beginner diver back plate and wing config

[scrane]

For some reason STAs are still around. But I wouldn't bother. Just make sure your plate and wing are compatible. I have this for a little added stability in my setup:
OMS Soft Stabilizing Adapter

 

[Barnaby'sDad]

For what it's wort

It's hard to say. I'm 5'7" at 140 lbs and I need 10 lbs with an aluminum backplate, aluminum tank, and a 3mm suit in salt water.
I started out with a SS plate but soon traded for aluminum. I didn't like being locked into carrying weight on my back or in my luggage.
Buy the harness kit. Get a cheap one. I think piecing one together will end up costing you more.
Get a cheaper backplate as long as you're sure it will match the wing. They're pretty much all the same. If you find sharp edges take them down with a file.
Spend your money on the wing. The VDH Argonaut is what I would get now.
I only dive warm water and have a 23# wing. It is plenty. I could probably get away with 18# but I don't think it would make a practical difference.

I started out the opposite direction. I started out with a softplate and went to a SS plate. Where OP is diving cold, I would recommend the SS plate route. If travel weight is a concern, then go the aluminum plate route.

Absolutely. ex. DGX, Deep 6, HOG, etc. Get the one piece webbing setup to simplify things.

x2 on getting a used/cheap plate. Post up a want to buy add in the classified section on SB...someone will have one that they're looking to unload.

I primarily dive cold, so I went with a 32lb wing. After changing my configuration around a bit (ex. AL80 to HP100, softplate to SS, and adding an STA), I got to the point that I only need to add 4lbs when diving freshwater with a 5mm, 5mm hood, 5mm gloves, and 5mm boots. I definitely do not need the 32lb wing with my current setup.

On the STA...I would not buy one initially. I didn't need one when I was using an AL80. When I went to a HP100...the tank would shift a bit when it was getting strapped down. That was using the 32lb HOG wing that has the little alignment ridges. I put the STA on and haven't had the issue since.

For those that have never run into something like that, I can see why they think STA's are useless. Other than that one issue...I have a hard time processing why I'd want one.

 

[jgttrey]

Some clarification....

1) A stainless steel plate will help offset the amount of lead needed to sink with a 7mm suit, however depending on how much weight you need, it may make you overweight. The plate itself is 6lb's.

Yes, though I'd be surprised if you were overweight in a 7mm. The other consideration is travel. I have a great SS plate from DSS, but sometimes it just doesn't make the traveling squad, particularly if I'm going someplace warm and don't need the weight. You can always get aluminum and carry more lead if you need it, but if SS overweights you in warm water, you're just stuck with it.

2) Many will argue yes they are all the same, but I say no. There is difference in machining that you may care about, and there are plates that are better in the eyes of the user than others. I had a DGX plate at first, it had burrs that tore up harnesses and the holes didn't align with some aftermarket parts (back pad)

Yes, but most are fine. Failure to align is mostly a result of the fact that many accessories are designed for that mfg's plate. It isn't a quality issue, it's just matching. Getting a high-end plate is no guarantee that the holes will line up if you want to bling it out (not that you should).

3)I prefer a 1-Piece continuous harness. other harnesses out there that drive up the price and are not worth it due to additional failure points like plastic buckles and other "creature comforts" that are unnecessary.

Disagree. There are some people for whom something other than a hogarthian harness is a better solution. I have several, but find that they are not comfortable for me in certain configurations. That's just me and my body type. They are also a bigger hassle in a drysuit. I have two versions of the dive rite harness with transition rings (one even has QDs - gasp). If continuous weave works for you, that's great - cheapest and the most robust. But don't let anyone talk you out of something different if it fits you better. The whole "failure point" thing is overhyped. A sternum clip coming undone or a QD letting go is something you probably wouldn't even notice on a dive, not that it is likely to happen. I've had several classes where standards require that divers with QD buckles on their harnesses demonstrate they can manage a failure. Each time, the instructor has snuck up on me and undone one, I've never even noticed. Eventually, he'll point it out, roll his eyes at how stupid the exercise was, and I'll reclip it. People act like you'll explode or something. Bull.

So, I have no problem with continuous weave and would suggest you try it first because if you like it, you've saved money. But, I wouldn't hesitate to go with an alternative if it makes sense for you. You'll find there's a lot of "orthodoxy" preached about BP/W setups and much of it is a good starting point, but don't treat it like an appendix to the 10 commandments.

