Teric not Accepted as Primary Dive Computer?

[tridacna]

CMIIW but the Teric can concurrently display the Compass dot on its screen thus delivering MORE info than the Perdix.

 

[lexvil]

Totally aside but for those semi scuba police out there who wring their hands over “tech” training and all the things you “can’t do” with out training (not saying the training isn’t a good idea) John was a pioneer who led most the crazy things that are done today, before “tech” it was just diving.

I think he is wrong about the Teric but his program his rules.

 

[stuartv]

Well, I think John is probably right. From what I have heard about him, I suspect he is correct. Meaning, his reputation is such that I doubt he would say that unless he had verified it for himself.

And from earlier posts in this thread, it may be that he setups up a Perdix to show things like @+5, and other things that most people do not use, on the main screen, so you can see it all without touching any buttons. And maybe with what he configures to show there, you cannot configure a Teric, even in OC Tec/Standard (i.e. 4 rows) mode to show all those things at the same time.

That is why I'm asking the question. And why I asked if somebody could post a picture of a Perdix screen that is setup the way JC has his students set theirs up. Or at least tell in detail how the screen is configured. Or screens, if he uses two and has them set differently.

I understand his other reason. If you can't change GF Hi during a dive, well, I think that is valid as a reason for him to reject using one as a primary. So, the question about what is displayed is purely academic. I would just like to know the answer.

For the people who seem bitter about rejecting a Teric because it doesn't allow you to change the GF Hi... well, @doctormike has already explained it pretty well. There are various reasons one might want to adjust it up OR down. It just depends on the specifics of the dive. But, while you may think that riding GF99 or SurfGF is so close to the same that it doesn't matter, it seems we all do agree that it is NOT the same. So, it's down to your judgment of whether it's "close enough".

And, so far, I haven't seen anybody weigh in and say it's "close enough" that seems to have remotely the credentials or experience that JC does, for making that judgment call... Personally, I think it probably is totally close enough - when your deco obligations don't even start until you get up to 10 or 20 or 30 feet. But, when your first deco stop is at 120', then I think it makes more of a difference - and maybe that difference DOES matter at that point. I certainly do not have enough experience with diving that deep to gainsay John Chatterton.

 

[Mike1967]

Wow, that's a massive back pedal. After reading 10 pages of this thread, what was said in the last one that caused such a turn around?

 

[Manatee Diver]

Preface: I've never taken a JC class, and I have no real desire to.

But I talked with @tmassey about why this is the case. It makes sense, JC teaches a specific way, and these are his tools to do it. If you want to take his class you use his methods. If don't want to use his methods there are dozens of tech instructors in South Florida, sure few have books written about them, but they will teach you using a variety of methods and equipment one will surely match up with your preferences.

 

[ChuckP]

Well, I think John is probably right. From what I have heard about him, I suspect he is correct. Meaning, his reputation is such that I doubt he would say that unless he had verified it for himself.

And from earlier posts in this thread, it may be that he setups up a Perdix to show things like @+5, and other things that most people do not use, on the main screen, so you can see it all without touching any buttons. And maybe with what he configures to show there, you cannot configure a Teric, even in OC Tec/Standard (i.e. 4 rows) mode to show all those things at the same time.

That is why I'm asking the question. And why I asked if somebody could post a picture of a Perdix screen that is setup the way JC has his students set theirs up. Or at least tell in detail how the screen is configured. Or screens, if he uses two and has them set differently.

I understand his other reason. If you can't change GF Hi during a dive, well, I think that is valid as a reason for him to reject using one as a primary. So, the question about what is displayed is purely academic. I would just like to know the answer.

For the people who seem bitter about rejecting a Teric because it doesn't allow you to change the GF Hi... well, @doctormike has already explained it pretty well. There are various reasons one might want to adjust it up OR down. It just depends on the specifics of the dive. But, while you may think that riding GF99 or SurfGF is so close to the same that it doesn't matter, it seems we all do agree that it is NOT the same. So, it's down to your judgment of whether it's "close enough".

And, so far, I haven't seen anybody weigh in and say it's "close enough" that seems to have remotely the credentials or experience that JC does, for making that judgment call... Personally, I think it probably is totally close enough - when your deco obligations don't even start until you get up to 10 or 20 or 30 feet. But, when your first deco stop is at 120', then I think it makes more of a difference - and maybe that difference DOES matter at that point. I certainly do not have enough experience with diving that deep to gainsay John Chatterton.

