Current top drysuits for rec diving

[loosenit2]

Without regard to price, what do you consider to be the current top 3 - 5 drysuit models for cold water rec diving?

As you probably picked up on there is no real consensus.

 

[Searcaigh]

I have 105 dives on my Rofos suit over the past four years and very happy with it. Light Monkey pee valve and soft neoprene socks with Si-Tek self changeable neck and wrist seals.

I only use a drysuit locally for 3-4 months a year. Coming into summer months the challenge is preparing for a 10C+ change in temperature from 22/23C water temps to 33C+ air temps. Kitting up in warm weather for cold water can be a challenge. It's easier when diving in Scotland when it's always cold.

 

[lexvil]

DUI makes good suits and I like the zip seal but the thing I don’t like is the cost, when a friend had to buy new seals and it was $140 for the wrists and the same with the neck seal, that was just nuts, granted the si-tech at retail are pricy too but not on that scale and with a little searching nice discounts can be found unlike DUI.

The past few weeks I’ve been diving a pinnacle blackice and since I bout it used didn’t cost to much, it has the neck ring already since the previous owner had the neoprene seal replaced with it, the latex wrist seals worked with the Ultima dry glove system perfectly, this is my favorite suit right now, very warm as I’ve been diving it with only a double base layer, front zip neoprene is what I’ve been waiting for from Seaskin, hopefully they come out with one before I need to replace this.

 

[stuartv]

O'Three is top

You rated a lot of suits higher than a Seaskin. What makes an O'Three suit better than a Seaskin suit?

I’m in the market as well and the LDS is recommending DUI, Yukon2 or 350. He is telling me the zip seals are the most important feature.

Zip Seals would be my absolute last choice of something to have on a suit.

They are RIDICULOUSLY expensive. A Zip neck seal doesn't work any better than having a Si Tech Quick Neck system (unless you are so slender that a Quick Neck ring ends up underneath your BCD shoulder straps and that makes it uncomfortable for you). And a Quick Neck lets you use latex or silicone seals, like a Zip would, but the Quick Neck also allows you to use a replaceable neoprene neck seal, which I think is not available for a Zip neck. Having gotten one recently and dived with it for 2 days, I am now a big fan of neoprene neck seals.

And the Zip wrist seals or dry gloves suck (in my opinion). You have to attach your gloves to your suit before you don the top half of your suit. Any other system (that I know of) allows you to fully don the suit, get all the rest of your gear on, and put your dry gloves on last. That is MUCH preferable (to me, anyway). Plus, I *think* (could be wrong, though!) that you cannot have zip seals on the wrist AND dry gloves. I.e. if you have dry gloves on, you cannot have a wrist seal, too. So, if your dry glove gets a hole in it, there is nothing to stop your whole sleeve (or suit) from flooding. Other systems let you have a wrist seal and a dry glove at the same time.

Looking at @Dive Right In Scuba's website, a pair of Zip wrist seals are $98. A Zip neck seal is $138.

Ordering from Seaskin, a silicone neck seal for a Quick Neck system is USD$20 (w/o VAT). A pair of silicone wrist seals (that would fit most any non-Zip wrist ring system) is USD$15.


Personally, I can't say what suit is best. I have not looked at nearly all of them. But, I have looked at Santi E.lite, Waterproof D1, D7, D9X (owned one), Bare XCS2 Tech (owned one), many other Bare models, Ursuit Softdura, Fourth Element Argonaut, ScubaPro (neo and trilam), Hollis, DUI (various models), Mobby's, Otter Atlantic, O'Three neoprene, Aqualung/White's, and I think some others that I can't remember right now. I used to work for a shop that sold Bare, DUI, Mobby's, Waterproof, Fourth Element, Hollis, and ScubaPro. That shop actually stocked drysuits from all of those.

I currently own 2 Seaskins - 1 compressed neoprene and 1 trilam. Regardless of price, I don't think there is any suit I have seen that I thought was BETTER quality than the Seaskin suits I have. Some of them seem to be just as good quality, but that is the best I can say about any of them. And, I have not seen any other drysuit manufacturer that offered as many options, to allow you to get a suit that is EXACTLY what you want. When I ordered my first Seaskin, they were literally the only manufacturer (out of all the ones I listed) that could make my suit to my measurements and with all the specific options I wanted (e.g. Kubi dryglove rings, Si Tech Quick Neck, zippered thigh pockets, and attached compressed neoprene socks - for a starter list). Just my opinion, of course. And when you factor in the price, there is no other suit I personally would buy right now.

I also have this feeling that a lot of experienced drysuit divers kind of ignore or poo-poo Seaskin because of the price (and because they are not - or haven't been - very well known). "Never heard of them. They're so cheap they can't be very good." I think those people do themselves a disservice. My gut sense is that they are so inexpensive because they have really figured out how to streamline and automate a lot of their process for making made-to-measure suits - where other places are probably still doing a LOT more of the work of doing made-to-measure manually. So, less expensive because they do it more efficiently AND because they sell direct, with no middlemen.

