A Point to Ponder

[MXGratefulDiver]

If you standardize there will be no innovation!

Isn't that how the argument goes?

To a degree ... but one can take it too far.

Imagine the chaos if some car manufacturers decided that the gas pedal should go on the left, and the brake on the right. This seems to apply to some scuba manufacturers ... particularly with "innovations" like integrated second stages.

Functional standards are the norm in most industries ... they should be in ours as well.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[jonnythan]

To a degree ... but one can take it too far.

Imagine the chaos if some car manufacturers decided that the gas pedal should go on the left, and the brake on the right. This seems to apply to some scuba manufacturers ... particularly with "innovations" like integrated second stages.

Functional standards are the norm in most industries ... they should be in ours as well.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I was agreeing with you. I was trying to poke fun at the people who think standardization infringes on personal choice, but I was a little too vague

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

So let's count how many times I got slammed and told to leave the forum for my opinion. Geez, DD brought up a good point and I gave my opinion on the whole mess. Big deal.

That being said, the BC forum would be the appropriate place for non-DIR bp/w questions, don't you think?

Sorry Jonny ... I wasn't trying to slam ya.

What I am trying to say is that forums have different value to different people ... and if one has no value to you, it does no one any good to go into it and call the opinions of the people who post there "useless" ... I don't think any of the DIR folks here would stand for that if (or should I say, when) it happens in their forum.

If you think the forum is useless, rather than create a controversy why not just stop going there? It obviously has value to other people ... in this case the same people who have been told to stop posting their non-DIR ideas in the DIR forum.

So now you each have a place to play ... seems like a pretty good solution to me.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[jonnythan]

I'm not trying to create a controversey. I'm not telling anyone where to post, or that they should remove the forum. I stated how I felt and that's as far as I wanted it to go

 

[simbrooks]

I'm not telling anyone where to post, or that they should remove the forum.

you did:

There should be a single "What is Hogarthian" thread somewhere, and the forum should, again IMO, be removed.

I really have nothing against you or your opinions, but like i said, it does seem like a waste of "breathe" (typing) to state that response up the page when not coming here is easier. I have seen a few other threads recently essentially whining about the forums and how useful they are, or to mods being in those forums (i think NWGD knows that one quite well ), so i just wonder why type out something negative against the forum without contributing to the forum?

I guess i appreciate the forum, it allows me to see how others rig up their kit, BP/W, long hose (and other hoses) ideas, can light, lift bag etc, it gives room for debate on why one ideal is preferred over another for someone - something which would could be deseminated by moving them to their respective forums (but so could all the posts about DIR config or others on the basic or new2scuba forums) - this gives a good place to post ideas about this type of rig, not other types of rig. I guess that is part of why i was a little blunt, sorry if it seemed harsh.

 

[scubafool]

Now this is interesting: http://www.scubaboard.com/t75605-true-minimalism.html

No long hose. No octo. No crotch strap.

Does this fit in w/ the Hogarthian setup?

Shore dives of of Venice Beach for sharks teeth. About 15' deep, water temps in the summer approach 90, if you run out of gas you just kick to the surface. You don't need an octo, you don't need a bouyancy compenstor, in short, you are taking everything you need, and nothing you don't.

 

[Quarrior]

This certainly has been an interesting thread so far with a lot of people making a lot of statements and some making judgements.

Since I am one of the founders of this forum, I thought I would bring up it's intent.

There were far to many threads about Hogarthian configuration and BP/W setups in the BC forum and were very fragmented and hard to keep track of. Many divers use the Hogarthian configuration or at least their own personal version of it, but do not meet the DIR standards, so, we needed someplace to discuss our thoughts and ideas. We felt it should not be required to filter through the entire BC forum to find threads which interested. Nor did we feel it necessary for us to go get beat up on in the DIR forum for not meeting a "standard" configuration.

As to the point raised near the beginning of this thread about buddies knowing each other's configuration, that is exactly the point of Hogarthian IMO. Not that everything is in exactly the same place on every single rig, but, in most cases, most things will be the same. Then it's just a simple matter of doing a pre-dive buddy brief with a new buddy, which should be done anyway.

Bottom line, if someone comes up to me and tells me something has to be a certain way and can't back it up with a safety reason for that statement, they're not diving with me. My gear is configured the way it is because I like it that way and it works for me. All my buddies have been briefed where everything is on my gear, just as I have been briefed on their gear.

 

[grazie42]

The, "take only what you need, if you need it take two"-principle, is what I see as the mainpoint of Hogarthian configs...
What I like about this is that it leaves the definition of "whats needed" open to discussion and debate among divers without the condensation, namecalling and belittling found elsewhere on the board...
I also think that´s why the person asking questions in this thread:

Originally Posted by detroit diver
Now this is interesting: http://www.scubaboard.com/t75605-true-minimalism.html
No long hose. No octo. No crotch strap.
Does this fit in w/ the Hogarthian setup?

Didn´t get slammed with lines like: "take a class", "go away to some dark corner of SB and post there" (to some, maybe jonnythan, this is that dark corner), "troll" etc...

Personally I wouldn´t dive like that...his definition of "whats needed" is propably very different to that of most people here but I still respect his right to that definition and not knowing how or where he dives I feel I have no business telling him how to dive (although I feel that to dive hogarthian a diver is needed and hence you should take 2 )...