"Overfilling" faber lp 85,95

[mempilot]

Whips are more likely to let lose on a regular basis. I've been there when they do and it's no fun. The AL failures have gotten everyone in an uproar, as it should, for those tanks. But, it seems that is has spilled over to a set of tanks with a pretty clean track record. I'm not saying it can't happen though. Fill slow, fill cool.

 

[Inspector]

Ya know what I don't get, is why people put it in writing, in a public forum, boasting actually, that they routinely break the law by filling their cylinders beyond their rated service pressure. It's not much different than cheating on your taxes and then posting a classified ad in your local newspaper to that effect. So, does anyone here really care, is this string monitored or policed? Probably not. But in the unlikely event that YOUR cylinder should ever fail and this string comes to light in the subsequent investigation, you're screwed. jeffadams@psicylinders.com PSI Istructor # 065

 

[Dive4Life]

Ya know what I don't get, is why people put it in writing, in a public forum, boasting actually, that they routinely break the law by filling their cylinders beyond their rated service pressure. It's not much different than cheating on your taxes and then posting a classified ad in your local newspaper to that effect. So, does anyone here really care, is this string monitored or policed? Probably not. But in the unlikely event that YOUR cylinder should ever fail and this string comes to light in the subsequent investigation, you're screwed. jeffadams@psicylinders.com PSI Istructor # 065

You have a very good point and it seems that this issue is a rather serious one in the SCUBA industry. Usually change and REGULATION don't occur unless people die and hopefully we will be able to prevent this from happening in the SCUBA industry. (Some change would be nice.) This seems to be a case from the Jacksonian era, "Marshall has made his ruling, now lets see him enforce it."

 

[KOMPRESSOR]

I'm considering faber lp 85 or 95 tanks, and have heard that, outside the US, Faber lp tanks are rated at a higher working pressure. Is this why many faber/oms tank owners routinely "overfill" their tanks, and if so, what is the normal overfill pressure for steel tanks with a working pressure of 2400+?

"Over here" we usually operate with either 200, 232 or 300 bar. Filling is very often a 10% top, at least when filling warm air that will loose pressure when it cools off.

Regarding the Fabers I know that often, but not always, you'll find the same tanks with either 200 or 232 bar, and that the producer simply uprates an excisting product from 200 to 232 bar. This is absolutely not always so, and you have no guarantee YOUR 200 bar tank is the same as the one that has been uprated.

If you top a 232 bar tank with 10%, you're into pressures that will blow your gasket if your tank is equipped with YOKE valve. Now here many divers use DIN valves, and they can very well be certified to the 232 bar WP.

Up north in dry suit countries like Norway, 300 bar is also very common, and that's what I use. Faber 12 Litres 300 bar with 300 bar DIN valve, not the same DIN as for the 200/232 bar system.

And we "all" use steel tanks if you wonder. (Alu is for deco and warm water!)

 

[wgasa]

Fill fabers in icewater to 3800 and they cool to 4100 ! Fill icy cold you will not regret it !

 

[KOMPRESSOR]

Fill fabers in icewater to 3800 and they cool to 4100 ! Fill icy cold you will not regret it !

Especially if you love rust inside your steel tanks...

 

[stoddu]

Aqua,

I'm not arguing with you. You have an opinion. I have an opinion. Playing devil's advocate is not arguing. It is presenting the other side.

My OMS/Fabers are stamped 2640. My friends are stamped 2400. My calculations are correct for my tanks.

If a tank is going to explose at 3000, then why not hydro it for 3000, or 2900? A lot of tech shops don't agree with you. I'm sorry, but that is the case. You don't have to dive with me. You don't have to even go on the same boat. But I suggest that if you are concerned with everyones pressure in their tanks, that you ask them if in cave country or wreck country before hand.

BTW, my tanks will get hydro'd every 2.5 years instead of every five. I fill them to 3000 about 52 times a year. They will get visually inspected every 6 months, and the valves get OH'd at this time. I've never had a steel tank that failed any of these procedures. When I sell them, the buyer beware. I let them know that the tanks were overfilled. I also let them know that they were inspected much more often than required. If they are not educated on the filling specs, then they shouldn't be buying tanks. It is not my liability. I took care of maintenance. It is their decision whether to use them or not.

People drive their cars over the speed limit all the time, sell them, and then stuff breaks. Are the original owner liable. No.

Again. I'm not arguing. I stated the facts about my tanks. You say I don't understand what I'm talking about. That's pretty harsh. Be nice. No one is attacking you.

Mempilot,
You need to look up the definition of devil's advocate in the dictionary.

 

[mempilot]

Mempilot,
You need to look up the definition of devil's advocate in the dictionary.

The definition I found:

"One who argues against a cause or position to determine the validity of the cause or position."

 

[stoddu]

By definition you are arguing with Aqua. Devil's advocate is not just presenting the other side, it is arguing against the opposing side. My dictionary goes ao far as to state that devil's advocate is "upholding the wrong side for argument's sake."

 

[mempilot]

Ya know what I don't get, is why people put it in writing, in a public forum, boasting actually, that they routinely break the law by filling their cylinders beyond their rated service pressure. It's not much different than cheating on your taxes and then posting a classified ad in your local newspaper to that effect. So, does anyone here really care, is this string monitored or policed? Probably not. But in the unlikely event that YOUR cylinder should ever fail and this string comes to light in the subsequent investigation, you're screwed. jeffadams@psicylinders.com PSI Istructor # 065

Please post a link to the 'law' or 'regulation' (there is a difference) regarding overfilling of gas cylinders. I've been searching the DOT website and can't find it. I see fines issued to companies that improperly hydro tested tanks, but can't find anything on fines or legal actions for overfilling.

BTW, cheating on your taxes is a felony punishable by jail. If you can show me that overfilling a tank is the same thing by providing the written law and consequences, then I will stop having my tanks overfilled.