Another Shearwater Service Thread

[Diver0001]

My ideas on this are that you are speculating and making unsubstantiated assumptions based on an issue with a single computer?

First, you seem to be suggesting that Shearwater is trying to hide an issue? Because they wanted some evidence of a problem before sending a unit back in for service? Really? How is that hiding anything?

Second, you seem to want suggest that we might suddenly expect Shearwater computers will be failing at the same rate as Suunto computers? Based on what?

Thirdly, you seem to want to suggest that we should possibly be worried about Shearwater's response to an issue that appears to be isolated (based on the facts at hand) to be "**** you, by a new computer"? Why would this be the case when Shearwater has been known for fantastic customer service? Just look at how they actively participate and answer questions here. Look at how well they communicated and managed issues with Nerd 2 computers. Just today, they posted about Teric supply/demand to get ahead of and manage customer expectations. At this point, there is ZERO reason to question how they would handle an issue based on their track record.

I'm sorry, but your post is either off base (and unfair to SW) or just poorly presented/worded!

Really.....

Ok, let me try again and narrow the scope to a number of bullet points for you. I will not say anything new. I will say the same things I said in my previous post but they will be put in a format that is easier for you to understand.

1) we are talking about a self-diving Shearwater computer. We have no idea how wide spread this problem is but let's assume that it is rare but obviously not impossible.
2) we can establish that they are expensive
3) we can conclude that they are not intended for run-of-the-mill diving and therefore that divers depend upon them for their lives, in contrast to recreational computers.
4) we can easily see that at least one competitor has had very serious problems with this issue over a number of years over a number a computer models.
5) we can establish that the competitor has done next to nothing to address this problem aside from telling customers "caveat emptor" and asking customers to buy a new computer.
6) we can establish that there is need to know how Shearwater will respond to exactly the same problem. This question was clearly posed.

So... if you can't map your complaint to one of the 6 points above then you have no point to make.

 

[DMDavid]

Not to sound stupid but what is a Self-Diving computer?
Is it a computer that continues to show a decent when in fact there isn't?

 

[Diver0001]

David, a "self diving" computer is a computer that remains in dive mode well after you are on the surface.

In the case of my friend, his computer remained in dive mode and showed a depth of at least 1m days later (even after changing the battery).

Suunto computers are plagued with this problem. Suunto computers are somewhat prone to failure and almost all failures, in my experience, involve "self diving". The cause is probably related to the pressure sensor or the manner in which the pressure sensor is mounted in the housing. I'm sure (as I said above) that other computers have this problem as well so I don't want to bad-mouth Suunto, but because Suunto is a big player, the number of failures of this type appears to be striking.

The problem seems to be wide spread. As I mentioned above, Suunto's attitude is to replace computers that are under warranty and to tell users of computers that are not under warranty that they need to buy a new computer.

My concern in my previous posts was that Shearwater would follow Suunto's lead with this attitude. I can fully understand and respect Suunto's stance in this but their computers are cheap. A Shearwater is not.

R..

 

[TrimixToo]

These questions suggest that some think the company with perhaps the best customer service in the industry might change their practices were a problem to be sufficiently widespread. Indeed, that is possible, of course. Some things are simply not affordable if they happen with sufficient frequency; making a living demands staying in business or as affordable an exit as one can arrange. It's for this reason virtually all warranties are limited. It's just a fact of life that one must eat.

But consider: We have no clue whether this particular problem is widespread from a single report or whether it costs Shearwater much to fix when it happens. Having a photo avoids the altitude and barometric changes that would be inevitable in transit could possibly complicate diagnosis. And finally, I have seen nobody say that Shearwater ever provided service below their expectations, ever. I have seen a lot of people say the opposite.

I personally am giving them the benefit of the doubt, and I'd buy another of their computers (if I needed another--I have two) without hesitation.

 

[boulderjohn]

US service or back to Canada?

US

 

[Diver0001]

I personally am giving them the benefit of the doubt, and I'd buy another of their computers (if I needed another--I have two) without hesitation.

So would I. I'm not trying to draw their customer service into doubt.

What I'm saying is that we have at least one case of a "self diver" and I have some "question marks" about how they will deal with that.

My buddy spent almost 3 weeks making screen prints, explaining what happened and communicating with the Shearwater people in (IIRC Ireland) before they finally decided that it was OK for him to send his computer in for service.

That was several weeks ago. He hasn't heard anything from them since then. He has no idea when he will have his computer back and he is diving with that POS Suunto thing he has... even on technical dives. The dive season in the Netherlands is very short. You don't want a gear problem to keep you grounded during the few months of the years when you can dive without getting frost-bite.

R..

 

[Joneill]

Really.....

Yes, really!

