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Bent. I guess it really can happen to me.

Discussion in 'Accidents and Incidents' started by TechDeep, Sep 3, 2013.

  1. Max Speed

    Max Speed Solo Diver

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Yeah, that happens to me after motorcyle racing too. I couldn't figure it out until I realized that I was running a lot of pressurized nitrogen in my shocks and tires.

    Sent from my GT-P3113 using Tapatalk 2
  2. heavierthanlead

    heavierthanlead Master Instructor

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Windy City
    True that, but the statement was not: "This is why PADI no longer teaches tables, exclusively". It implied that the largest SCUBA certification agency in the world dropped teaching tables altogether, which was misleading, at best.
  3. bada3003

    bada3003 Solo Diver

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Indiana
    Having done years of ocean snorkeling and spearfishing, and picking up scuba diving in earnest only recently, I do think that the diving format followed by PADI (and I suspect other agencies) is "dumbed down" to the least common denominator. Having said that, the logic that Tigerman proposes is debatable: assuming that dive tables have basis in meaningful physiology models, albeit incomplete (as most acknowledge) and conservative, just because thousands of dives are completed every day without incident following a profile similar to the OP's doesn't make it sound. As an analogy, stats indicate that only a tiny fraction of those driving with a blood alcohol level higher than 0.08 (in the States, 0.05 in many other countries) are involved in accidents or stopped by police. The impact of a specific BAC on driving is physiology dependent (gender, weight, fatigue, etc.), and laws being lawns, a uniform threshold is applied to everyone. What non-negligible BAC does is slow down the reaction time, marginally in some, less so in others. Many go without incident through their lifetime and die of natural causes (no, diving is not a natural cause). But should driving with 0.07 BAC, therefore, be ok? It's below the legal limit in the States, above the legal limit in other countries. I don't have a clear answer but scuba diving is still rec diving for me (I may venture to wrecks deeper than 130 feet with trimix one day), and when that is the case, staying within conservative published tables seems like a reasonable idea. At least one should know when one is exceeding the published NDLs, but the OP (I may be wrong) seemed to rely too much on a glorified calculator (aka dive computer) without thinking for himself.

  4. 1978davidw

    1978davidw Solo Diver

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Unicoi TN
    The op stated he was on adderall. Working in the medical field i would think this was suspect. Adderall is a methamphetimine salt and acts very much like the street drug called meth. It acts on the circulatory system as a vasoconstricter and i would think since the circulatory system is carrying away excess N2 this vasoconstriction would lessen the amount of N2 carried away versus a person who wasnt on this medication. My advice to anyone taking medications that can cause reduced circulatory flow would be to dive more conservative profiles.
    1maddog, tracydr, Ayisha and 4 others like this.
  5. lowviz

    lowviz Solo Diver ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Northern Delaware or the New Jersey Turnpike
    Yeah, on post #78.


    It is also important to understand a bit about yourself. I'm guessing that you are always on the next page or two steps ahead. People like you tend to keep the world from stagnating.

    Your NDL "edge" is two letters before everyone else's. I have this kid, believe me, I know.
  6. frontiernurse

    frontiernurse Nassau Grouper

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: san francisco
    Please forgive me if someone already said what I'm about to say... I didnt read all 17 pages here. Feel free to ignore (or delete!). I'll add another comment from the medical end. I saw a generally healthy adult female, experienced diver, get the "skin" bends (marbling of the skin, lightheaded, tingling fingers) after doing two conservative dives with a generous SI. We were a bit baffled, until she said "my doctor told me I have a tiny hole in my heart but its no big deal." Some studies estimate that one in five adults have a patent formamen ovale (PFO) which is a tiny hole between heart chambers that enable a small amount of de-oxygenated blood to mix with oxygenated blood. In most people the PFO is completely asymptomatic and therefore undiagnosed. I'm not saying PFO contributed to the incident on this thread, but its one of many factors that could cause a "hit." Just adding to the pile.
    beaverdivers likes this.
  7. openmindOW

    openmindOW HSA Instructor

    Thank you, frontier nurse. The possibility of a PFO in the OP's incident was raised. We have not yet heard back with a definitive statement from the OP on that matter.

    The question is have is this. The OP stated that he had done the dives before without problem. He also stated that he had more aggressive profiles without incident. If he had PFO, why didn't it cause symptoms earlier?
  8. Hickdive

    Hickdive Solo Diver

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Glasgow, UK
    Because PFOs are sometimes small enough to require just the right (or wrong) set of circumstances to manifest themselves by opening just enough to allow a small shunt. For example, straining to lift something, sneezing, coughing or performing a valsalva.

    At the extreme end of the scale you have "blue babies" that require immediate surgery after birth to occlude the opening and at the other you have divers who dive safely without incident for years who just happen to line up the three cherries on a particular diving day. In between you have people who would never know they had one unless they started to dive and got bent after very conservative dives.
    openmindOW and frontiernurse like this.
  9. iamrushman

    iamrushman Great White

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: ft. lauderdale, florida
    even when diving right it can go wrong...
    frontiernurse likes this.
  10. RJP

    RJP Scuba Media & Publications

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: New Jersey
    On a similar - or even slightly more agressive - profile, EANx could keep a PFO-mediated issue subclinical.

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