the conversation. When i became a moderator it took me a couple of weeks before i felt that I could provide helpful feedback and longer before i began trying to change things.
YMM, of course, V. To address some of your issues:
Reading is fundamental. What Frank (@Wookie ) was saying that since he had no problem with HIS posts being deleted, you shouldn't have an issue with HIS posts being deleted.
Yes, because Frank is an ethical human being he has admitted his biases openly, and like all moderators he is recused from moderating threads he is active in. When posting as a user, he is treated like a user. Full stop.
He has no requirement to disclose his role in the investigation. To anyone outside , possibly, a courtroom. The fact that he has stated as much as he has is already an indication to me of his character. Speaking of which, a tip for new people: if you aren't sure what someone is about, have a quick look at their number of posts vs the likes they have received. It is VERY rare for a long time poster here to have more likes than posts.
Again with the reading.He is saying the EXACT OPPOSITE i.e. the rules applied even though he is a moderator. He is a human being, in his role as user he made some comments that were not appropriate for whatever reason, and they were deleted. It should be a comfort to you that mods are modded like any other user. In fact, the person with the most moderations on them is the owner of the Board.
Frank is a moderator and valuable contributor.
You won't get banned from the board for this kind of thing, Doc. Multiple breaches of the ToS with ignored warnings, threats against other members and racism/bigotry are about the only things that can get you banned. The last 2 instantly, the ToS stuff will be preceded by a lot of coaching, warnings, forum bans, temp Board bans and then a permaban from the whole Board.
By your judgement, the same argument could be made for deleting your comments. What will happen is that, after submitting this reply, I will hit the "Report" button which will send it to the Mod back room. There it will be discussed and a consensus decision taken. I have no idea what that would be since I (and Frank) are not going to be involved in the discussion since we may have a conflict of interest.
If the decision is to, among other things, delete this post for being OT or whatever, I will be fine with that. Like Frank was about his posts before.
Since tone is notoriously hard to judge on the internet, please read this as being a bit exasperated but genuinely trying to help a new member of our community better understand the lay of the land.
Kay Dee
Contributor
Well, with all due respect RP, and not saying in this particular case as I don't know Doc Ben from a bar of soap, but let us for a moment use a real world scenario just as an example; i.e. sometimes the so-called FNG knows more / has more experience than some other members of the platoon and can give positive input to that platoon (or in this example to some of those that sing in the choir as it were on a forum). Nor should one expect anyone else to ‘waste’ their time ‘lurking’ - for six months or whatever - in the background as it were. A personal choice / outlook of course though.
So IMO - and I know you or most here may not / don't give a rats for my ‘opinion’ as I am also an FNG here - I guess it depends a lot on the experience the FNG brings to the table, even if he/she is an 'unknown' at the table as it were, but is willing to speak his mind, take the hits, and back up and proffer contradictory opinions to the generally accepted consensus, with those opinions often gained though from years and years of personal experience I might add, but who does not always meet / bow to the conventional wisdom.
PS. RP, the above is not at all intended to reflect on how you and / or other MOD's choose to moderate YOUR forum, but just to comment that the potential value of an FNG should not be discarded simply because he is an FNG, and does something that in your opinion, and no doubt others, is considered in some circles rude, or on the other hand are / may just be easily offended themselves when the FNG intrudes on 'their' turf. And no I am not pointing this statement at you, but you brought it up is all.
BTW, seeing as you brought up the subject of rudeness RP, I find it rather rude to say the least, when one answers others questions in great detail, but then when one turns around and asks a / or questions of them, they simply don't reply / ignore your question/s. Realize you can do nothing about this RP, but that's what I call RUDE!
Best fishes to all!
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Dan
Contributor
The Chairman
Chairman of the Board
A ScubaBoard Staff Message...
Long threads don't need to be made longer by people complaining about moderation. We call this a thread hijack. Those discussions belong in site support. Hey look! We are now in site support!
This is not the right way to get a mod's attention. Please use the "Report" feature that can be found on each and every post. You only muck things up worse when you post like that in the thread. Give the mods less work to do: not more.
Also, while we're on the subject of 'censorship'... ScubaBoard is predicated on friendly respect, even when you disagree. Calling Jack "goofy" in public isn't very friendly. Refrain from such name-calling. Now, you could have said "Jack's goofy post" and that would have been fine. Discuss/attack ideas and not the poster. Either way, you should have sent this in as a report and not continued the thread hijack you started.
So, let's make an effort to keep discussions "on topic" by not turning them into a discussion about any moderation that's happened. If you just need to know more, click on the "Quote in Conversation" button on the lower right of the mod's post and ask them off of the thread. You'll find them pretty forthcoming and if you don't like what they say, simply report the conversation and then all the mods will see it.
Capt Jim Wyatt
Hanging at the 10 Foot Stop
Staff member
ScubaBoard Business Sponsor
Scuba Instructor
What you see here is a prime example of how the Mods keep threads on topic. Since these posts were not on the topic of the original thread they were simply given a thread of their own, this one.
Good job Mods...
Good job Mods...
The Chairman
Chairman of the Board
Looky... they're no longer here. The mods caught my oversight and moved them back while you were getting all angry about it. We're a team and work together as one. Now, your astute comments are back where they belong.
Again, this points out why it's important to not hijack threads. Sometimes the good gets moved with the bad.
Caveeagle
Contributor
Few questions..
Why aren't all moderators identified, like I have noticed on other forums.
Is "staff member" and moderator, the same thing?
Why aren't all moderators identified, like I have noticed on other forums.
Is "staff member" and moderator, the same thing?
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