Frog kicking and ankle flexibility

[BlueTrin]

Apparently I am not clapping my fins properly when I frog kick, i.e. the fins are not rotated enough towards each other resulting in a sub optimal kick.

I know that there were a few issues that I worked on (my knees were too close to each other) and some others I cannot do so much about it (my drysuit is a bit tight on the thigh and I use rock boots instead of tech soles).

Aside from this, is there some exercise you can do for ankle flexibility to be able to rotate the feet against each other that would translate in 'clapping' better ? I do some ankle flexibility exercise when I train but never specifically in the direction where the soles would be facing each other.

PS: I wish I had a video to share, but the training pools are closed and it's hard for me to find someone who is willing to stay and take a video of me underwater at the quarry

 

[RyanT]

Indeed, videos are always ideal and it's possible that you're having some ankle flexibility issues. My first go-to, however, would not be the ankles. The ankle joint by nature does not have a large range of motion and this is necessary for stability since this joint bears virtually all of your weight (on land). The first thing you might consider is if you're rotating your hips enough. When you say your drysuit is a little tight on your thighs it makes me think that might be limiting your hip rotation a bit.

 

[EireDiver606]

First, what fins are you using? Short, rigid fins with an thick rim on the side are best for most kicks especially the frog kick.

Second, you have to scoop the water not push it if that makes sense.

Third, get soft soles not boots. These will give you a better feel for the fin and allow more flexibility.

 

[Hank49]

Short, rigid fins are best for a quick burst to catch a barreling shore break wave. I find them fairly useless for scuba or free diving.

 

[Still Kicking]

Short, rigid fins with lots of hard edges (Jets and their kin) are best for frog kicking and close-quarter maneuvering.

Longer blades (ie levers) with moderate stiffness and possibly venting near the toe of the foot pocket are more efficient for straight line flutter/scissor kicking but that isn't what the OP is looking to acheive.

 

[Hank49]

Short, rigid fins with lots of hard edges (Jets and their kin) are best for frog kicking and close-quarter maneuvering.

Longer blades (ie levers) with moderate stiffness and possibly venting near the toe of the foot pocket are more efficient for straight line flutter/scissor kicking but that isn't what the OP is looking to acheive.

Understood. But frog kicking can be achieved using carbon fiber free dive fins. It's technique, not type of fin.
And yes, short fins with rigid edges (like Duck Feet) are good for quick change of direction, like sprinting into an 8 foot grinding wave, doing a 180 turn and catching it. But we don't do that scuba diving

 

[EireDiver606]

@Hank49 we are talking about frog kicking not surfing or freediving.

Freedive fins are for sure not good for frog kicking. It’s possible to frog kick in them yes but how powerful will those fins propel you with double steel 12s and an al80? Not very far if at all.

You may find them fairly useless for scuba diving, yet what would you know if you suggest freediving fins when the OP asks for advice on frogkicking while scubadiving. This is a diving forum not a surfing/ freediving one.

 

[Hank49]

@Hank49 we are talking about frog kicking not surfing or freediving.

Freedive fins are for sure not good for frog kicking. It’s possible to frog kick in them yes but how powerful will those fins propel you with double steel 12s and an al80? Not very far if at all.

You may find them fairly useless for scuba diving, yet what would you know if you suggest freediving fins when the OP asks for advice on frogkicking while scubadiving. This is a diving forum not a surfing/ freediving one.

You missed my point. Short, stiff fins are not the best for every kick. Have you ever used carbon fiber "free dive" fins? I doubt it.

 

[Still Kicking]

You missed my point. Short, stiff fins are not the best for every kick. Have you ever used carbon fiber "free dive" fins? I doubt it.

I use carbon fins for freediving - they are awesome and powerful for straight line kicking.

I don't use them for scuba, where i prefer the control and maneuverabilty that i get with Jetfins, and i frog kick most of the time.

If you prefer long blades that's cool but they don't work as well *for most people* when frog kicking.

 

[Hank49]

Most don't ever really learn to use free dive fins. A mere ankle flick lets the fin do the work. The belief that long blades require more energy is false. Yes, you can kick hard and move faster but again, but the fin doesn't require more energy.... let the fin do the work.
I've used many different fins over the last 40 years. Anything other than a good carbon fiber blade feels like I'm barefoot.