Bitterness of Scuba Instructors

[lowviz]

Anyone seen Matt lately?

He came on like a storm then disappeared. On the surface, looks like he got tired of being beat up in Basic Scuba Discussions.

When I first joined SB I found the whole experience to be somewhat overwhelming, time consuming, and quite frankly -energy draining. So I started looking for a clean getaway. Got into a dustup over donating blood and found that I could take the hits and began to enjoy the back-and-forth / give-and-take. I stayed. I like this place and I admire the mods. They don't do a perfect job, but so what, who does?

So Matt, I did call you brilliantly disingenuous. I could be wrong. Were you just looking for the nearest exit ramp or are you honestly offended?

Best, :sincere: <--- check this out, SB doesn't have an emoticon that denotes sincerity! Nevertheless, I am.
Dennis

 

[mathauck0814]

This is complete and utter nonsense. The number of dives a person has contributes almost nothing to their value on this board. We have people posting good questions/comments before they even get certified. Your attitude is exactly what this thread is all about, and it's total BS.

The first step to learning is being open minded, like you said, but there is zero requirement for closing your mouth. Questions are good things. Debate for purposes of expanding understanding is a good thing. You sound like one of those "I'm smarter than you" college professors who have lots of academia and no "real-world" experience but thinks everything in the real world directly matches theory. I've had a few professors/instructors like that and let me tell you, they were far and away the worst instructors I've ever had.

I don't know that I disagree with the message so much as the tone. I think I agree with the comment insofar as newbies ought to spend more time listening than talking - there are plenty of answers to be had if you put your mind to work reading the wisdom that's already been shared. Most of the OPs questions were basic enough that he could have easily found those answers. I don't mind that he starts conversations, but the thin skin nonsense is a little bit funny.

 

[fjpatrum]

I don't know that I disagree with the message so much as the tone. I think I agree with the comment insofar as newbies ought to spend more time listening than talking - there are plenty of answers to be had if you put your mind to work reading the wisdom that's already been shared. Most of the OPs questions were basic enough that he could have easily found those answers. I don't mind that he starts conversations, but the thin skin nonsense is a little bit funny.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree regarding the "seen and not heard" concept. I've never thought that was appropriate for any situation where someone felt they had a stake in the experience, be it a casual conversation, a class, or anything else.

I do agree that "thin skin" is often a detriment to these types of conversations. I think the "I'm the victim" attitude, whether intentional or not, that I have seen on a few threads here is a bit unrealistic, especially when you're asking for information and support.

 

[CaliDenna]

I have been certified just over a year now and without the support of the people in Scubaboard I probably wouldn't have continued trying to achieve my dream after a very bad encounter with a very bitter instructor. I feel like I sorta wandered in here totally bewildered after my experience (which is in old posts) and was amazed at the people that jumped on board both on posts and in PM to give me some much needed encouragement and tips. My tip off with that instructor should have been in his shop prior to classes where he pretty much bashed anyone else in the industry but hey, I was eager and oblivious and just wanted to dive!

I have also seen in the past year in person, in 3 separate incidences, 3 very bitter instructors at the Catalina Dive Park openly verbally attack other instructors with comments to their students and spectators which I felt was in very poor taste. If an instructor is doing something to endanger a student that is one thing to step in and have a private conversation with that instructor but in each of these cases that was not what was happening.

Happily those are the very minority and in general I find the dive community whenever I have traveled to be very close knit, supportive and friendly.

Some of the "flame wars" in here can be daunting to some I suppose, but I generally just feel sorry for those doing the attacking because they are living in their negative skins everyday whereas others can chose just not to read their comments or interact with them.

 

[lv2dive]

Some of the "flame wars" in here can be daunting to some I suppose, but I generally just feel sorry for those doing the attacking because they are living in their negative skins everyday whereas others can chose just not to read their comments or interact with them.

