3 day or 4 day courses

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diver 85:
bet the online scuba equipment sales companies don't mind this approach....


Actually, you have to determine the physical dive shop you will align yourself with to buy the materials to do the class online. You then go to that dive shop either closest to you or at a resort, where you will vacation to take the water portion. Online businesses won't fare better.

It is not all bad since many students don't do the homework they should in regular classes. This course will include testing and remediation. The instructor only has to do the water activities and not read the book to people who never cracked their manuals.
 
Charlie59:
Actually, you have to determine the physical dive shop you will align yourself with to buy the materials to do the class online. You then go to that dive shop either closest to you or at a resort, where you will vacation to take the water portion. Online businesses won't fare better.

It is not all bad since many students don't do the homework they should in regular classes. This course will include testing and remediation. The instructor only has to do the water activities and not read the book to people who never cracked their manuals.
How about we do the same with the drivers license?
Let people hook some boxes online and we trust they know what they answered and just hand them the keys to a car so they can drive around our neighbourhood?
 
I'd go with the 4 day course over the three. The pool day can be a long one, some people can be pretty tired by the end of it and won't get as much out of dive one as they could. Same thing with trying to do dives 2,3 and 4 on the same day. Do get the materials in advance and go through them fully, you'll be much better off for it.
 
caseylary:
wow I wrote that and what a response!

Just to inform people, this was the schedule given to me by the school:

Here is the four day program;

Day 1; Classroom session (8am - 4pm)
Day 2; Pool session (8am - 4pm)
Day 3; Two ocean dives (8am -11am, or 11am - 2pm - depends on tide)
Day 4; Two ocean dives (7am - 5pm)

Here is the three day program;

Day 1; Classroom session (8am - 4pm)
Day 2; Pool session & one ocean dive (8am - 6pm)
Day 3; Three ocean dives (7am - 7pm)
OK, I'm at the extreme other end:

Lecture 1: Course procedures and requirements. Fill out application, statement of understanding and medical form.

Pool 1: Swim Test, Lung Volume test, Buoyancy test, circuit swim.

Lecture 2: Diving equipment Part I - Free diving gear.

Pool 2: Swim Test, Lung Volume test, Buoyancy test circuit swim.

Pool 3: Additional Swim Test Time, circuit swim.

Lecture 3: Physics of Diving

Pool 4: Breath holding exercises, mask clear & fin kick, circuit swim.

Lecture 4: Problems going down.

Pool 5: Review & surface dives, flood & clear mask on bottom, drop & recover mask - 13 ft, snorkel buddy breathing - 100 meters, circuit swim.

Lecture 5: Problems coming up.

Pool 6: Review & multiple mask clears, B.C. use, circuit swim.

Lecture 6: Diving Equipment II – SCUBA

Pool 7: Review & hand signals, wet suit, entries, doff & dons, circuit swim.

Lecture 7: Diving Environment

Pool 8: Scuba: don, swim with, clear, breathe from scuba, circuit swim.

Open Water 1/2: Two free dives.

Lecture 8: Diving Safety/Dive Planning

Pool 9: Free Diving Midterm Skill Exam, circuit swim test.

Lecture 9: Midterm Written Exam

Lecture 10: Repetitive Diving & Air Consumption Calculations

Pool 10: Scuba: Buddy breathing and doff & don, circuit swim.

Open Water 3/4: Two Scuba dives, demonstrate basic skills.

Lecture 11: Navigation & Rigging

Pool 11: Scuba: Buddy breathing and doff & don, circuit swim.

Open Water 5/6: Scuba: Air consumption & navigation.

Lecture 12: Sampling Techniques

Pool 12: Diver Rescue, circuit swim.

Open Water 7/8: Morning - Diver Rescue; Afternoon – Transects

Lecture 13: Decompression Diving

Pool 13: Scuba drills: B.C. use, black mask, simulated decom stop, circuit swim.

Open Water 9/10: Deeper water diving.

Lecture 14: Research Diving

Pool 14: Final Skills Exam, full circuit swim test

Open Water 11 Night Dive

Open Water 12/13: Beach and Rock Entries and Exits

Lecture 15: Local Dive Sites

Open Water 14: Night Dive

Open Water 15/16 Final Skill Exams, doff and don, rescue, 1/2 mile swim, pipe puzzle, unaccompanied buddy dive.

Lecture 16: Final Written Exam

And then we say that you're good to go ... to 30 feet!
 
Thalassamania:
OK, I'm at the extreme other end:

Lecture 1: Course procedures and requirements. Fill out application, statement of understanding and medical form.

Pool 1: Swim Test, Lung Volume test, Buoyancy test, circuit swim.

Lecture 2: Diving equipment Part I - Free diving gear.

Pool 2: Swim Test, Lung Volume test, Buoyancy test circuit swim.

Pool 3: Additional Swim Test Time, circuit swim.

Lecture 3: Physics of Diving

Pool 4: Breath holding exercises, mask clear & fin kick, circuit swim.

Lecture 4: Problems going down.

Pool 5: Review & surface dives, flood & clear mask on bottom, drop & recover mask - 13 ft, snorkel buddy breathing - 100 meters, circuit swim.

Lecture 5: Problems coming up.

Pool 6: Review & multiple mask clears, B.C. use, circuit swim.

Lecture 6: Diving Equipment II – SCUBA

Pool 7: Review & hand signals, wet suit, entries, doff & dons, circuit swim.

Lecture 7: Diving Environment

Pool 8: Scuba: don, swim with, clear, breathe from scuba, circuit swim.