Dry Suits from Seaskin Custom Drysuits home page - Seaskin Custom Diving Suits

Edit: Disclaimer: I think Seaskin was the only manufacturer where I could go on their website and see the prices and order exactly what I wanted. But, I do think there may have been 1 or possibly 2 manufacturers where I could have also ordered exactly what I want - but only by emailing back and forth explaining what I wanted and waiting for responses to quote me prices. For example, I think I could have possibly gotten all the same options (and MTM) from Otter. If I was willing to put the time in to getting the order sorted out and placed. And for almost double the price. Both my Seaskin suits, I just want on to their website, entered my measurements, picked my options, paid, and waited for the confirmation email - and then the suit to arrive. VERY easy.

 

[tbone1004]

@stuartv the neoprene is much higher quality, as is the overall construction. Nothing against Seaskin, but I would consider that more of a disposable suit that I'd use if I was wiggling around. Nothing against it, but when suits are that cheap, you're usually OK with beating them up.

With regards to the specifics of ordering. The suit manufacturers typically align with either Apeks or Si-Tech, not both for their valves. If they align with Apeks, then you aren't going to get Si-Tech options, or vice versa.

Right now a basic spec is about L700 with VAT. A couple hundred cheaper than a comparable O3. One of the things that is going to contribute to a good chunk of that cash is the seam tape that goes on the O3's but not on the Seaskins. They both triple glued and blind stitch, but Seaskin paints a urethane sealant over the seams. O3 goes in and actually chemically cures and bonds the seams and then goes in with a nylon backed neoprene tape on top of it. This protects against abrasion and also helps to hold the seams together when they are being pulled on. You get a lot more panels put on there as well which help. Is it worth it? That's a different discussion, but I think the O3 is definitely a higher quality suit. If I was doing a lot of wreck diving or a lot more squeezy sidemount stuff I'd be much more tempted to get the Seaskin as a suit that I have no issue abusing. For that I usually dive wet though

 

[BoltSnap]

@stuartv the neoprene is much higher quality, as is the overall construction. Nothing against Seaskin, but I would consider that more of a disposable suit that I'd use if I was wiggling around. Nothing against it, but when suits are that cheap, you're usually OK with beating them up. With regards to the specifics of ordering. The suit manufacturers typically align with either Apeks or Si-Tech, not both for their valves. If they align with Apeks, then you aren't going to get Si-Tech options, or vice versa. Right now a basic spec is about L700 with VAT. A couple hundred cheaper than a comparable O3. One of the things that is going to contribute to a good chunk of that cash is the seam tape that goes on the O3's but not on the Seaskins. They both triple glued and blind stitch, but Seaskin paints a urethane sealant over the seams. O3 goes in and actually chemically cures and bonds the seams and then goes in with a nylon backed neoprene tape on top of it. This protects against abrasion and also helps to hold the seams together when they are being pulled on. You get a lot more panels put on there as well which help. Is it worth it? That's a different discussion, but I think the O3 is definitely a higher quality suit. If I was doing a lot of wreck diving or a lot more squeezy sidemount stuff I'd be much more tempted to get the Seaskin as a suit that I have no issue abusing. For that I usually dive wet though

Do you know that O3 makes Tri-Laminate Drysuits too now?

90Ninety | OThree Custom Drysuits

 

[stuartv]

@stuartv the neoprene is much higher quality, as is the overall construction. Nothing against Seaskin, but I would consider that more of a disposable suit that I'd use if I was wiggling around. Nothing against it, but when suits are that cheap, you're usually OK with beating them up.

With regards to the specifics of ordering. The suit manufacturers typically align with either Apeks or Si-Tech, not both for their valves. If they align with Apeks, then you aren't going to get Si-Tech options, or vice versa.

Right now a basic spec is about L700 with VAT. A couple hundred cheaper than a comparable O3. One of the things that is going to contribute to a good chunk of that cash is the seam tape that goes on the O3's but not on the Seaskins. They both triple glued and blind stitch, but Seaskin paints a urethane sealant over the seams. O3 goes in and actually chemically cures and bonds the seams and then goes in with a nylon backed neoprene tape on top of it. This protects against abrasion and also helps to hold the seams together when they are being pulled on. You get a lot more panels put on there as well which help. Is it worth it? That's a different discussion, but I think the O3 is definitely a higher quality suit. If I was doing a lot of wreck diving or a lot more squeezy sidemount stuff I'd be much more tempted to get the Seaskin as a suit that I have no issue abusing. For that I usually dive wet though

Earlier you said "O'Three is top." I.e. it's better than any other brand's trilam, as well. Do you mean that their neo suit is the best neo on the market and their trilam is the best trilam? Or do you mean that the O'Three Ri 2-100 (or some other model?) is the best drysuit on the market, period?