I'll set my computers back the way we had them in class and take pics for you. I think his class evolves somewhat - my class one year ago, a guy had two terics and I could have swore there was a download issue but heck that was a year ago and might have been laptop related too. I know we looked at the guys dives because he had set an incorrect bottom gas and it wasn't changed till 15 minutes or so into the dive, even his backup was incorrect.......

He wants you looking at a lot of things while hanging, the flash cards is one way and it's real easy to just glance at a primary or backup to answer the question verses scrolling.

The GF Hi thing, part of class, part of theory. I too am of the opinion that 150' dive is "baby" deco somewhat as compared to 200-300' (I have very little experience in the 200') and I think even though you may be in a AN/Deco class - he's setting you up for a train of thought in the 300' range. Log dives, plan dives in the 150-170' range and you begin to get accustomed to what your deco schedules will be, like you said, when your first stop is 120-150', different story. It's his way of skinning the cat while other ways are talked about in class.

I like the Teric, if I wore a watch, I think I'd own one. I don't think he's negative on them, it just doesn't fit within his established evolving class. I'll reset my computers here in a bit and take some pictures

 

[Jay]

... So, the question about what is displayed is purely academic. I would just like to know the answer.

...

...But, while you may think that riding GF99 or SurfGF is so close to the same that it doesn't matter, it seems we all do agree that it is NOT the same. So, it's down to your judgment of whether it's "close enough".

And, so far, I haven't seen anybody weigh in and say it's "close enough" that seems to have remotely the credentials or experience that JC does, for making that judgment call... Personally, I think it probably is totally close enough - when your deco obligations don't even start until you get up to 10 or 20 or 30 feet. But, when your first deco stop is at 120', then I think it makes more of a difference - and maybe that difference DOES matter at that point. I certainly do not have enough experience with diving that deep to gainsay John Chatterton.

re display Q: I think the "display" issue was merely due to the inability to display a modified GFHi.

re GF99 and SurfGF: A Tec Instructor recently said to me about comparing GF99 and SurfGF upon assent, and that one would want that difference to be in the 30-40 range for efficient offgassing (e.g. having a GF of 1% and a much higher SurfGF means you’re not efficiently offgassing). The comment was said in the context of his typical Tec dives (he's also RB) as opposed to Rec depths.

IDK how the 'close enough' comment works from say a 60m ascent, but I suspect it doesn't work very well. A play with EFX's latest SS should tell us, I think it's the only tool that displays both GF99 and SurfGF.

FWIW I found the 30-40 range advice applicable to some Rec dives which pushed NDL to, or close to zero (I'm running GF99/99); it helped influence how much of the SS was a 6m vs. 3m on those dive, and IIRC on more benign Rec dives it suggested a SS closer to 3m than 6m (I have my Teric set to 6m).

 

[tmassey]

Assuming you mean in the context of this thread (class with JC): Nothing. There is nothing that the Perdix can display that the Teric can’t that’s relevant for the class. Nothing. One more time: the issue with the Teric is in no way related to anything related to information display on a Teric.

Your question is a non-sequitor. It’s like asking, “have you stop beating your wife?” It Presupposes a piece of information that is incorrect.

If you’re asking for that information in general, I can’t help you: I’ve never used a Teric, never looked at the manual, and never looked at what it can display. My general understanding is, that there isn’t anything that the Perdix can display that the Teric can’t. That’s probably your assumption as well, which is why you keep asking this question. What I don’t understand is, why do you think the problem with the Terric has anything to do with the information it can or cannot display?

Again, this is all in the context of the class.

if you’re still confused, message me your telephone number: I think this would go much easier if it was actually a two way conversation!

 

[tmassey]

To expand upon the Terric issue not being an information display problem: when I took the class, I only had a single computer. That meant that every time he asked me a question, I have to push the button 50 times in order to get to the right screen to show the information I was looking for. That was not a problem within the class. My buddy had two computers, and he didn’t have to do that. John had two computers and he didn’t have to do that. But I only had one, and so I had to.

A Terric user could’ve done the same thing that I did with my Perdix. Except, of course, change GF hi, which was a required element of the class. That was the biggest reason in the water why the Terric was not acceptable.

At least, in my understanding and recollection.

 

[saxman242]

What I don’t understand is, why do you think the problem with the Terric has anything to do with the information it can display.

I'm guessing it's because the first post said the reasoning given was "The Teric is okay for backup, but not acceptable as a Primary as it does not give you all the dive data of the Perdix/Petrel."

Now, that could be interpreted as it doesn't display the same data on the screen or it could be interpreted as it doesn't log the same data and provide it for review.