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BP/W banned in DM Course

Discussion in 'Thinking of a Diving Career?' started by randytay, Apr 14, 2011.

  1. randytay

    randytay Master Instructor

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: USA
    So after the 2nd time we went out with some students doing their OW course as a DMC and seeing me set up my gear, my instructor told me that he didn't want me to use my BP/W and my long hose configuration for OW dives anymore :(

    The reason was that he didn't want the OW students to be confused about my gear. Although I don't quite agree with that statement, I intend to comply with his instructions. I can't help but feel bummed out about using a jacket BCD and back to using more weights.

    What would you have done?
  2. k ellis

    k ellis Divemaster

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Oklahoma
    Well me personaly I would have respected his wishes. In my dive master class I found my personal setup to be a little less then user friendly for a new diver so I dont use it as much for the excercises. What you have to remember is try to be as simple as possible for the newer divers and dont over task them.

    It would be real easy to tell them use say the alternate air then confuse the heck out of them by not even having one but instead an air2. Now you have to use a whole diffrent method on this operation that they have not been exposed to yet.

    The best advice I can give is what my instructor said. Use what the class uses that way they can see how you are setting the same gear they are using and can use you to proof check how they have assembled their gear.
  3. leabre

    leabre Divemaster

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Orange County, CA
    I removed this because I misunderstood the question and answered off topic.
    The Chairman likes this.
  4. bracko

    bracko Divemaster Candidate

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: sydney, Australia
    I agree with the instructor... some students would be concerned as to why their setup is different to yours, also when you're demonstrating setting up gear you want to be able to do it with your eyes closed and not have to contend with strange things (like tank strap incorrectly threadded, or damage to the BCD) if you are using a student's hire gear for demo.

    when i bought my gear I had it in my mind to buy gear that would take me up to and beyond the DM course.

    if i end up getting a BP&W it'll be for "fun" diving only.

    also long hoses are an annoyance with gumby divers who have a tendency to tangle themselves and you in gear.
    k ellis likes this.
  5. Peter Guy

    Peter Guy Divemaster

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Olympia, WA
    I think the response is stupid now and I thought it was stupid when I received the same response.

    Students need to see different rigs so they can decide for themselves what is appropriate to use and buy. IF they are never presented with the alternatives, they'll never be given the information they pay us to provide them.

    I do NOT use the shop gear for the CW sessions, although I don't use a BP/W unless it is a private class (when the student will be in a BP/W) but I do use one for the OW sessions. OTOH, I don't use the same type of gear the students use in CW (they typically use shop rental gear -- jacket BC with "traditional" octo) while I use a Back Inflate BC with an Airsource (and a longer hose on the primary PLUS a bungied reg).

    My experience is as follows:

    a. Students generally don't notice I wear different gear;

    b. Students who do notice are intrigued by my gear and ask pertinent questions; and

    c. Some students use their own gear which is not like my gear OR the shop's gear!

    Instructors need to be flexible and provide information. As long as the gear is generally the same (i.e., not side-mount or CCR), why not expose students to as much information as possible? They are certainly going to see different variations soon enough.
    STwill, gtto, FireInMyBones and 22 others like this.
  6. DevonDiver

    DevonDiver N/A

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: Subic Bay, Philippines
    Personally, I disagree with your instructor and think that it is a short-sighted policy. The BP&W is merely another style of BCD and exposure to it, along with the long-hose configuration, will further develop the students' knowledge and experience.

    Whilst I can understand that the instructor might want you in a replica of their own kit, so that you can mimic the way they demo for reinforcement value, it does show a lack of flexibility in seeing the other educational possibilities that exist from demonstrating a range of applicable techniques.

    The number of questions asked about BP&W and long-hose options here on Scubaboard does illustrate that there is some benefit from educating divers about the full range of configuration options.

    It seems to me that deliberately avoiding that educational opportunity, just to make your job as an instructor more convenient is a dis-service to your students.

    I am guessing that your instructor would also ban Air2 systems etc... as these require donation of the primary also?
    rixxir, gtto, mselenaous and 11 others like this.
  7. randytay

    randytay Master Instructor

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: USA
    That was exactly how I felt when he told me he did not want me to use my BP/W in the OW sessions anymore. I didn't want him to think I am trying to be a smartA** and argue with him about it so I just agreed to it. :(
    rixxir likes this.
  8. randytay

    randytay Master Instructor

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: USA
    He is actually fine with Air2 system I think, but somehow I get the impression that he thinks BP/W are not for recreational divers but tec divers only (like so many people who were misinformed). We did talk about it before I signed up but he made it a point to tell me he did not like nor was he interested about DIR gear configuration and "allowed" me to use it provided I do not give the students any impression that is is "safer" than the standard rig. I told him I didnt think it was safer or better, just different and happens to be my preference. He was fine the first time we went out but after actually observing me set up my gear (he was literally standing over me and telling me he was just watching what I was doing), he did not want me to be in that rig for OW sessions for the reasons stated above. :idk:

    I happen to think exposing new divers to different rigs is a good thing but I guess some instructors are concerned about task loading (which in this case wasn't even a task).
  9. randytay

    randytay Master Instructor

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: USA
    Just for the record, I am not poo-pooing my instructor. On the other hand I think he is a very good instructor. Its just that his decisions about my rig just left me really bummed out :depressed:

    Now I am actually worried that he will tell me not to use the frog kick in case his students get confused about the propulsion techniques...one of the OW students already emulated me and asked me about it :banned:
  10. popje

    popje Instructor, Scuba

    # of Dives:
    Location: Europe, Asia, and temporarily given up on South Am
    I would have gone to another instructor; one with a higher IQ.

    I did my DM course with BP/Wing set up. My instructor thought it would be beneficial for OW students to see different styles of configuration. He would also teach the frog kick to anyone who was struggling with the flutter kick.

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