Definition of a loggable dive
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My very early AM activity is reading the "board" I was attracted to this thread and the many responses. Soooo I am reposting and old post of mine which should answer most questions
Basic rule
Log every hyperbaric exposure-- from the swimming pool and your training to mud puddles, quarries to the ocean -- It is all hyperbaric exposure -- the body cannot identify if the water is fresh clear pool water, a mud puddle or ocean salt water if it is 10 feet deep or 100 feet deep. It is all an hyperbaric exposure.
The present generation -- Your generation is the very first generation in the history of man to experience massive often long term hyperbaric exposure. Who knows what effects such exposure will have on health and longevity ?
Based on the very small samples of those who began diving long before the popularity of recreational diving it is possible that audio and equilibrium systems will be impacted as well as orthopedic involvement in the form of aseptic bone necrosis and yet to be identified or named diving maladies
At this junction in the very short history of diving there is no data to determine if this can or will occur
Never the less I would suggest that you log ALL hyperbaric exposures
1) Logging dives has been around for a while -
Initially divers used note books to record what was considered important - most often relating to game
The first official US log book was designed in 1955 (63 years ago) by the late Dick Bonin founder of SCUBA Pro and marketed by the very active but long gone company called "Dive Master:" of Chicago. Dive Master was a full marketing & service facility who published a yearly catalog offered certification classes both in house and via mail order (@drbill your very close personal friend Zale Parry has Dive Master certification #10 --@Marie13 note CHICAGO !)
2) The second dive log was designed by Tom Ebro in 1966 (11 years later - 52 years ago ) As a requirement for the LA County Underwater Instructors Association. Initially for use in the worlds first ADP, the LA CO three (3) month long many dives Advanced Diver Program, aka ADP and for use in the LA Co Underwater Instructor Certification course (UICC), the worlds first underwater training program established in 1954, which continues as the worlds most demanding a prestigious diving instructors training program ,
3) The rest of the diving world did not immediately consider dive logs necessary therefore did not immediately develop dive logs but when the did they used, aka change the cover and copied their dive logs after LA Counties log book.. Now there are many diving logs in every format--so many in so many forms to choose from
4) I am told that some organizations demand logs be maintained and presented as evidence of diving proficiency and recent experience in order to advance to another level
5) I also understand that some resorts now demand logs be presented as evidence of diving proficiency and recent experience in order to dive or participate in specialized activities which are over and above the norm
6) I recommend that you maintain a dive log- and take it on every dive trip and log every dive ASAP after the dive.
Log all that encompass hyperbaric exposure -in deep pool, a mud puddle, a quarry and the ocean- always include date, place depth and time. These entries are not only for your benefit but are invaluable as you certainly realize for the attending or treating doctor and nurses-- now or in the distant future
7) The prestigious SCUBA School's Pro 5000- for consideration of eligibility for the award requires that a verified log demonstrating 5000 dives and recommendation by two SSI Pro 5000 members be submitted prior to even be consideration for the award. (FYI only four members of the SCUBA board are members 1)@Scuba Lawyer[ 2)@Trace Malinowski 3) most recently @Lake Hickory and yours truly since 1969 (?)
Now you know the history of the dive log and its importance I suspect you now know considerably more about the history of the dive log that a majority of the current diving community. Perhaps you can and can share these historical tid bits with your fuzzy faced instructors...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
) My son SAM IV is a NAUI (Life member) PADI instructor and SSI Pro 5000 (5000 verified dives ) as well as a ER & Hyperbaric doctor --has an impressive CV suggest that you refer to :
~~ www.scubaboard.com/community/threads/sam-miller-iii-scubaboards-first-scuba-legend.546182/page-3 ~~
(or read the entire tread to discover how Sam IV and I were taught to repair regulators - a 40 hour course)
B) He has stated many times patients history is of extreme vital importance for to the admitting doctor and nurses.
C) Most admits to ERs and for Hyperbaric treatment with diving related problems are often unconscious and were not accompanied by the important dive history. The treatment therefor is often for the worst case scenario
D) Dive history is becoming better with the advent of the dive computer- All dive accidents that involve hyperbaric RX should always , if possible include the patient's computer
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
During the 1980s and 1990s we in SoCal - where recreational diving began had a loose organization called "The fathers of free diving and spear fishing, " which was composed of as the title describes the fathers of free diving and spear fishing -- The ones who formed basis for "recreational" diving." All began long before Cousteau arrived in the US in 1948 with his bubble machine, long before the exposure suit, personal floatation devices, instrumentation. for many even before fins appeared . These were the men and occasional women who were there in the early days of the sport , some in the 1920s, others in began in the 1930s and the youngsters in the 1940s which included me and my companions who were honored' Allan "O" Woods and Ron Merker, (our own @drbills basic instructor)
We met periodically for a period of about 10 years and soon noticed our ranks were thinning in numbers and those attending were rapidly advancing in age..
