Accepting criticisms: "You're gonna die!"

[The Chairman]

It would depend entirely on the context

Would it? I've learned a lot from mal-applied criticisms. There's a tropism that I've heard from a lot of my white collar friends: Feedback is a bonus. They usually mutter this anytime they are being criticized and it's like a mantra to allow them to swallow some bitter pill. So what if the criticisms were way off point? I don't believe they were, but what's the harm in accepting them as is and trying to understand why they were given and if they apply? Something caused them to take time out of their day, expend effort and try to tell you something. Ratcheting up your defenses accomplish nothing here.

No one is perfect which means we can all improve. ​

Criticism is only offensive if you take it or make it that way. If your goal is to improve, then your attitude should be "bring it on!" or "Anything else?" Don't fight it: embrace it! Don't treat as some kind of attack or insult: it's a bonus!

Even weaponized criticisms which are not much more than an insult can be accepted without you taking offense. There might not be a thing you can do about it, but learning to accept these kinds of criticisms will make the good stuff all that more effective.

 

[Hoag]

Here is a video that a friend sent me that is very appropriate to this thread. It discusses feedback, transparency in training and the Lead/Follower relationship.

Full disclosure: I was a Mission Crew Commander at EADS and I was also an Exercise Director as well. During my time at EADS, I worked with his squadron extensively since it was one of the NORAD Alert Squadrons.

 

[northernone]

When I am on the receiving end of a critique I try to get curious. Internally I start asking:

"What is it the person giving the critique is seeing?"

Followed by:

"What's been significant in forming what they are saying?"

Finally:

"What can I learn from this interaction?"

While 'even a broken clock is right twice a day' there are incredibly accurate timekeeping devices in my life in plentiful quantities. (Equally true on this forum.)

Not every personal attack, soapbox rant and drunken rage is worth more than a few second of my life. The consideration and reflection is better spent on words of wisdom from those I respect and have learned to trust based on a developed history of perceptive insight.

In background to how I've developed this perspective: For a decade I was frontline in creating space between pedophiles and the children they were abusing. Every sort of critique imaginable was leveled towards me from everyone constantly (on scene, at headquarters, among my friends and any time I went out in public in a small community).

It's a situation no one doesn’t have a strong opinion on (similar to split fins and jacket BCDs). This included a fair number of people who's critique was so heartfelt they attempted to end my life. This also included anyone who read a book or saw a tv show thinking they needed to develop an option and lend advice. This thankfully also included the wise. Elders (mainly) who had dedicated a lifetime to learning how to live kindly with mercy and justice.

Who do you think I chose to spent my energy and attention on listening to and shaping my life to internalize their feedback (a debrief underpinned with trust if you will) ?

Cameron

 

[The Chairman]

Here is a video

Awesome. The very rare mix of perfectionism and humility... I only wish he were describing me!

When my son was in second grade he ran into his first bully on the playground. He came home in tears and after a lot of prying it was obvious why he was embarrassed. It wasn't that the kid was bigger, stronger or more abusive, but that he allowed himself to get upset over a silly comment. We had a long talk about attitudes and such and one thing made a huge impact on me. Yes, me. No one else is in charge of my happiness, my sorrow and my ability to accept criticism but me. Only me. Oh sure, unpleasant events can and will happen, but I am in charge of how it affects me and how I react. Yes, even the biggies like when my son died.

It begins with fully understanding why you're on ScubaBoard. Why are you reading? Why are you responding? Sure, we have our hopeless POV warriors that are here to prove that they alone are right. Meh. Most of us are here to learn. We've Googled something that sent us here and we've fallen in love with the community. So, if we're here to learn why do some of us act offended when someone gives us a learning point in the form of a criticism? Yes, there are some concepts where I am unmoving like there is no need for a CESA in Scuba instruction and that the goal of every OW class is to produce perfectly flat and neutrally buoyant divers. But, for the most part, I participate to learn. I express my views hoping that any erroneous views will be challenged and that I'll learn something. A perfect example of this was when @H2Andy suggested that since it was so heavy that we should use water instead of lead for ballast. The following discussion was epic and Andy ate a good bit of crow. But he took it all good naturedly without a single bit of bitterness or self pity. Mind you, Andy is brilliant and he simply had a senior moment in his youth. He had that very rare mix of perfectionism and humility.

