Arrogance and humility among divers

[drbill]

I have observed arrogance in the past from some tech divers, specifically a group who felt they didn't have to follow the rules of the dive park (same with some newly certified DMs and instructors). I have heard of some GUE groups in other areas that sound a bit arrogant. Fortunately the GUE divers here in SoCal have been not only very accepting of others but have also diversified into some very positive environmental programs.

 

[boulderjohn]

I have a friend who is the NAUI rep for Hawaii. She was on the WKPP, dove with GI3 and is a NAUI IT. Most assuredly not a stroke. She was bounced from her fundies class. Her instructor said "No one passes the first fundies class". I guess it's a thing.

When I was becoming an instructor, I was required to read historical documents showing the progress of scuba instruction. According to one of them, that kind of attitude was common among instructors in the early days of scuba instruction. I don't believe it was ever an agency-approved concept, but many individual instructors took great pride in how hard it was to pass their OW class. The article lay a lot of the blame on the fact that many of those instructors came from a military background, and their model was something along the lines of boot camp. The great change in scuba instruction was the agency-directive that the scuba instructor's job is to teach people to dive, and bragging about a high failure rate is just advertising that you are not doing your job very well.

The people being certified in such programs would probably feel a certain amount of arrogance toward the divers who were certified by instructors who believed you did not have to be among the world's elite to enjoy scuba. They would likely brag about how great their program was and how much they learned. The people who failed such programs would probably not try again and so miss out on a lifetime of enjoying the underwater realm. They would not appear on ScubaBoard to tell us of their experiences.

That attitude still persists. I encountered it on FaceBook a year or so ago, in which a long time instructor who prides himself on his physical fitness and who was a graduate of programs including the one described in Wookie's quote above, opined that scuba instruction would be better if we taught it like a Navy Seals program, so that only the truly fit and skilled divers would be certified. If we did that, he argued, the state of diving would be so much better. He was serious.

 

[EastEndDiver]

Next thing you know these "new" divers will want statues of Jacques Cousteau torn down because his old ways offends them.

 

[Steve_C]

It is not that hard, in most any endeavor, to come up with a test that everybody fails at. Proves nothing.

Being a navy seal is hard and requires tough training and for a reason.

Floating around a pretty coral reef in shallow water is not hard and the current training is appropriate.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Next thing you know these "new" divers will want statues of Jacques Cousteau torn down because his old ways offends them.

Some of the things Jacques Cousteau did were fairly offensive by today's standards ... like dynamiting his way into the reef at the Blue Hole, or holding tournaments to see who could kill the most fish in a day. But one must look at these things through the lens of history ... at the time they were considered acceptable behavior ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

It is not that hard, in most any endeavor, to come up with a test that everybody fails at. Proves nothing.

Being a navy seal is hard and requires tough training and for a reason.

Floating around a pretty coral reef in shallow water is not hard and the current training is appropriate.

On the other hand, not everyone dives in pretty coral reefs, and training should be tailored to the conditions one is learning in. Much of what's needful for safe diving in areas like Puget Sound are not found in any mainstream agency's manual. Fortunately the agencies do recognize this, and allow (or even encourage) individual instructors to tailor their training to the conditions in which they teach. Unfortunately, not all instructors do so, nor do the agencies require it. And therein lies the reason for the perception that modern training is insufficient.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[narke]

I think they may do so because really they are interested in finding out about me but don't ask directly so they end up talking amongst themselves about the so many dives and so many awesome places the dived, that may be politeness, all is well, sometimes they do so arrogantly, meaning they are clearly setting a level in their conversation below which you are uncool, inevitably the latter always then ask how many dives I have, I have a story in my drawer prepared for them, it starts like this: "I started diving before I came to age, it was in the eighties..." I move on to describe diving gear that evokes the days of the black and films by Cousteau, to which one of 2 things happen: we become good friends or they back off.

 

[mdb]

"Modern" SCUBA training is simply too short.

PADI led the way with this short course movement.

Weekend courses, online studies etc.

I know I am an oldtimer and a bit grouchy but we had at least 5 weeks of pool and classroom
work and then 5 open water dives over two weekends before basic certification.

We were then encouraged to take rescue classes, night diving classes, sign up for supervised
weekend dives, etc.

 

[scbaNE2179]

So what about dive patches? I have the following patches sewn onto my jean jacket: Deep Diver, PADI Diver, Boat Diver. Honestly, I'm the type that would rather stay quiet and not promote anything about my skills as a diver unless asked. And you will NEVER see a dive sticker on my car. Just not my thing to advertise scuba gear in my car.

 

[kelemvor]

Some of the things Jacques Cousteau did were fairly offensive by today's standards ... like dynamiting his way into the reef at the Blue Hole, or holding tournaments to see who could kill the most fish in a day. But one must look at these things through the lens of history ... at the time they were considered acceptable behavior ...

Were they? I wasn't around back then (I was six when he did the last notable thing I see on wikipedia) but I haven't heard of other divers from that time doing things like that. Was it a really common practice or are people justifying the bad behavior of someone that many people idolize as a hero.