Balanced or Overbalanced and Cold Water conversions

[runsongas]

because the overbalancing increases the IP over ambient as you go deeper, you reach a point where it causes an uncontrollable free flow on the 2nd that you can't stop with just the adjustment knob. this limit is pretty darn deep and with a bit of tuning, you can get the working range to 100m or so. anything deeper than that, you need to either switch back to oil sealing or go without sealing to remove the overbalancing.

deep diving regulators

 

[Remy B.]

Thanks, good link, go figure the less appreciated Mares regulators turn to be the better ones.

I'm not planning in diving deeper than 60m, That is my limit, so I guess and hopefully not wrong in that guess that my APEKS and Titans will work fine at those depths.

I'm thinking in changing my 2nd stages to AL Glacia ones, but now I can considere the Mares Abyss

 

[tbone1004]

@Remy B. any regulator will work just fine to 60m, and the Apeks are fine for stupid depths as long as you remove the dry seals, but any regulator with a dry seal will do it eventually. The reason your regs are probably breathing better is they might be getting fed a higher IP. When they swap the tops out, they have to remove the spring carrier and spring to change the caps out. When they installed it, they would have put it back to spec pressure. If it was lower than spec before hand, and the second stages were tuned for spec pressure, they would breathe easier.

You won't/can't tell an "improvement" in breathing effort as you deep despite the increase in IP because while the IP is getting higher and the reg may be easier to crack, the gas density is also going up which makes your WoB go up as well

 

[Remy B.]

Thanks T-bone, the reason I changed to Dry system is because I had a free-flow, I was in 6*C water temperature, here in Europe or at least here in Nederland it is prohibited wet-system, due to free-flows and for that minimize this,( that is what I was told ) it is kind of conflicting all this information, as well, if we look at the Legend and Glacia they are sealed as well, the Titan here comes sealed here, I bought my regulators in the US, and started to dive in Curacao now I'm living here in Nederland, and after the Free-flow event I converted my Titans ( and I was warned that it was likely that I will had one with the wet-system )

I understand that with the wet-system now water is in contact closer to the internal parts of the regulator allowing more temperature exchange, I don't know what was the conclusion after the investigation they determined that here the wet-systems were causing free-flows and were prohibited ( at least that was that I was told ), this is not something that was taken lightly as it is a EU regulation.

I understand the temperature exchange, I work with heat exchangers as well at work, but I guess to make a EU regulation ( if so ) it had to go thru research, I will dig more about this, that is for sure, my dry-systems will stay one, as I'm not planning more than 60m, at the moment I only Helitrox certified, but hope to go for the Trimix training if I have the possibility.

Thanks for your inputs, if somebody know about how thru this EU regulation on wet-systems is, and what was the conclusion and research and tests, please keep informing.

 

[runsongas]

Thanks, good link, go figure the less appreciated Mares regulators turn to be the better ones.

I'm not planning in diving deeper than 60m, That is my limit, so I guess and hopefully not wrong in that guess that my APEKS and Titans will work fine at those depths.

I'm thinking in changing my 2nd stages to AL Glacia ones, but now I can considere the Mares Abyss

if you really get into OC deep trimix diving (which is rare these days because of rebreathers being more efficient and economical), poseidon xstream/mk3s should be considered.

 

[inka]

Thanks for your inputs, if somebody know about how thru this EU regulation on wet-systems is, and what was the conclusion and research and tests, please keep informing.

EU regulation = EN250 (for cold water , T° <10°C) measured at Pab = 6 Bar,in fresh water at T< 4°C during 5 minuts

 

[Bigbella]

Cold water conversion shouldn't affect regulator performance, if they were properly set within their manufacturer-specified IP settings.

I have exclusively used Poseidon regulators for well over three decades, from freezing to tropical waters; and the IP varies between models, with the XStream at about 123 psi (8.4 bar); the Jetstream-Odin at 145-152 psi (9-10 bar) @ 300 psi; and the old workhorse, Cyklon, at 174 psi (11.6 bar). Provided that they are well-tuned, there is little noticeable change in breathing effort.

Cold water conversion on the older models simply consisted of a rubber cap, fit over the first stage spring, filled with either rot-gut vodka or, heh, heh, aquavit; and the XStream depended upon its exposed spring, as a heat sink. I've emerged from water with ice on that first stage without any issue with its performance . . .

 

[tbone1004]

@Bigbella the jetstream runs the same 123psi IP as the Xstream for reference. The second stage mechanics are basically identical, and the Cyklon runs at 165psi depending on the first stage. The better balanced it is, the closer to 165 it becomes

 

[Bigbella]

Those specs were taken from my old Vince Harlowe regulator repair manual -- didn't recall them off the top of my head; and the XStream's nominal inter-stage pressure, from the Poseidon service manual. I realize that the XStream is a pared-down Jetstream; and its guts are essentially what is in the Jetstream PP . . .

 

[tbone1004]

the numbers I posted are from the Poseidon manuals for reference.