Affiliation question

[Siilverback]

We are still a relatively young dive team who has made giant strides in the last few years. We have obtained better equipment, better training and several PSD related certifications through recreational agencies (NAUI, PADI, SSI). We are looking at training with a PSD organization but there are several out there. We have thought about getting training through NAPD and adopting some of their training into our policies. This is just preliminary research but I would be interested in any comments, opinions, or stories about different PSD organizations.

 

[Gary D.]

Welcome aboard. Take a minute and fill out your profile. It will give us all a better understanding of who you are, where your at and what your needs are.

What recreational training have you been taking to prepare for PSD? Don’t be afraid to ask ANY questions here. We're gentle, sort of.

Gary D.

 

[bridgediver]

Very little of what the recreational agencies teach will be of benefit to PSD - its a totally different way to dive. If you find you're using sport diving procedures it can be done a lot better and safer - ie with a proven PSD agency.
Of those these are the big 4 (in no particular order):
LGS, DRI, ERDI, PSDA

I'm not familiar with NAPD but compare it with the others - make sure that it is a true agency and not just 1 or 2 "experts" that have a training company.

Welcome and have fun

 

[dittrimd]

Brigde,

I was wondering if you could elaborate on this statement.

Very little of what the recreational agencies teach will be of benefit to PSD - its a totally different way to dive.

It almost reads like a new person to diving should not take a recreational course at all becuase what is taught is of little benefit.

The basic skills taught in a recreation class like bouyancy and just the introduction to diving I feel are applicable to PSD diving. From my experience the DRI 1 or LGS classes are not the place to learn basic Scuba skills.

 

[UncleJoes]

Dive Rescue International Requires you to have a minimum OW cert before you can take their course. My department hosted the DR 1 class last April and everyone learned A Lot!

I don't know much about the other agencies Bridge mentioned but I definitley recommend DRI.

If you plan to host a seminar Ask for Steve Wilson, He was Awesome!

 

[bridgediver]

Brigde,

I was wondering if you could elaborate on this statement.



It almost reads like a new person to diving should not take a recreational course at all becuase what is taught is of little benefit.

The basic skills taught in a recreation class like bouyancy and just the introduction to diving I feel are applicable to PSD diving. From my experience the DRI 1 or LGS classes are not the place to learn basic Scuba skills.

Sorry about that. None of the PSD classes I'm aware of can be done without first having OW training - didn't mean to imply that.
Having said that, allot of the OW courses out there will be grossly inefficient for preparing a person for PSD. The padi special weekend course may work OK for the reefs of the carribean but I've seen so many guys struggle trying to do an entry level PSD course that we will re-cert everyone OW "the PSD way" even if they already have an OW card. Even "experienced/advanced" sport divers will struggle.

Things that a standard OW course usually miss:
1) able to do all skills midwater AND w/o mask
2) comfort with blackwater (not the same as maskless)
3) hovering and exact buoyancy control through pinpoint weighting
4) entanglements
5) touch communications (blackwater)
6) pony bottle use - sport diving usually considers this "advanced" or "solo-diving"
7) dry suit
8) FFM

I know that DRI and LGS have their own entry level OW programs that address all or most of this. Add these things to a PSD course which include solo-tethered diving, search procedures, contingency procedures and rapid response skills and the task loading is extreme.

I realize that there is the odd OW course that is exceptionally good and may train new divers to a proficient level in a few of these points but I doubt you'd find one that did all of them. Its simply too much to squeeze into the standard 20hr program (or whatever they've diluted it down to these days...)

mark

 

[dittrimd]

Thanks Bridge,

I figured that is what you meant but it did not quite read right and I thought anyone new might misunderstand what you meant.

I totally agree that the run of the mill open water and even advanced open water classes will not prepare a diver to operate efficiently on a PSD team. It requires training specific to the job. You outlined some of the major points that are commonly missed or just not part of the curriculum. They do give a new diver the basics of SCUBA which can be used as a foundation to build your PSD skills. Some things need to be thrown away completely.

