Cave diving fins

[JohnnyC]

Newer doesn't necessarily mean progress. In the case of fins, more and more are geared to vacation divers who often prefer ease of kicking over power, efficiency, and maneuverability. The attributes valued by cave divers are often not on the same list as a traveling tropical vacation diver. Stiff paddle fins require skill and technique to utilize. Most vacation divers are lacking in those areas, and are incapable of utilizing stiff paddle fins effectively. Manufacturers began offering fins that are easy for a tropical intermittent vacations divers to utilize. The attributes that enable this are problematic for use in an overhead environment, ergo the propensity of cave divers to utilize tried and true designs that allow a diver to use them to the level of their ability and the maximum performance of the fin.

 

[karstdvr]

Definitely not rejecting anything from the 60s, just find it strange that despite all the advances in most scuba diving equipment over the past decades, tech fins seem to have shown limited progress and wanted to make sure that new solutions aren't discounted just because of old school pride.
Totally agree with your point about checking fin selection during training and adapted to my own constraints and other equipment, thanks for that!

Have to understand the marketing influences of the diving industry. Making fins with new designs, and claims, is important in order to encourage people to part with their money,and buy a product, which subsidizes an industry. The physics of moving water with a fin isn't that sophisticated, and over the decades there have been a lot of design changes, with many being fads that don't last long. If a fin design has lasted since the 60s, something must have been done right,but most importantly it has longevity and durability with cave divers, which is critical to life support- if I can't get out I won't survive. One thing you will notice is that I haven't mentioned a name brand of a fin in my comments,because your rig, trim, style, and location of diving will decide that. All I can say is that if cave divers have been using something repetitively for a long time, that has been around for quite awhile, I would give it strong consideration.

 

[kensuf]

Jetfins or Dive Rite XT's.

If I'm diving in my drysuit, the jetfins are the way to go -- the extra weight counter balances any air in my feet.

If I'm wet, the XT's are perfect. I also like the XT's for caribbean reef diving.

 

[tbone1004]

@LesleyP the Deep6 fins that @cerich came out with are a HUGE improvement over the Jet Fins in diver comfort, with a good bit of performance improvement due to the stiffness of the material used. Same basic design because it's a design that works, but some major improvements to the foot pocket and an increase in stiffness made for a great fin improvement.
I am still awaiting a negatively buoyant version for diving doubles, but they are that good that I deal with the slight trim annoyance of the neutral fins when diving doubles.

 

[halocline]

Definitely not rejecting anything from the 60s, just find it strange that despite all the advances in most scuba diving equipment over the past decades,

What are these advances in most scuba diving equipment? Other than computers? Regulators are not any better, just more complicated and expensive, BCs are not significantly better IMO, except there are some nicer, smaller wings available. I guess wetsuits might be better.

 

[EireDiver606]

I'm not doubting that Jet fins, Hollis F1, Apeks RK3 etc. are all great and proven cave diving fins. But in the end they're all based on a design from the 60s. DiveRite XT is definitely more modern, but is there a reason that the most modern fin designs, e.g. a Scubapro Seawing Nova is not commonly used in cave diving, or is this just a question of time...?

Sea Wing Novas break with time between the blade and foot pocket, well maybe not break but lose their elastics but in the middle. They also aren’t the strongest fin and don’t have high rims to the side of the fin to channel the water more efficiently to do tighter manoeuvres in smaller places like caves.

They’re still very popular fins though.

 

[kelemvor]

for sidemount, you're going to want a neutral fin vs. a heavy one. The RK3's aren't stiff enough to deal with the high flow caves in Florida properly.
The two most common fins I'm seeing down there now are Dive Rite XT's and Deep6 Eddy's. I have both. The Dive Rite's don't come out very often....

I use the diverite XT's in a drysuit, Eddy's when I dive wet.

When I started day1 of Cave1, my instructor let me try my articulating fins. I couldn't keep up and had broken the damn things in one day. I bought XT's when we went to fill tanks the next morning. Some lessons have to be taught the hard way, sometimes.

 

[Lobzilla]

@LesleyP Don't try to reinvent the wheel as a novice and end up with something that has more corners and kinks. Most of the "innovations" in the scuba world are about perceived comfort. Are gear hacks to cover up skill deficiencies.

Your cave training is about something entirely different. Do yourself a favor and take "comfort" out of your vocabulary during training and replace it by the addage "Pain is Weakness Leaving the Body."

Let's say you enter the class with a monster of a frogkick. Your instructor will gladly notice that but he/she will also notice that you are not using other kicks where you should. Guess where the next dive goes? To an area where you HAVE to modified flutter or shuffle, where your glutes will burn and your thighs scream in agony. Where you can't use your strongest skill but have to improve your weakest. Your instructor is not a jerk, he/she is doing you a great favor by assuring that the weakest link in your skill chain is well above standards.

You are well advised to pick a fin that does many jobs well (like the excellent suggestions above) rather than picking something that caters only to your strengths or your desire for comfort. Your pain will only be greater when you add tool weakness in areas of skill weakness.

 

[Altamira]

What are these advances in most scuba diving equipment? Other than computers? Regulators are not any better, just more complicated and expensive, BCs are not significantly better IMO, except there are some nicer, smaller wings available. I guess wetsuits might be better.

???. I don't know about improvements to bcds over the years because they were not available in 1965, but I would sure rather dive with a bcd than without one. Also, my SP regs purchased in 2010, when I got back into diving, breathe a hell of a lot better than my 1965 Voit Avalon regulator, and the addition of the octo sure beats buddy breathing coming out of a cave. Wetsuits today are definitely better. They may not keep you any warmer, but are a lot more comfortable and easy to doff/don (no more borrowing your mom's worn out panty hose). The "good old days" are a usually a figment of peoples' defective memories.

 

[halocline]

???. I don't know about improvements to bcds over the years because they were not available in 1965, but I would sure rather dive with a bcd than without one. Also, my SP regs purchased in 2010, when I got back into diving, breathe a hell of a lot better than my 1965 Voit Avalon regulator,

I use regulators from the 70's and 80's that are every bit as high performance and reliable as anything on the market today. That's almost 4 decades ago. I also use a backplate and wing system, which is based on a design that predates the jacket BC. Sure there was some terrible gear 30-40 years ago but there was also some excellent gear. Most of the "innovations" offered by the recreational dive gear industry since, say 1980, are really more about sales, marketing, production cost, etc than actually improving diving.

Nobody is arguing that the SPG and buoyancy compensator are not worthy dive gear advancements.