Search and Rescue - Lasers and Signaling Devices

[Scuba Cobra]

Sure, if you purchase the visible spectrum version. None of the Phoenix Jr. IR beacons (9v and 123 models) I own have any visible spectrum output. They are IR only. Cejay offers versions of them in the visible spectrum.

If one wants to be tacticool as well as carrying something that would be more useful, the Velux with an S-O-S pattern flash would be more appropriate.

And just to give some perspective, my father flew sandy missions throughout SW Asia since the mid-90's, and we've spent plenty of time discussing this sort of stuff, he's what I would consider a subject matter expert when it comes to military airborne SAR operations because he's done it for years. I couldn't tell you how drastically different civilian airborne SAR operations are, but considering you're much less worried about any kind of signature alerting someone to your presence, and in fact are actively trying to alert EVERYONE to your presence, the idea that a civilian would specifically seek out IR-based signaling solutions to affect their rescue is the utilitarian equivalent of shooting yourself in the foot to scratch an itch.

ETA: For anybody that doesn't know, Sandy is CSAR, combat search and rescue. All the joys of normal search and rescue but the guy is harder to find and people are shooting at you.

I never specifically said get an IR strobe. if you read back I simply said I use a similar model. Mine is a white beacon with IR cover. I only brought it up due to it's size and cost. I mean really, at the end of the day we could just say F*** it, Light monkey has a huge dildo strobe we can lug around but I don't plan to get lost at sea. I'm ok with my small 9v strobe.

"tacticool" has little to nothing to do with it.

 

[mtngoat2674]

That is great if you live or have a vacay home outside the US or always stay in the US. More problematic if you are US based and travel elsewhere.

Meh. 9v batteries are easy. The actual unit is small and nobody has ever even asked me about it. I've taken it to Afghanistan, Turkey, Azerbaijan, and a truckload of other countries. This would not impact my decision on whether or not to purchase it for it's intended use.

 

[Dan]

@Scuba Cobra would you please tell us where to get the 9v white visible light beacon then?

Thanks!

 

[mtngoat2674]

First: Don’t get lost at sea.

But if you do, your first enemy is hypothermia. Dive a thicker wetsuit than you think you need. Your second enemy is dehydration. You won’t last more than a few days without hydration.

Always have an SMB and do not underestimate the value of a simple flashlight. Great for looking into holes and for signaling at night.

Agree wholeheartedly. All dives, I have at least my secondary light in a pocket. Most dives I have my SMB. (All dives relevant to a lost at sea scenario I have both, along with other signaling devices. I do not have any type of PLB, but I've borrowed one when the circumstances warranted it.)

 

[fsardone]

Question for all the people who are advocating in favor of using a laser to point at a pilot: Have any of you had any real training in Land, Sea or even Arctic Survival (more realistic than what you might get in Boy Scouts) or conversely, have you ever had any training as either a pilot or as a SAR Observer?

Hello, not to boast but:
sea survival course basic and advanced plus 3 refresher.
Mountain survival: basic and advanced plus 5 refresher.
Civil Air Patrol: observer and mission pilot.
Had a SAR squadron working for me for a couple of years.

Please do not use a laser. Pointing it up will not be visible. Do it in you back yard (without aircrafts overheard) and observe it from 20 meters/yards no beam will be visible unless fog or dust. Pointing it directly (do not try risk of temporary or permanent blindness) will not allo to locate (blinding). Risk is not worth. Use a signal mirror or a strobe. Please. Laser are used to warn off violating aircrafts in very sensitive areas (check the notam for the Washingron DC flight restricted zone) before engagement.
[edited on a computer only to remove spelling mistakes from a mobile keyboard...]

 

[mtngoat2674]

Sure, if you purchase the visible spectrum version. None of the Phoenix Jr. IR beacons (9v and 123 models) I own have any visible spectrum output. They are IR only. Cejay offers versions of them in the visible spectrum.

If one wants to be tacticool as well as carrying something that would be more useful, the Velux with an S-O-S pattern flash would be more appropriate.

And just to give some perspective, my father flew sandy missions throughout SW Asia since the mid-90's, and we've spent plenty of time discussing this sort of stuff, he's what I would consider a subject matter expert when it comes to military airborne SAR operations because he's done it for years. I couldn't tell you how drastically different civilian airborne SAR operations are, but considering you're much less worried about any kind of signature alerting someone to your presence, and in fact are actively trying to alert EVERYONE to your presence, the idea that a civilian would specifically seek out IR-based signaling solutions to affect their rescue is the utilitarian equivalent of shooting yourself in the foot to scratch an itch.

ETA: For anybody that doesn't know, Sandy is CSAR, combat search and rescue. All the joys of normal search and rescue but the guy is harder to find and people are shooting at you.

In reality, I first started carrying the Phoenix Jr. When wandering around less than friendly places. Your comments are quite correct, though I have found that most (non-tactical) SAR units I have spoken to opined that they would be most likely to investigate an IR beacon in the event that they encountered one (vs a visible light beacon, with the exception being a specific SOS message). Given the small size, I like to carry it. To each their own.

 

[MichaelMc]

Hello, not to boast but:
...
Please do not use a laser

Opinions backed by credentials do have more weight. Thanks for the update. A beam of light into the sky seems useful, but its not clear it is any more so than Personal AIS or PLB.

 

[rsingler]

@Scuba Cobra would you please tell us where to get the 9v white visible light beacon then?

So we've covered nighttime. Maybe IR, maybe visible/both. Cloudy remains problematic except for your SMB with radar reflective tape. But daytime, low tech is what's cool. Buy and learn how to use a plain old signal mirror, with or without the little hole in the middle. Trust me, a "V" of your fingers pointed where the plane is, will work much faster for the "casual" user. It won't spook your pilot. But it WILL get his/her attention.

(Yeah, retired USAF flight surgeon, Fairchild survival trained, CSAR in Iraq, etc., etc.)

 

[Dan]

So we've covered nighttime. Maybe IR, maybe visible/both. Cloudy remains problematic except for your SMB with radar reflective tape. But daytime, low tech is what's cool. Buy and learn how to use a plain old signal mirror, with or without the little hole in the middle. Trust me, a "V" of your fingers pointed at where the plane is, will work much faster for the "casual" user. It won't spook your pilot. But it WILL get his/her attention.

(Yeah, retired USAF flight surgeon, Fairchild survival trained, CSAR in Iraq, etc., etc.)

Thanks for the tips. I have signal mirror with the rest of signaling devices as I posted in this thread: Best signaling devices from the searcher’s point of view - update. I learnt how to use it when I was in boyscout.

 

[mtngoat2674]

So we've covered nighttime. Maybe IR, maybe visible/both. Cloudy remains problematic except for your SMB with radar reflective tape. But daytime, low tech is what's cool. Buy and learn how to use a plain old signal mirror, with or without the little hole in the middle. Trust me, a "V" of your fingers pointed at where the plane is, will work much faster for the "casual" user. It won't spook your pilot. But it WILL get his/her attention.

(Yeah, retired USAF flight surgeon, Fairchild survival trained, CSAR in Iraq, etc., etc.)

100% agree on the signal mirror. Really not much excuse not to have one, land or sea.