Seaskin does offer your choice of Si Tech or Apeks. Or you can mix and match. Apeks inflator and Si Tech dump, for example, if you want.

Seaskin also offers your choice of dry glove systems, including Si Tech, Kubi, and (I think?) some others.

I'm not sure what you mean by "a basic spec is about L700 with VAT". One of the other SB members just posted in the last day or so that he ordered a Seaskin neoprene suit and it was USD$575. He said the base version was something like USD$480? I think he said that was even with shipping.

Looking at their websites, the O'Three Ri 2-100 says "complete and ready to dive for 1295 GBP."

The Seaskin neo suit is 426 GBP. That is including VAT. That IS the base model, with no options. Optioned out to match what comes standard on the O3, it is 527 GBP (which is USD$515, after taking out VAT and converting to US). $515 (+ shipping) for a made to measure, well-optioned compressed neoprene suit....

That is way more than "a couple hundred" difference. Am I comparing the Seaskin to the wrong O3?

What you said about the seams translates in my brain as "Seaskin does not tape their seams." This is the inside of my Seaskin neoprene suit. If that's not taped seams, then what am I looking at? You're saying that is just urethane sealant? I thought it was seam tape. But, I guess it might not be. I am no expert on this stuff.

 

[tbone1004]

Do you know that O3 makes Tri-Laminate Drysuits too now?

90Ninety | OThree Custom Drysuits

I do indeed, haven't seen one in person yet though, so can't comment on them.

@stuartv I would argue that their Ri 2-100 and 1-100 are the best suits on the market.
My comment on the L700 price was to get one spec'd to somewhere close to an O3 so you are comparing apples to apples.
The RI 2-100 is not fair to compare to seaskin, it is a completely different beast. The port10 and MSF suits are a bit more fair to compare. Seaskin is using normal neoprene that has been compressed in a chamber similar to how the DUI suits are made. It works, but they are not depth stable. The Ri series uses a resin impregnated neoprene that makes it depth stable and also significantly more durable to abrasion.
That "tape" is a bit convoluted. It is sold in "tape" form, but there is no structure to it, so it's not really "tape" in the traditional sense. What is on the O3 suits is actually a woven nylon piece of fabric, with neoprene glued to it, which then has the urethane against the drysuit to form the seam.
The normal urethane works perfectly fine, but it's not particularly abrasion resistant and will stick to undergarments. The laminate tape that O3 uses has a neoprene exterior so you won't have sticky points.

All of that is very minor stuff, but the Ri series is not your average neoprene drysuit.

 

[stuartv]

The RI 2-100 is not fair to compare to seaskin, it is a completely different beast. The port10 and MSF suits are a bit more fair to compare. Seaskin is using normal neoprene that has been compressed in a chamber similar to how the DUI suits are made. It works, but they are not depth stable. The Ri series uses a resin impregnated neoprene that makes it depth stable and also significantly more durable to abrasion.
That "tape" is a bit convoluted. It is sold in "tape" form, but there is no structure to it, so it's not really "tape" in the traditional sense. What is on the O3 suits is actually a woven nylon piece of fabric, with neoprene glued to it, which then has the urethane against the drysuit to form the seam.
The normal urethane works perfectly fine, but it's not particularly abrasion resistant and will stick to undergarments. The laminate tape that O3 uses has a neoprene exterior so you won't have sticky points.

All of that is very minor stuff, but the Ri series is not your average neoprene drysuit.

Depth stable? The Seaskin is 3mm compressed neoprene. Compared to an Ri 2-100, how much actual difference is there in buoyancy at depth when you compare the 2? Even regular 3 mm (not-compressed) neoprene doesn't compress to make THAT much difference to buoyancy...

To make sure I'm understanding you, the abrasion resistance advantage of the seam tape is resistance to abrasion from your undergarments, right? Also on that front, Seaskin does recommend that you apply talc to all the seams on the inside of their suits, so that they do not stick to your undergarments. They even have a video on it. It's very simple and easy with the talc and bag they provide with each suit. And it does seem to work.

I'll grant you that the Ri 2-100 could be a higher quality suit. I mean, I trust your judgment, so I am perfectly prepared to believe that. But, the Seaskin is high quality (even if it's not quite AS high). And, I would definitely rather have two Seaskins and some change for the price of one Ri 2-100. Having a suit to use while your other suit is off getting a new zipper or whatever seems very handy...

That said, the OP specified "irrespective of price". So, I can accept Ri 2-100 as the answer. At least, for people for whom a neoprene suit is acceptable. If I only had 1 suit, it would be a trilam, for the better travel ability.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

O'three suit

Dui 450clx

Scubapro

Not ScubaPro. The Evertec that I purchased is the worst piece of scuba gear I've ever purchased. Definitely stay away.

ScubaPro needs to stick to regs and fins.

For DUI, I'd add the Flex Extreme. Some of my students have been quite happy with theirs.