4) you can search far and wide on wing lifts and will never get the "best" answer. warm water most use something in the 20lb range. cold water the 30lb range. anything above that and you are looking at something that is not optimized for a single tank and can add drag in the water. Avoid horseshoe and bungee wings. Donut shaped are best.

I agree that bungee wings are best avoided, but "donut is best" is nonsense. Different strokes for different folks. Most divers are rarely head down enough to take advantage of the lower part of the donut. I personally like a horseshoe because it is less likely to get pinched on the bottom (which is the #1 cause of bladder failures) and because I can park a little air on one side or the other to compensate if I have a stage slung on that side or if I want to swim along a wall facing it while taking photos (i.e., cocked to one side). It can be a handy tool. Necessary, absolutely not. Donuts are fine, but they aren't "best" unless they are "best for you."

In terms of lift, there are a million threads on "how much lift do a I need" that will tell you how to figure that out. One of the benefits of a BPW set up is that you can swap out wings when it makes sense if your situation changes.

 

[twofor2]

Would it be bad if a wing had more lift than necessary. Im getting a feeling a wing around 30lbs would be sufficient but I'm seeing some wings that are around 40lbs of lift

 

[jgttrey]

There's no giant harm, but a wing that is bigger than necessary creates more drag, creates more of a "taco" around your cylinder, and in some cases is more prone to create hiding spaces for air bubbles that get trapped are hard to vent unless you wiggle around a bit. I see divers all the time (usually in BCDs with giant bladders) that have hard time controlling their safety stops only to realize later it was because they still had air trapped in their BC.

Smaller wings will minimize those things.

So, do the "how much lift do I need" math you'll find in the other threads. There's no harm if you pad it a little. 40 is not atrocious but if your calculation is that 30 is really sufficient then I'd get that, or 32 or 34, or whatever. Personally, I think most people dive wings that are far bigger than they need. It just really needs to float your rig on the surface and accommodate your buoyancy changes as you go deeper/use gas. That's a lot less than people think.

I'd just resist the temptation to go get some giant wing, thinking "I can use this for everything." It can, just not well.

 

[Diver below 83]

At what price point does a BP become over priced

 

[Caveeagle]

For fresh water I prefer an aluminum plate. And have a steel one for salt water.

I dove a one piece harness for years but now have an adjustable Dive Rite deluxe harness on all my rigs. I dive, single TransPac, BM Doubles, sidemount Nomad LS, and and also have their TransPlate on my O2ptima, so having essentially the same harness all all my rigs makes things at least a little standardized. Also the adjustability allows for drysuit to wetsuit switches mush easier.

Nothing wrong with the one piece Hogarthian harness, just not the best for me.

I actually like a bungeed wing, like the RecEXP. (Voyager is better for singles) I swtched from a Hollis horseshoe shaped wing a year ago, and have a lot less drag in the water with no loss of lift.

 

[twofor2]

I found a deal for a DiveRite set Basic Harness BPW package for $399 anyone have insight on this setup? Also what does the option for web my harness mean? any clues?

 

[Caveeagle]

I think that is a great setup, although like I said above, I prefer the deluxe harness.

I suspect they are charging you $10 to thread the harness through the backplate and all the D rings for you. Probably a wise spend of $10 unless you just like to fiddle with stuff.

I found a deal for a DiveRite set Basic Harness BPW package for $399 anyone have insight on this setup? Also what does the option for web my harness mean? any clues?

 

[ams511]

aluminum or stainless steel back plate?

Given the 7mm wetsuit, I would recommend a steel plate. If you are using heavy steel tanks then aluminium may be better. You can find a used aluminium plate cheap so I would go with a steel plate.

Also are all back plates created equal?

Under water yes. As Scuba Cobra points out some differ in fit and finish. However you can smooth out any burrs in the plate inexpensively. I would have contacted Dive Gear Express if the plate was as bad as Scuba Cobra describes.

Are pre-made harnesses worth it or would it be cheaper the same quality if I bought things individually.

I doubt you would save much. If you try to buy the parts separately you are likely to pay more in shipping which would negate any cost savings.

Also when looking for a wing how many pounds of lift do I need for a single tank?

Rule of thumb is for warm water 20-30, for cold water 30-40.

If anyone could direct me in the right direction I would appreciate it.Any recommendations are also gladly accepted.

I saw in a post you listed a Dive Rite setup from DRIS for $399. Dive Rite is good and so is DRIS. Some more choices are:
Vintage Double Hose - contact them and ask for a package price. They used to list them on the website but I don't see it now.
Dive Gear Express
Golem - You need to call first and see if the item is in stock.