It was determined to have one last meeting of what was remaining of the tribe ( no disrespect to native Americans or Canadians First Nations ) but that was our accepted name --no supper duper pooper diver/instructor ...Just a member of "the tribe."
2000 was the date..the last gathering of the tribe.. letters were sent, telephoned calls were made and the fathers world wide responded and attended. This was the last great gathering of a group that was privileged and honored to be a participant and observer of a series of events that occurred for a very short time and never ever will be experienced again up on this earth.
The common thread was hearing aids and orthopedic devices which most all indicated was related to diving
That was 19 years ago all of the tribe from the 20s and 30s have departed to the big reef in the sky and only a smattering remain of the 1940s tribe .My fellow "Fathers" who began with me in the 1940s, Al woods and on Merker are among those in the big reef in the sky
I am now experiencing the long term effect of hyperbaric exposures -- hearing is reduced (a lot!) we all had lots of trauma to the ears, plus exostosis in the EAM, equilibrium difficulties and a minimum amount of dysbaric osteonecrosis, and of course some expected ambulatory difficulties ---.But -- I would not hesitate do it all over again !!!
My dear wife and all my five children, all have been diving in excess of 40 years and all the grand children are on their way as divers . and we are all aware of the possible long term effects
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
fyi
you might want to google
San Diego Bottom Scratcher Spear Fishing club
Long Beach Neptune's Spear Fishing club
Charlie Sturgil
Dr. Sam Miller 111 diver or SCUBA
Dr. Sam Miller, IV ( use numbers in our family )
SAM IV is a NAUI (Life member) PADI instructor and SSI Pro 5000 (5000 verified dives ) as well as a ER & Hyperbaric doctor --has an impressive CV
The message from all this verbiage is "Keep on logging dives ! Any ole way you desire !"
TTFN -- ( Ta Ta For Now )
Sam Miller, 111[/USER]
Basic rule
Log every hyperbaric exposure-- from the swimming pool and your training to mud puddles, quarries to the ocean -- It is all hyperbaric exposure -- the body cannot identify if the water is fresh clear pool water, a mud puddle or ocean salt water if it is 10 feet deep or 100 feet deep. It is all an hyperbaric exposure.
The present generation -- Your generation is the very first generation in the history of man to experience massive often long term hyperbaric exposure. Who knows what effects such exposure will have on health and longevity ?
Based on the very small samples of those who began diving long before the popularity of recreational diving it is possible that audio and equilibrium systems will be impacted as well as orthopedic involvement in the form of aseptic bone necrosis and yet to be identified or named diving maladies
At this junction in the very short history of diving there is no data to determine if this can or will occur
Never the less I would suggest that you log ALL hyperbaric exposures
1) Logging dives has been around for a while -
Initially divers used note books to record what was considered important - most often relating to game
The first official US log book was designed in 1955 (63 years ago) by the late Dick Bonin founder of SCUBA Pro and marketed by the very active but long gone company called "Dive Master:" of Chicago. Dive Master was a full marketing & service facility who published a yearly catalog offered certification classes both in house and via mail order (@drbill your very close personal friend Zale Parry has Dive Master certification #10 --@Marie13 note CHICAGO !)
2) The second dive log was designed by Tom Ebro in 1966 (11 years later - 52 years ago ) As a requirement for the LA County Underwater Instructors Association. Initially for use in the worlds first ADP, the LA CO three (3) month long many dives Advanced Diver Program, aka ADP and for use in the LA Co Underwater Instructor Certification course (UICC), the worlds first underwater training program established in 1954, which continues as the worlds most demanding a prestigious diving instructors training program ,
3) The rest of the diving world did not immediately consider dive logs necessary therefore did not immediately develop dive logs but when the did they used, aka change the cover and copied their dive logs after LA Counties log book.. Now there are many diving logs in every format--so many in so many forms to choose from
4) I am told that some organizations demand logs be maintained and presented as evidence of diving proficiency and recent experience in order to advance to another level
5) I also understand that some resorts now demand logs be presented as evidence of diving proficiency and recent experience in order to dive or participate in specialized activities which are over and above the norm
6) I recommend that you maintain a dive log- and take it on every dive trip and log every dive ASAP after the dive.
Log all that encompass hyperbaric exposure -in deep pool, a mud puddle, a quarry and the ocean- always include date, place depth and time. These entries are not only for your benefit but are invaluable as you certainly realize for the attending or treating doctor and nurses-- now or in the distant future
7) The prestigious SCUBA School's Pro 5000- for consideration of eligibility for the award requires that a verified log demonstrating 5000 dives and recommendation by two SSI Pro 5000 members be submitted prior to even be consideration for the award. (FYI only four members of the SCUBA board are members 1)@Scuba Lawyer[ 2)@Trace Malinowski 3) most recently @Lake Hickory and yours truly since 1969 (?)