+infinity

 

[drrich2]

When I first joined SB I found the whole experience to be somewhat overwhelming, time consuming, and quite frankly -energy draining.

I think we run into that joining any large adult forum if fairly new to the subject matter at hand. When new, you don't have a good handle on the material, don't know which posters are nicer/more attitudinal, who really knows their stuff and who's self over-rated, what social networks are in place (and some members seem so tight, with so much history that becoming a 'peer' member of the community seems daunting), and how people will respond if you 'put yourself out there,' share this, take a stand on that, etc...

Some people, perhaps like Matt, are more overt in questioning things ('poking bears,' as someone put it), whereas some lurk a long time before they post (if they ever do). Others try the 'humble & stay out of anything controversial' approach for awhile.

It's hard to judge the temperament of an online community. When I went off to college, I found people much more confrontational discussing ideas than I was used to in a more homogenous rural Arkansas community. Some think many in the north and south (U.S.A.) have different personality styles (not sure how pervasive that is, but some folks match up with it). So what happens when you've got rural, suburban, urban & islander groups from a multinational community who can't get each others tone, body language, etc...?

Richard.

 

[jan-japan]

What's it call to mind, a pot-bellied 40 - 60 year old American tourist in a Hawaiian shirt & Bermuda shorts with a camera on a neck strap standing about clueless about the local culture, etc...? Well, I think that's the way some people unconsciously think of the mainstream middle class, a group that the dive industry's growth, simplified 'modular format' and guide-led group dives in the Caribbean cater to.
Richard.

The guy is in the PADI video shown as a complete retard to make it more "funny"

 

[Jim Lapenta]

The guy is in the PADI video shown as a complete retard to make it more "funny"

I used to think it was funny. Now it just seems kind of sad and frankly insulting that anyone would resort to such a juvenile way of filming a video dealing with such a serious subject. There are ways to make something a little light-hearted without resorting to such things. Fun is one thing. Stupid and insulting is something else. I'd rather see a dramatization more along the lines of "A Deceptively Easy Way To Die" in a video for new divers to learn from. I show that video to every OW class I teach. And to every student I get for con ed who has not seen it.

PADI clown man, as I call him, should be portrayed as Darwin would likely leave someone that clueless. On a stretcher with a sheet over his face and a toe tag. Not making a joke out of being disrespectful to the activity, but showing what being that way can do to you. Maybe things would be taken more seriously.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

 

[nimoh]

I used to think it was funny. Now it just seems kind of sad and frankly insulting that anyone would resort to such a juvenile way of filming a video dealing with such a serious subject. There are ways to make something a little light-hearted without resorting to such things. Fun is one thing. Stupid and insulting is something else. I'd rather see a dramatization more along the lines of "A Deceptively Easy Way To Die" in a video for new divers to learn from. I show that video to every OW class I teach. And to every student I get for con ed who has not seen it.

PADI clown man, as I call him, should be portrayed as Darwin would likely leave someone that clueless. On a stretcher with a sheet over his face and a toe tag. Not making a joke out of being disrespectful to the activity, but showing what being that way can do to you. Maybe things would be taken more seriously.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

getting a little off topic, but I agree. I like the idea of injecting humor into the videos to keep them interesting, but it doesn't help in getting the seriousness of the message across.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Back on topic . What makes me bitter is the failure to impart the serious side of diving. Not towards students but towards anyone who perpetuates the practice. Be it instructor, agency, resort, dive op, etc. Few students are truly incompetent unless they are allowed to be. I have yet to see a truly incompetent student. Nearly any that would approach the description, with a few hours of serious and targeted instruction, have some rather dramatic improvements take place during this. So it makes you wonder where the problem really was.

When it does not take place is usually with those who don't want to learn as opposed to not being able to. I have seen a few whose attitude was "I'm good enough for what I want to do." Here's a tip- no, most times you are not, and even worse is you encourage family members to be the same way. That's truly disheartening for an instructor when a parent will not allow a child to get better and they have the potential.