AOW? Joke? Meaningless?

[Basking Ridge Diver]

LOL! Sweet! I need to meet this guy! Maybe I can learn something from him. LMAO!! :-D

I might know a guy that knows him...

 

[freewillie]

I didn't do AOW and I've taken any and all additional the training I wanted. Wreck, Deep, Dry Suit, Nitrox, etc.. I'm starting Into to Tech tomorrow. And I will take Rescue sometime in the next few months, too, I think.

All without taking AOW.

We are confusing certification with experience and skill.

For certification you take a course, you take a test, you get a certification card.

For experience you have to take your class lessons and either practice the skills to improve or integrate the knowledge into your repertoire of skills sets to become a better diver.

To use an analogy, you graduate medical school with an MD. You still have to learn how to apply your skills and knowledge so doctors to be then participate in internships and residencies before they can practice independently. But without the MD, would you go to health care "doctor" if they didn't have the diploma? But I have the experience, I took some classes .... I suspect you would find a doctor who had the proper certificates and degrees. But whether or not they are a good doctor or a bad doctor is a matter of experience and skill.

 

[dmaziuk]

But the camera CAN do that, with manual white balance correction! Well, not backscatter, but can't have it all. If you really are struggling with color correcting images, and was not just saying it as an example, look into manual white balance (and of course flash for close-up), perhaps with an added ambient light color filter, it'll change your U/W photography forever.

Yeah, I know, and I wouldn't call it "struggling". I was using it as an example of how you don't need to dive deep to see the colours change: it's very evident on photos taken at shallower depths. Especially when you look at the colour level histograms.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I did my aow right after ow. Even though I'm comfortable in the water I wanted 5 more closely supervised dives before venturing out on my own. Now as an instructor, I still feel the same way. While some are naturals, others need closer supervision at the start. It's all about safety. Your new friend will likely be a safer/better diver for it. As for the certification, it is an independent verification of what your dive skills were once. Anyone can claim x dives or doctor a log book. But the c-card says someone thinks you did something right once.

You don't need AOW to do that. I just tell my students to come dive with me after class. Or to tag along on the next one. They don't have to pay me for a card to get five more dives with an instructor. Lunch is often all it takes.

 

[cbm32]

Testing out is not an option, so that is n ot a valid argument. your position is that if you can drive a car or operate a semi truck why shoujld i get a drivers license and or endorcement. The card is not to tell you of your training abilities its to document to OTHERS you trained abilities. It is fortunate for you that AOW was a waste of your time, Yes i agree that there would be a large market for a testing out AOW card. I think if you go to an nstructor with an OW and other certs that qualify for the adventure exosure requirements you should be able to test out. It is already being done under the table. Your point of haveing for dive ops tha require it is as good of a reason as there is to have one. To be honest I admire the ops that require proof of training fo the dive being planned. Whwether money grab is a reason no9t to get it or not, that is up to you. ins companies do nt have such a casual position on certifications.

No, my argument is that if you can pass a written test and demonstrate proficiency at driving a car you should be able to get a drivers license without taking drivers training. And, that is actually how it works if you are 18 or over. I never took drivers training at all but have had a drivers license since I turned 18 and took the tests.

Having dive ops require it is a good reason to have one....true, and that is why I got one. Having them require it though is not a good reason to have to take and pay for the training if you can demonstrate the requisite knowledge and ability without taking and paying for that training. I would further state that dive ops requiring AOW certification is actually far less important than having them require that you possess the requisite knowledge and ability to do the dives they will be taking you on.....other than the whole cya for insurance purposes angle. Having that AOW cert does not necessarily mean the person is really able to do the more advanced dives. I have dove with people that had certs all the way up to and including DM certification that were actually very very poor divers. Zero to hero gets you the certs but doesnt necessarily make you a proficient diver.

 

[Centrals]

...I've noticed that there is a huge difference in US trained divers and non-US trained divers. Non US trained divers seem much more skillful than US ones. They generally have decent buoyancy control, are comfortable in the water.

You have seen nothing yet!!

 

[dmoore19]

This isn't the first time this has been discussed.

One thing nobody seems to mention is that often a person gets out of something what they are willing to put into it. I'm sure there are instructors out there that put little to no effort into teaching the AOW class.

I am not saying that the OP is a bad student but sometime it boils down to that. If the student is unwilling to try and get something out of it, they won't. I am not sure what some people want to get out of the class. I know that when I took the class I had 100 dives. I know that there was a lot of things that I was already aware of and had already done. I was comfortable in the water. It was still fun and I enjoyed it. I didn't learn anything earth shaking but I picked up a couple of pointers that helped out. It was fun to work with a buddy and get some more pointers on navigation. All in all, I think AOW is a fun class and I got the certification that may make diving on some boats possible. If the class wasn't up to expectation, maybe it is because it was a poor instructor or maybe it was because the student didn't put any effort into it. If the instructor has a student that seems to say "been there, done that" it doesn't make it any easier for the instructor.

 

[Manneca]

But the camera CAN do that, with manual white balance correction! Well, not backscatter, but can't have it all. If you really are struggling with color correcting images, and was not just saying it as an example, look into manual white balance (and of course flash for close-up), perhaps with an added ambient light color filter, it'll change your U/W photography forever. Sorry for off-topic, carry on!

Sorry for the off-topic reply. If you are using a strobe, then you can bring back some of the red. If you don't have a strobe or some sort of artificial light and you are at depth, the red is just gone. Nothing in photoshop or LR can bring what isn't there back.

 

[drbill]

Back in the 60s when I finally realized I had to get certified, our "OW" course was three weeks long and covered much of what is in the current OW-AOW-Rescue sequence. Although I had been diving sporadically for a few years, that course certainly trained me as a much better diver. Over the years these three were broken down into separate courses. IMHO OW and Rescue are the two in the sequence that are most informative. "Unfortunately" many dive operators require AOW for certain dives. I don't disagree with this, but as the OP pointed out two AOW certified divers can differ substantially in their skills level.

Back in 2001 I had been diving for nearly 40 years but was frequently asked by instructors from some agencies to do a "check out" dive because they didn't recognize the level of training involved in my agency's "OW" course. While on the Great Barrier Reef, I encountered a PADI instructor who not only recognized my agency and its training, but referred to my 1960s c-card as a "museum piece." I took PADI's AOW course with him for just the cost of the materials. It made next to no difference in my diving skills (although I did learn a few things) but now none of the other agencies questioned my skills level. Sheeez.

 

[Redshift]

You don't need AOW to do that. I just tell my students to come dive with me after class. Or to tag along on the next one. They don't have to pay me for a card to get five more dives with an instructor. Lunch is often all it takes.

Which make sense. Doing AOW will also give them a card that allows them access to more demanding dive spots and more autonomy when going to a dive centre, despite those divers not having had almost more experience at all. That's why with CMAS and BSAC divers were paired with more experienced divers in order to keep improving the skills learned during the course, become more proficient under water while under some supervision, gain confidence and slowly gain autonomy to then take the following course. At least in Europe, with the European legislation that defines diving levels, CMAS 1 was considered an autonomous diver otherwise no-one would take a CMAS course when PADI says their OW are autonomous.