Great Hammerhead Approaches to bait box

[chillyinCanada]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

Final Reminder! Final Warning!

This is not the subforum for debating merits or otherwise, of the actual
conduct of the dive. Feel free to start your own thread or do a search and find an older thread that has already broached the subject.

If you have nothing to offer regarding the technical merits of the video, please move on quietly.

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[Colliam7]

A suggestion, for those who are passionate about the issue of baiting, to reinforce the Mod Post, above:

Why not start a separate thread, perhaps titled, 'The Ethics of Baited Shark Dives'. It appears to be a topic that would stimulate a great deal of discussion. The present forum, and thread, is not the proper venue for that discussion.

For better or worse, baited shark dives go on around the world, on a regular basis. Yes, operators charge money, and divers pay money to participate, in hope of seeing - up close and personal - these magnificent creatures in the water.

Apparently, some consider that to be 'irresponsible, shameful, 'disrespectful', etc. And, ALSO apparently, others do not. I, for one, have never given the ethics of such dives much thought. If bait was used to lure sharks into an area where they are hunted and killed, I would personally consider that egregiously wrong. Others might not.

I would like to see more civil, and thought-provoking, discussion. Name-calling, without articulating the rationale for the point of view, is really not an effective way to facilitate dialog on the topic.

 

[Altamira]

as the staff mentioned this is not about philosophy of diving is about videography so maybe some critique on the technique used is what am after otherwise I would write in other section on this forum

Besides without the smell of food sharks do not come anywhere near humans even if you are in the same area. So the bait does not alter the ecosystem just calls the shark to come near you so you can watch them. Without this system there would not be any footage or photos of certain larger sharks

So, It looks like it's OK for the Op to discuss why he thinks it is OK to feed the sharks to get a video, but anyone who voices an opposing opinion gets deleted. Also, I call BS on paragraph 2 above. I suspect this will also be deleted, but it seems a "rule" applied to one should apply to all.

 

[Zef]

A suggestion, for those who are passionate about the issue of baiting, to reinforce the Mod Post, above:

Why not start a separate thread, perhaps titled, 'The Ethics of Baited Shark Dives'. It appears to be a topic that would stimulate a great deal of discussion. The present forum, and thread, is not the proper venue for that discussion.

For better or worse, baited shark dives go on around the world, on a regular basis. Yes, operators charge money, and divers pay money to participate, in hope of seeing - up close and personal - these magnificent creatures in the water.

Apparently, some consider that to be 'irresponsible, shameful, 'disrespectful', etc. And, ALSO apparently, others do not. I, for one, have never given the ethics of such dives much thought. If bait was used to lure sharks into an area where they are hunted and killed, I would personally consider that egregiously wrong. Others might not.

I would like to see more civil, and thought-provoking, discussion. Name-calling, without articulating the rationale for the point of view, is really not an effective way to facilitate dialog on the topic.

The issue is not baited shark dives....the issue is the physical interaction with the sharks that is depicted in the video. It is a level of marine life harassment that would not be tolerated and that lack of tolerance would be expressed through peoples posts if that level of harassment were towards other marine life such as a turtle, a whale, etc. The fact that it is a shark is irrelevant, the fact that the shark was baited into the area is irrelevant. I am not here to debate the ethics of baited shark dives, but I think it is fair to point out that the OPs video is in a way glamorizing harassment of marine life. Divers of lesser experience may see the video and adopt that as "the norm", it should not go unchecked. If my efforts to provide that check are moderated, deleted, or I am banned for it then so be it.

-Z

 

[Wookie]

The issue is not baited shark dives....the issue is the physical interaction with the sharks that is depicted in the video. It is a level of marine life harassment that would not be tolerated and that lack of tolerance would be expressed through peoples posts if that level of harassment were towards other marine life such as a turtle, a whale, etc. The fact that it is a shark is irrelevant, the fact that the shark was baited into the area is irrelevant. I am not here to debate the ethics of baited shark dives, but I think it is fair to point out that the OPs video is in a way glamorizing harassment of marine life. Divers of lesser experience may see the video and adopt that as "the norm", it should not go unchecked. If my efforts to provide that check are moderated, deleted, or I am banned for it then so be it.