Now you know the history of the dive log and its importance I suspect you now know considerably more about the history of the dive log that a majority of the current diving community. Perhaps you can and can share these historical tid bits with your fuzzy faced instructors...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
) My son SAM IV is a NAUI (Life member) PADI instructor and SSI Pro 5000 (5000 verified dives ) as well as a ER & Hyperbaric doctor --has an impressive CV suggest that you refer to :
~~ www.scubaboard.com/community/threads/sam-miller-iii-scubaboards-first-scuba-legend.546182/page-3 ~~
(or read the entire tread to discover how Sam IV and I were taught to repair regulators - a 40 hour course)
B) He has stated many times patients history is of extreme vital importance for to the admitting doctor and nurses.
C) Most admits to ERs and for Hyperbaric treatment with diving related problems are often unconscious and were not accompanied by the important dive history. The treatment therefor is often for the worst case scenario
D) Dive history is becoming better with the advent of the dive computer- All dive accidents that involve hyperbaric RX should always , if possible include the patient's computer
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
During the 1980s and 1990s we in SoCal - where recreational diving began had a loose organization called "The fathers of free diving and spear fishing, " which was composed of as the title describes the fathers of free diving and spear fishing -- The ones who formed basis for "recreational" diving." All began long before Cousteau arrived in the US in 1948 with his bubble machine, long before the exposure suit, personal floatation devices, instrumentation. for many even before fins appeared . These were the men and occasional women who were there in the early days of the sport , some in the 1920s, others in began in the 1930s and the youngsters in the 1940s which included me and my companions who were honored' Allan "O" Woods and Ron Merker, (our own @drbills basic instructor)
We met periodically for a period of about 10 years and soon noticed our ranks were thinning in numbers and those attending were rapidly advancing in age..
It was determined to have one last meeting of what was remaining of the tribe ( no disrespect to native Americans or Canadians First Nations ) but that was our accepted name --no supper duper pooper diver/instructor ...Just a member of "the tribe."
2000 was the date..the last gathering of the tribe.. letters were sent, telephoned calls were made and the fathers world wide responded and attended. This was the last great gathering of a group that was privileged and honored to be a participant and observer of a series of events that occurred for a very short time and never ever will be experienced again up on this earth.
The common thread was hearing aids and orthopedic devices which most all indicated was related to diving
That was 19 years ago all of the tribe from the 20s and 30s have departed to the big reef in the sky and only a smattering remain of the 1940s tribe .My fellow "Fathers" who began with me in the 1940s, Al woods and on Merker are among those in the big reef in the sky
I am now experiencing the long term effect of hyperbaric exposures -- hearing is reduced (a lot!) we all had lots of trauma to the ears, plus exostosis in the EAM, equilibrium difficulties and a minimum amount of dysbaric osteonecrosis, and of course some expected ambulatory difficulties ---.But -- I would not hesitate do it all over again !!!
My dear wife and all my five children, all have been diving in excess of 40 years and all the grand children are on their way as divers . and we are all aware of the possible long term effects
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
fyi
you might want to google
San Diego Bottom Scratcher Spear Fishing club
Long Beach Neptune's Spear Fishing club
Charlie Sturgil
Dr. Sam Miller 111 diver or SCUBA
Dr. Sam Miller, IV ( use numbers in our family )
SAM IV is a NAUI (Life member) PADI instructor and SSI Pro 5000 (5000 verified dives ) as well as a ER & Hyperbaric doctor --has an impressive CV
The message from all this verbiage is "Keep on logging dives ! Any ole way you desire !"
TTFN -- ( Ta Ta For Now )
Sam Miller, 111[/USER]
Sam,
Thanks for reminding me that we don’t really know a lot about long term effects of diving. We are in a time where people live longer and are able to engage in leisure activities to a higher level of intensity than ever before.
Thanks for reminding me that we don’t really know a lot about long term effects of diving. We are in a time where people live longer and are able to engage in leisure activities to a higher level of intensity than ever before.
- Messages
- 5,141
- Reaction score
- 4,136
- # of dives
- 5000 - ∞
Diving at this very moment is the equitant of long forgotten event --Lindbergh when he was reading his air plane the "Spirt of St Louis" to fly cross the Atlantic ocean. Now we jump into a jet, relax, have a meal, . watch the latest movie. take a nap and wake up in an exotic location 1/2 way around the world.
Compare Lindbergh to the current dive profile, avalaiable equipment and knowledge of diving
SDM
Compare Lindbergh to the current dive profile, avalaiable equipment and knowledge of diving
SDM
Log whatever you want. Your logbook is really just for you. In all my years of diving I have never had someone tell me "you sound like an amazing diver... can I pleeeeease read your logbook??!?"
