Fire on dive boat Conception in CA

[Joaz Banbeck]

From the aforementioned LA Times article:

John McDevitt, a former assistant fire chief, accredited marine surveyor and chair of a National Fire Protection Assn. committee on boat protection, questioned why both egress points – the stairwell and the hatch – deposited passengers into the galley and adjacent dining area.

“When you put two exits into the same common area, you are not providing two means of egress – it’s still only one,” he said.

 

[StefinSB]

No longer speculation. The statement yesterday from SB Sheriff Brown (who is also the Coroner) states that COD was probable smoke inhalation, and that all the passengers were either unconscious or had already died when the fire reached the bunkroom area.

(For those who want to equivocate, "probable," "likely," "apparent," and other similar terms are often used in these CODs to give a little legal cover and wiggle room down the road should testimony in court be required. Don't look at those words and assume "Well, it could have been something else then." That's the final determination. Once the bodies are released, families are certainly free to have private autopsies conducted, and I'm sure some will, if they think there's more information to be gleaned.)

It is my understanding that being a coroner in many states does not require you to have any medical degree. I am not saying that makes a difference in this case though but somehow it is implied when we hear the word coroner, that there is a pathologist or similarly educated person at work.

 

[KevinNM]

From the aforementioned LA Times article:

John McDevitt, a former assistant fire chief, accredited marine surveyor and chair of a National Fire Protection Assn. committee on boat protection, questioned why both egress points – the stairwell and the hatch – deposited passengers into the galley and adjacent dining area.

“When you put two exits into the same common area, you are not providing two means of egress – it’s still only one,” he said.

Mr Chairman, when was the first time you proposed changing that to the USCG or in the NFPA standards? Who opposed it? How does that tie into the issue of watertight bulkheads? Are you suggesting that people should be exiting via a hatch in a watertight bulkhead? What has the USCG reaction been to that proposal?

 

[george_austin]

Mr Chairman, when was the first time you proposed changing that to the USCG or in the NFPA standards? Who opposed it? How does that tie into the issue of watertight bulkheads? Are you suggesting that people should be exiting via a hatch in a watertight bulkhead? What has the USCG reaction been to that proposal?

Indeed.

 

[george_austin]

It is my understanding that being a coroner in many states does not require you to have any medical degree. I am not saying that makes a difference in this case though but somehow it is implied when we hear the word coroner, that there is a pathologist or similarly educated person at work.

If that's true then what the Sheriff is saying is that the fire started in the bunkroom is the way I'm hearing it. A fire in the galley is going to be blowing toxic smoke away from the passengers Up. Its carrying heat. Heat rises. A galley fire starts and all the smoke detectors go off, Captain energizes the fire alarms and the passengers are alerted to make their evacuation before / while the crew goes to work on the fire. By the time the fire (if they cant extinguish it) reaches the berthing compartment, the passengers are in the water swimming to shore.

The way I see it, a fire (especially if its accompanied by a cloud of hydrogen fluoride big enough to incapacitate the passengers) could only get out of control this quickly if it were to begin in the bunkroom - the only area that your anchor and safety watch wouldn't be checking because everyone's asleep down there and you don't want a crew member down there banging around with her flashlight on.

 

[KevinNM]

Fire in the bunkroom would have been sent hot gasses up the stairs. There is a heat detector in the galley, like 8-10 feet from the stairs.

So I'm not so certain. Hopefully the NTSB will determine that.

 

[NickB-LA]

Sorry, this old hag of a boat should not have been resurrected after it was stolen and beached...

This "old hag of a boat" completed thousands of safe nights at sea before and after it was "stolen and breached".

This was a catastrophic event that overwhelmed a boat that was certified safe and run by an operation with an impeccable reputation.

Your Monday morning QB hyperbole is unproductive and off base.

 

[NickB-LA]

From the aforementioned LA Times article:

John McDevitt, a former assistant fire chief, accredited marine surveyor and chair of a National Fire Protection Assn. committee on boat protection, questioned why both egress points – the stairwell and the hatch – deposited passengers into the galley and adjacent dining area.

“When you put two exits into the same common area, you are not providing two means of egress – it’s still only one,” he said.

That design is what was required by the Coast Guard, as has been explained repeatedly in this thread.

 

[Kelp Boy]

I just reread ‘bowlofpetunias’ summary from 0528 this morning. I’m a better instigator than peace maker, but I do like BARBless fly fishing.

Was there a “night watchman”? Absolutely! The record states that a crew member made the rounds at 0230 and verified that the galley was cold. The concern and frustration of many, myself included, comes from the next statement. A crew member woke sometime between 0300 and 0314 in response to a sound downstairs. This is absolutely NOT what I would expect to read. I would expect something like:

0245: Crew member looked out forward and side facing windows. All appeared well.
0300: Crew member began a walk around. Crew member opened the aft facing door and found the stairwell to the main deck already blocked by fire. Crew member alerted captain and crew.

Instead, the first reported crew action AFTER the fire broke out was to “wake up.” Why was a crew member awoken by a sound downstairs rather than by the “night watchman”?

That said, please don’t make any assumption about what happened between 0230 and 0314. If we must discuss this, which I feel is unavoidable, how about we use the expression “crew watch incapacitated” rather than using other expressions that imply fault? Incapacity may be caused by a medical event. Incapacity could be caused by tripping over a giant lobster and hitting one’s head. [Yeah, I know lobster season hasn’t started yet. But you know those big buggers like to climb up the anchor rope in search of a legal sized human to bring home for dinner.]

Chill.

 

[tursiops]

That design is what was required by the Coast Guard, as has been explained repeatedly in this thread.

It is pretty clear the CG requirements are biased by trying to avoid sinking/drowning; fire is not a primary issue. Otherwise, horizontal escape to the next compartment would be more acceptable. Vertical escape is good for water coming up....