-Z

So, It looks like it's OK for the Op to discuss why he thinks it is OK to feed the sharks to get a video, but anyone who voices an opposing opinion gets deleted. Also, I call BS on paragraph 2 above. I suspect this will also be deleted, but it seems a "rule" applied to one should apply to all.

Y'all can disagree with the OP without getting nasty.

Remember the first rule you learned in school. Above all, be nice to each other.

Yes, The interactions between the feeder, one of the videographers, and the shark are reprehensible in my opinion. Again, I've been on a lot of feeding dives where no one ever touched an animal. That has nothing to do with the method of baiting, it has to do with how you interact with the animals.

 

[Interceptor121]

Am not associated with the operation I am the video operator in this case and is not a promotional shot. There are tons of much worse videos shot in tiger beach with people flipping sharks and all sorts of other behaviours

From what I understand the point of this operation Jim Abernethy Scuba adventures is to create a relationship between the shark and the dive guide. Some of the people are new in the crew and they need to make their point to the shark. As this operation has always the same sharks coming back for months and they even give them names I would think that the shark does not feel a level of harassment that is inappropriate otherwise they would not come back there is almost zero feeding done

For who is more interested there is a movie on netflix tales by light where the operation together with Eric Cheng of Wetpixel have shot a whole movie on why the go about it the way they do

I did my first baited dives in Bahamas and South Africa in 2008 and at the time I was against then I have reviewed my point of view. I have dived in all continents and all sorts of conditions to say that what is in this video is harmful is a very long shot. Then of course you may not like it but this does not mean I am promoting anything.

Go in youtube seach tiger beach diving and get your own perspective. It is draining to have people lecturing you when they have no practical experience on the subject but I do accept point of view that maybe the handling is not great but again it does not look like the sharks are put off they come back year after year surely they would stop if they were bothered

 

[Zef]

Y'all can disagree with the OP without getting nasty.

Remember the first rule you learned in school. Above all, be nice to each other.

Yes, The interactions between the feeder, one of the videographers, and the shark are reprehensible in my opinion. Again, I've been on a lot of feeding dives where no one ever touched an animal. That has nothing to do with the method of baiting, it has to do with how you interact with the animals.

If you go back as a Mod and see what was deleted, you may find that I did my best to not get nasty despite the personal attacks from the OP. I have tried to keep my posts in this thread on point about a specific topic. I agree, we should be able to disagree without getting nasty but it is a bit disingenuous quoting my post and using that as the nexus for any nastiness that has exuded its way into this thread. It is pretty hard to maintain a contextual line of dialogue if the context keeps being moderated away.

-Z

 

[Zef]

Am not associated with the operation I am the video operator in this case and is not a promotional shot. There are tons of much worse videos shot in tiger beach with people flipping sharks and all sorts of other behaviours

From what I understand the point of this operation Jim Abernethy Scuba adventures is to create a relationship between the shark and the dive guide. Some of the people are new in the crew and they need to make their point to the shark. As this operation has always the same sharks coming back for months and they even give them names I would think that the shark does not feel a level of harassment that is inappropriate otherwise they would not come back there is almost zero feeding done

For who is more interested there is a movie on netflix tales by light where the operation together with Eric Cheng of Wetpixel have shot a whole movie on why the go about it the way they do

I did my first baited dives in Bahamas and South Africa in 2008 and at the time I was against then I have reviewed my point of view. I have dived in all continents and all sorts of conditions to say that what is in this video is harmful is a very long shot. Then of course you may not like it but this does not mean I am promoting anything.

Go in youtube seach tiger beach diving and get your own perspective. It is draining to have people lecturing you when they have no practical experience on the subject but I do accept point of view that maybe the handling is not great but again it does not look like the sharks are put off they come back year after year surely they would stop if they were bothered

All I can say is that you may have made flawed statements about the level of expertise of the folks participating in this discussion. And your logic about animal behavior may be seriously flawed as well.

-Z

 

[Interceptor121]

Netflix Tales by Light Season 2 Episode 4 there is Jim Abernethy so if you are not happy feel free to complain with him

 

[chillyinCanada]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

thread closed for moderation

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