So... record whatever you think will be useful information, for you to use, for yourself, in your future. If you're not sure whether or not a particular bit of data might be useful, err on the side of caution and record it anyway.
Scuba Lawyer
Contributor
MarkThis really is an "each to their own" decision. I suspect different communities will have their own rules of thumb.
The first rule of thumb that I have picked up, thanks to being trained by an agency that used the US Navy Tables (at the time), is that if the surface interval is less than ten minutes, then the second descent (or third descent, or fourth) is a continuation of the same dive. I've done may dives, where there have been five or six segments that I've logged as a single dive. These are often at a new site where we'll be assessing & mapping the bottom, and then popping up to get bearings to references on the shore. I've also had some teaching dives where multiple ascents and descents could have resulted in a dozen dives in a single day if I hadn't used this 10 minute surface interval threshold. As other posters have noted, I've set my Shearwater accordingly to make my life simpler.
I also picked up the rule of thumb (from the instructional staff at the first shop I dove with) that we don't log pool time. It seemed reasonable,but I'd respect a counter-opinion. It is hyperbaric exposure, and there are some surprisingly deep pools out there.
Lastly, any "open water" (non-pool) dive gets logged. I've "explored" some really shallow puddles, hoping to find something interesting, and ended up logging an hour or ninety minutes of swimming around in 6' to 8' of water getting increasingly frustrated. In many cases, the information that I log about the site proves more useful than the dive count or bottom time.
The first rule of thumb that I have picked up, thanks to being trained by an agency that used the US Navy Tables (at the time), is that if the surface interval is less than ten minutes, then the second descent (or third descent, or fourth) is a continuation of the same dive. I've done may dives, where there have been five or six segments that I've logged as a single dive. These are often at a new site where we'll be assessing & mapping the bottom, and then popping up to get bearings to references on the shore. I've also had some teaching dives where multiple ascents and descents could have resulted in a dozen dives in a single day if I hadn't used this 10 minute surface interval threshold. As other posters have noted, I've set my Shearwater accordingly to make my life simpler.
I also picked up the rule of thumb (from the instructional staff at the first shop I dove with) that we don't log pool time. It seemed reasonable,but I'd respect a counter-opinion. It is hyperbaric exposure, and there are some surprisingly deep pools out there.
Lastly, any "open water" (non-pool) dive gets logged. I've "explored" some really shallow puddles, hoping to find something interesting, and ended up logging an hour or ninety minutes of swimming around in 6' to 8' of water getting increasingly frustrated. In many cases, the information that I log about the site proves more useful than the dive count or bottom time.
KentB
Contributor
I count dives as in and out of water regardless of if I swap tanks or not I don’t think I’ve ever exited the water and not swapped tanks though before going back
I have my perdix set to 5 or 10 min of surface time to end the dive. I don’t think surfacing quickly for whatever reason and dropping back down constitutes a second dive.
How you choose to log dives really only matters to you and what you think.
I’ve never been asked for a dive log to sign up for any course and in reality you could have 1000 dives and be a mediocre diver at best you could have 200 dives and be a fairly competent diver.
I also track bottom time as I feel it’s far more telling on experience level than a dive count.
My 2 cents
I have my perdix set to 5 or 10 min of surface time to end the dive. I don’t think surfacing quickly for whatever reason and dropping back down constitutes a second dive.
How you choose to log dives really only matters to you and what you think.
I’ve never been asked for a dive log to sign up for any course and in reality you could have 1000 dives and be a mediocre diver at best you could have 200 dives and be a fairly competent diver.
I also track bottom time as I feel it’s far more telling on experience level than a dive count.
My 2 cents
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I rarely switch tanks during a SI as most of my shallow dives means 2 dives of 30-40 minutes in a day and one tank only. I guess if that were a criteria then maybe my dive count could be almost cut in half.
Chavodel8en
Contributor
Agree w/ all folks who say log as you wish.
For example, I logged a dive that lasted all of 6 minutes.
Local boat dive to Aumentos Rock in Monterey, dropped in to ~ 50 feet, couldn't see my hand at arms length (red tide). Did the 1 minute lost buddy search, then a slow ascent & SS, all with gauges right in front of my eyes, the only way I could barely read them.
I figured that 6 minute dive was more challenging and exercised more of my skills than any of the hour long dives Ive had.
For example, I logged a dive that lasted all of 6 minutes.
Local boat dive to Aumentos Rock in Monterey, dropped in to ~ 50 feet, couldn't see my hand at arms length (red tide). Did the 1 minute lost buddy search, then a slow ascent & SS, all with gauges right in front of my eyes, the only way I could barely read them.
I figured that 6 minute dive was more challenging and exercised more of my skills than any of the hour long dives Ive had.
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