So the next time you feel you're being "attacked", take a moment, take a breath and see if there's something in there that you can learn. Look for the bonus and stop being overwhelmed with concern for how others think of you.

This also included anyone who read a book or saw a tv show thinking they needed to develop an option and lend advice.

It's true that the best parents are the ones who've never had a child. They're quick to point out how you've failed and sometimes they're right. It's fun when they finally join you in the trenches and figure out it's not as easy as they thought.

 

[seeker242]

It would depend entirely on the context in which the help was attempted to be given. .

Would it? I've learned a lot from mal-applied criticisms.

I would say most definitely it would. For example, if that "help" is being given in the context of someone saying "I don't wear a snorkel because you don't actually need one" and compare that to "I'm a new diver and I want to do a bounce dive to 200' to impress my girlfriend", the context matters a great deal. In the former context, the help would be nonsensical. In the other, it would be quite appropriate. The context is what made it asinine or appropriate.

No one is perfect which means we can all improve.

Sure, but if "improving" means you need to wear a snorkel, or you're going to die, then it's just plain laughable.

 

[The Chairman]

Sure, but if "improving" means you need to wear a snorkel, or you're going to die, then it's just plain laughable.

You can live in the exceptions. I would contend that there are few here who would suggest such a thing. Most of the advice I've read here is based on "being there and diving that". Sure, you'll find some people condemning gear that they've never dove, but they usually tell you the story behind that. Usually.

 

[Altamira]

Here is a video that a friend sent me that is very appropriate to this thread. It discusses feedback, transparency in training and the Lead/Follower relationship.

Full disclosure: I was a Mission Crew Commander at EADS and I was also an Exercise Director as well. During my time at EADS, I worked with his squadron extensively since it was one of the NORAD Alert Squadrons.

This video is spot on. The "fighter squadron culture" works great in the military, and it requires all participants to remain willing to give and accept valid positive or negative criticism for the betterment of individuals and the squadron itself. It is too bad that this mentality/culture is not adopted by many civilian organizations.

 

[NAUI Wowie]

You seem to want to treat scuba diving as some kind of competitive sport with elite divers and stories of bravery and amazing feats. Get over it. That is an attitude that has killed others and will kill you.

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

This was split off of another thread due to being "off topic". While it was indeed off topic, I thought that this sentiment was so important that it needed it's own thread and a thorough discussion. The Chairman...

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Thats a complete lie and id tell you the same to your face.

 

[NAUI Wowie]

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This is probably some of the best and most timely advice ever given on this forum and it's to the one individual who seems to need it most. Rather than rail against it, and treat it as a challenge to your testosterone, you should take a deep breath and embrace it. It's not an attack: it's a timely warning. The ocean is a harsh mistress and doesn't suffer fools for very long. You have the chance to avoid being a fool and you should take it. Most who have escaped death don't feel a need to brag about it. They certainly don't see it as being "superhuman" as much as they feel lucky. Lucky that their stupidity, hubris and apparent incompetence didn't kill them. It's embarrassing as hell to get into such situations and they will only confess them to warn others, such as yourself, to keep those feelings of invincibility in check. Indeed, @tursiops sounds like one of those divers who have been there, knows better and doesn't mind telling you what you need to hear rather than to encourage an unsafe attitude. We certainly don't want to read about another clueless diver in the accidents forum.

Sorry chairman your entire rant is complete BULL. It was all taken out of context by tursiops. LITERALLY OUT OF CONTEXT. The thread was started because I wanted to learn a bit more about the history and experiences of others. Im pretty sure as a new diver I am more risk averse than 99 percent of you. Ive already had experiences with "experienced divers" leaving their instabuddy in zero viz situations in monterey. People with hundreds of dives and no lights no compass. two of em. Ive got more common sense in my little finger than those two experienced divers.

If you take that post as me wanting to banzai my way through the ocean then you literally shouldnt be posting online at all. Because you are not very smart. so stow all the fake talk bud. Im a SAFE DIVER. And will NOT TAKE RISKS. Im sure youve broken those rules hundreds of times.

by the way dont call me a clueless diver as youve never seen me dive. yours is a clueless post.

 

[John Bantin]

Since everyone is "gonna die" maybe it would be better to say "that'll kill yer"?