Ok, let me try again and narrow the scope to a number of bullet points for you. I will not say anything new. I will say the same things I said in my previous post but they will be put in a format that is easier for you to understand.

Ir's not about understanding - it's about the speculative and suggestive nature of what you posted based on a an issue with a SINGLE computer. You are projecting issues that you say "plague" Suunto computers onto Shearwater with no basis to do so. If you really want an answer, why don't you ask SW directly or at least post in the SW manufacturer's forum where they would be likely to see it? What do you expect to get here? Opinions? They are meaningless as only SW can answer your question?

1) we are talking about a self-diving Shearwater computer. We have no idea how wide spread this problem is but let's assume that it is rare but obviously not impossible.

Shearwater is a HUGELY popular computer here - yours is the first account of a self diving SW that I have seen here. Folks here are not timid, so if this was a common issue, it would be broadly known already. So, I think we can safely say with confidence that this is NOT a widespread issue to date for SW. Of, course, as with all electronic products, nothing is impossible and defects will happen.

2) we can establish that they are expensive

Yes - but you get what you pay for with both the product and support, in my personal experience.

3) we can conclude that they are not intended for run-of-the-mill diving and therefore that divers depend upon them for their lives, in contrast to recreational computers.

Actually, that is not true. MANY users are Rec divers and choose SW for the features and reliability. In my opinion, the OC Rec screen and UI on the SW is the best, most intuitive data presentation and functionality on any dive computer out there. Just look at the HUGE demand for the new Teric - I'd bet that the vast majority of that is from Rec divers.

BTW, I would imagine that a tec diver who is depending on a DC for their life would have/wear a back up? Also, Rec divers are using DC's to keep themselves safe/protect their life too or else they could just dive with tables and a depth gauge and timer.

Further, Tec divers have been using SW computers for years, so why the sudden concern based on this 1 incident?

4) we can easily see that at least one competitor has had very serious problems with this issue over a number of years over a number a computer models.

So? Suunto having problems has NOTHING to do with Shearwater products! In fact, I'd be comfortable saying that, based on history of posting here, we can easily see that at SW does NOT have any serious problems with this issue over a number of years over a number a computer models.

5) we can establish that the competitor has done next to nothing to address this problem aside from telling customers "caveat emptor" and asking customers to buy a new computer.

Again - why do you want to project Suunto customer service policies on SW when SW has a strong history of incredibly good customer service?

6) we can establish that there is need to know how Shearwater will respond to exactly the same problem. This question was clearly posed.

Why would we expect them to respond any differently to how they've historically responded? Have you posted this exact question to Shearwater directly? They are the only ones who can answer it.

My feeling is that you are over reacting to a single incident that SW does, in fact, appear to be working with you on. The fact that they took time to check/understand the nature of your issue before having you send it back in is not anything to be concerned about in my opinion.

I recently had an issue with one of my Nikon DSLR bodies and Nikon had me send in images from the camera to look at before they had me send it back. No problem and they subsequently fixed the issue under warranty. I also had a lens motor issue that was out of the 5 year warranty period and I fully expected to have to pay for that repair (though they actually did the repair for free as good will).

So... if you can't map your complaint to one of the 6 points above then you have no point to make.

See above - I've made my points. Give Shearwater a chance to go through the normal warranty repair process - there is no valid reason at this point to try project Suunto's product and customer service issues on Shearwater.

But to answer your original questions:

"Now... I KNOW that Suunto makes a LOT more computers than Shearwater but if self divers are a serious problem for Suunto. Are we now to expect Shearwater computers to be failing at the same rate... and if they do, are we supposed to expect the same attitude as Suunto ("**** you, by a new computer") knowing that Shearwater computers are..."
​

In my opinion, the answer to both of those questions is "NO" based on historical performance of SW products, on-going product updates and how they have handled any issues that have arisen.

 

[buddhasummer]

Didn't see that coming when I read the first post. Started off happy and positive, turned doomy and gloomy rather fast. Not entirely sure why but Chicken Little came to mind.

 

[broncobowsher]

Sounds like there is one person that needs to sell there Shearwater.
The rest of the world is happy with them.

 

[JohnnyC]

To be fair, there is one other case of a self-diving Shearwater. I had a Predator that went on a 200+ foot dive by itself. I sent it back, they swapped the parts (Curt at the old US service center, not the new place) for a reasonable fee, and sent it back. I was very happy with my interactions with Curt, I've been happy with my interactions with Shearwater Prime, both have always provided service as expected.

I don't foresee Shearwater changing their policy on the off chance that they get a bad batch of depth sensors. All dive computer manufacturers get bad depth sensors every once in a while. It's simply a matter of scale that Suunto got a really big batch of bad sensors. Suunto simply takes the path of least resistance in their handling of these issues.