Open Water 1/2: Two free dives.

Lecture 8: Diving Safety/Dive Planning

Pool 9: Free Diving Midterm Skill Exam, circuit swim test.

Lecture 9: Midterm Written Exam

Lecture 10: Repetitive Diving & Air Consumption Calculations

Pool 10: Scuba: Buddy breathing and doff & don, circuit swim.

Open Water 3/4: Two Scuba dives, demonstrate basic skills.

Lecture 11: Navigation & Rigging

Pool 11: Scuba: Buddy breathing and doff & don, circuit swim.

Open Water 5/6: Scuba: Air consumption & navigation.

Lecture 12: Sampling Techniques

Pool 12: Diver Rescue, circuit swim.

Open Water 7/8: Morning - Diver Rescue; Afternoon – Transects

Lecture 13: Decompression Diving

Pool 13: Scuba drills: B.C. use, black mask, simulated decom stop, circuit swim.

Open Water 9/10: Deeper water diving.

Lecture 14: Research Diving

Pool 14: Final Skills Exam, full circuit swim test

Open Water 11 Night Dive

Open Water 12/13: Beach and Rock Entries and Exits

Lecture 15: Local Dive Sites

Open Water 14: Night Dive

Open Water 15/16 Final Skill Exams, doff and don, rescue, 1/2 mile swim, pipe puzzle, unaccompanied buddy dive.

Lecture 16: Final Written Exam

And then we say that you're good to go ... to 30 feet!


Economics say that I wouldn't make much money selling such a C card. Thal, you can force that program if you worked for a university, but in real life, 2 day crash course for a C card makes more money. Also your physical requirement would cut out 75% of the divers already out there.

Not to say you don't have a good program, but LDS have to make money too...
 
fisherdvm:
Economics say that I wouldn't make much money selling such a C card. Thal, you can force that program if you worked for a university, but in real life, 2 day crash course for a C card makes more money. Also your physical requirement would cut out 75% of the divers already out there.

Not to say you don't have a good program, but LDS have to make money too...
And Id say the optimal course is somewhere between the 3-day crash course and thals course. If its too time consuming to start, people wont and if its too much about making money and doing it as quick as possible, we wont be taught enough..
3 days of diving and filling out whats supposed to be a test by reading the answer in a book is not even close to what Id want my buddy to have done. Id preferr to dive with someone that actually know the physics of diving and dont have a c-card over someone that dont know the physics and have one..
Then again, I dive mostly solo atm anyways, so if the buddy is crap, im prepared for it.. Just need to hope I dont need to save his/her *** *knock on wood*
 
Money makes the world go round .... I think that is why they have "sub" OW courses offered by both SSI and PADI, and I think even Naui. Everybody wants to tap into the pot of gold.
 
Sure, I know what you mean. All those divers drowning and everything. Oh wait, that doesn't happen. Those dang dive organizations they don't teach nothin.

Well except for diving.

Money is not the only motivation, new divers seem to be "turned off" to diving by long courses and the industry has to respond to the demands of the public or perish.

In general, dive education is adequate for what most people want and need for diving.
 
fisherdvm:
Economics say that I wouldn't make much money selling such a C card.
We're not supposed to be in the business of selling C cards, are we?
fisherdvm:
Thal, you can force that program if you worked for a university, but in real life, 2 day crash course for a C card makes more money.
At the university there was no need for "force" we typically had a 100 applicants for every 20 student course. Currently with an intensive 3 week version of this course I net more than twice what most instructors do for three weeks work in a shop, behind the counter and teaching. Sure it’s mainly rich folk, but the economics are there even for your average consumer, as long as that consumer is actually committed to learning to dive.
fisherdvm:
Also your physical requirement would cut out 75% of the divers already out there.
I think your numbers are a bit high. With a college age audience the swim test cut out very few (I distinctly remember two). With privates I’ve not lost a single one, but they know what they’re getting into, are invariably water people and are very often the 16 to 30 year old children of previous students or their colleagues and associates.
fisherdvm:
Not to say you don't have a good program, but LDS have to make money too...
The quality of what I do is not the issue, and I know that I’m out one edge of things. But who says that anyone HAS TO MAKE MONEY? That imperative to grab today’s buck is what, I think, is going to cause the eventual demise of the LDS as we see it now. I expect that, over time, it will be replaced by a for-profit dive club that looks more like a health club and, like the old BSAC not-for-profit system, provides instruction, owns and makes available things like pools, rebreathers and even live-aboard boats but that leaves gear sales to the internet. But that’s all a different topic. I only posted so that the OP can see what sits at the other end of the continuum so that he can understand that the two day course is as minimalist as mine is maximalist.
 
My PADI OW was 2 short classroom sessions to go over knowledge reviews and any questions. This face to face time with an instructor was invaluable because even though I am allegedly smart, some things need to be explained by a person rather than a book or they just don't compute.

We then had 2 fairly long days in the pool, and then the 2 days of open water a couple of weeks later.

IMO this was inadequate to make me feel like a confident, self sufficient diver. I have practised as much as possible in the pool, read everything I can and learned a lot more about the panic cycle from making a few thoughtful ow dives... and I am just starting to feel like I am able to look after my saftey and that of my buddy. Diving may not be rocket science, but things can and do go wrong, there are plenty of accident/ fatality reports on here that attest to that.

What I'm saying in a round about way is go for the 4 day- it may not be adequate but if you realise that you are a beginner and don't push your luck you should be fine.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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