It is also a lot different if you are joining a well establish team with divers and commanders who are trained and experienced PSD's. It is entirely different if you are part of a brand new team starting from scratch. If you are joining a well established team you can draw off you team mates experience and training to find what is the right direction to take. Training, equipment etc. can all be things that your team can help you with. If you are part of a new team it is a whole new ball game. I was fortunate to join and experienced team after many years as a recreational diver. My teammates were very helpful and still are to this day. The collaborative process is great since we are all working towards the same goal which is safety. If I were part of a new team I would look around in my geographic area and find other team that are willing to offer guidance. It is very likely that you could find yourself working together on future incidents and having some common background would be beneficial.

Best of luck,

Mark D.

 

[Desert Pirate]

Bridge, and Ditrim,
I agree with what you are saying, but dont under cut the basic classes that recreational Scuba teaches. Agreed, it doesnt make you a PSD, but anything to help make comfortable any diver with their basic scuba skills is invaluble as a PSD, also they are easier to book, and priced accordinaly. Of course, you need to take a course from DRI or other proven agency, but the poster of the question showed 0-24 dives, I am sure Cigami is comfortable, but experience with what ever training will help in PSD because they will require to practice "Basic Scuba Skills".
JMHO,
Slimm
Also, Cigami, congradulations on your new team, and I hope all goes well.

 

[bridgediver]

I think I know what you mean but the problem is that the basic skills are not taught properly to begin with most of the time in a recreational class. Doing even more sub-par training with them (ie advanced, specialty certs etc) is a waste of time and may even put divers into more riskier situations than they're really ready for IMO

As I explained an entry level scuba course is of course required prior to PSD training but most mainstream recreational OW classes barely teach students to survive a shallow warmwater reef dive these days. The industry standard has been brought down so low that I don't give much stock into what they're teaching anymore. If you can find one that actually trains a diver to proficiency instead of a checklist of objectives thats probably a good one but as you said - they are both difficult to find and expensive. For an entry level PSD course (has an OW cert already) the proficiency must be there to start a PSD on the right track.

I'm a believer that you learn something new on every dive (no matter what your experience is) but if you're a new diver, learning bad habits early is hard to break later on - this is what I've seen with the mainstream OW courses and the associated specialty classes.

If a guy wants to train PSD, I say get the proper training right off the get go. Don't just take what ever course is easier or cheap - the old adage you get what you pay for applies here. A diver is generally better off just going out getting more dives under his belt until he can get into a GOOD course instead of collecting c-cards. He'll end up spending more money than he has to in the long run taking more classes than he needs

Mark makes a good point about getting with more experienced divers - his example was specifically amongst team members which is great. But you can still do this outside of the "team" by finding more experienced divers in your local area. You'll learn far more about diving (in most cases) just by being around the guys that are better or more experienced than in a recreational specialty class.
Of course, there are those that think they're better than they really are so you need to watch out for that.

 

[Desert Pirate]

A diver is generally better off just going out getting more dives under his belt until he can get into a GOOD course instead of collecting c-cards. He'll end up spending more money than he has to in the long run taking more classes than he needs

Mark makes a good point about getting with more experienced divers - his example was specifically amongst team members which is great. But you can still do this outside of the "team" by finding more experienced divers in your local area. You'll learn far more about diving (in most cases) just by being around the guys that are better or more experienced than in a recreational specialty class.
Of course, there are those that think they're better than they really are so you need to watch out for that.

Well Put.
But I think to be proficient before taking a PSD class is very important so that you can concentrate on the class being taught, rather than bouyancy, puttin gear togather, clearing ears and the skills that new divers spend their time trying to learn while they are being tought, not to sound like an elitist by any meants, something that is probably still over their heads.
I also see Cigami has updated the amount of dives. that changes my reasons for gettin on my soapbox. lol
deffinatley more comfortable than 0-24