Cold and unhappy...

[buddhasummer]

You can certainly ask them. They made the suit for you and understand what is needed to fit those thermals in any of their suits.

Yes, that's what I have done, the dealer seems unsure so despite Santi not liking to deal with customers directly I had no choice. Am still waiting for a response. Cheers.

---------- Post added March 30th, 2014 at 11:48 PM ----------

Well I've got to check out these BZ200 and 400 garments. I don't see any other way of staying warm longer unless it's a heated garment.

If you feel the cold I wouldn't bother with a BZ200.

---------- Post added March 31st, 2014 at 03:54 AM ----------

Santi confirmed the BZ400 will fit under my suit, I've saved the email in case all goes wrong and it doesn't fit.

 

[Diver0001]

Here are some "tricks" I use to keep warm in the winter. I feel qualified to talk about this because our water temps get down to just above freezing during the winter.

First, if you have a site that lends itself to diving all the way to the bottom, you might want to use it. Often when surface temps are 2C (coldest I've ever seen here was -2C), the water at the bottom will always be 4C. If you can plan to dive to the "warmer" water then it's something to consider using. Obviously this will apply more to lakes and quarries than to the ocean.

Secondly, layer. What I use is a base layer, a 150grams fleece undergarment made by waterproof and a 200g "ski suit" over that. The final layer is shirt made for jumbo-brothers that I wear over everything and have modified (cut of the collar, arms and most of the length). It's sole purpose is to provide pockets over the pectorals. In these pockets I put sodium acetate pads (the ones with the click-disk) that I can activate during the dive. They run for 30 min or so and the idea is different than with a body warmer. It's not intended to warm up your torso so much as to warm up the air in your suit (or to delay cooling). It makes a big difference.

Third, I have learned to inhale through my mouth and exhale through my nose for most of the dive. Why? because when you inhale your body warms up that air and when you exhale through your nose, much of that warm air goes into the cap. This is central heating for your head! Nothing give your brain the message that it's cold more than your head and hands being cold. Use that warm air to keep your head warm.

Fourth, if you don't already, then get dry gloves. As I said, nothing gives your brain the message that it's cold more than your head and your hands being cold. Keep your hands warm to feel a LOT more comfortable.

R..

 

[Belce]

So have you got the BZ400 yet and if so how does it work for you?

 

[buddhasummer]

So have you got the BZ400 yet and if so how does it work for you?

Not yet, I'm expecting it any day now. I'll post back once received.

 

[Belce]

okay Buddha when you get

 

[eelnoraa]

I am very warm bordering on hot before I go diving as I wear all my undergarments, down jacket, hat and gloves on my way to dive site. Cheers.

I think this may play a big role. If you are hot to a point you are sweating in your drysuit before the dive, the sweat is what make your cold once your core cold down. Try NOT to suit up until the last moment. Or jump in for a cold water dip after suit up to keep your from sweating.

As for Thermo Fusion undergarment, I would say it is some where in between 200g thinsulate and 400g thinsulate in terms of warm. At 56F water, I will definitely dive with BZ400 instead of BZ200

 

[diverdenise]

I have been going through the same scenario. We dive in 35F+ water in the winter under ice. I bought the Santi heated vest last year and wore it with a whites fusion and MK undergarment plus under armour. I was wearing two hoods to keep from getting a brain freeze but then bought a otter bay fitted hood which I love. It made life better except for cold shoulders and hands. I was wearing 7mm three finger gloves. This last winter I bought the Santi heated BZ400 with heated gloves. A lot warmer but having difficulty with finding a dry glove to go over the heated glove that fits. They all have long fingers that flop around. I am 5'6 and 135 but not a lot of muscle mass so get very cold. I do stay deeper to put more air in my drysuit and don't use the BC or wing for air. I also wear lots of weight to get all my fluffy undergarments down plus some extra to put more air in my suit. I also use the breathing out the nose to keep warm air in my hood and try not to compress my the air in my hood which makes it cold. My feet do well but have on the coldest dives put in those toe warmers which seem to work fairly well. I am currently researching the thermalution idea but don't really want to put more money into their vest that will work in a drysuit. I would like to get away from all the bulk and weight but as previously mentioned in a thread I need to realize I can't have it all. Winter diving is not for the faint at heart. Or the weak kneed packing tons of weight. One feels pretty immobile in all this gear. I sure hope you find the answer to getting out of the water nice and toasty. Course if you keep that heated BZ400 on after you get out of the water you will toast up quick. I do also try to not get to overheated before going into the water and turn my heater on when I start getting chilled.

 

[Belce]

I think you should try less air in your suit as more air does not equal warmer. You only need enough to loft your undergarment and if you float at the surface feet down with the exhaust valve open that feeling will be ideal for what your undergarment needs to keep you most efficiently warm. The air you put in your suit starts out really cold anyways adding a lot of really cold air just means more to warm up.

And for the heated vest, it is better to keep and stay warm than to play catch-up. If you know you are going to be chilled on a dive without it, turn it on before you feel cold.

Your BCD is your primary buoyancy compensator device as that is what it is designed for. You add air to your drysuit to make your thermals work as it is exposure protection. Regardless of the situation and orientation in the water it is always easier to get air out of your BCD compared to your drysuit.

 

[TSandM]

Belce, I will differ with that prescription. After listening to the material presented at DEMA last year about thermal stress and decompression, I think the only safe way to use the vests is to turn them on only for the last ten or 15 minutes of a dive, essentially during the ascent phase. Warm on deco, but not warm during bottom time, because if the vest fails -- you didn't get a full charge, or for any other reason -- you are not in good shape from a DCS standpoint if you were heating during bottom time and get cold on deco.

 

[JohnN]

Your BCD is your primary buoyancy compensator device as that is what it is designed for. You add air to your drysuit to make your thermals work as it is exposure protection. Regardless of the situation and orientation in the water it is always easier to get air out of your BCD compared to your drysuit.

Absolutely agree, I had an interesting SI discussion with a local PADI instructor last weekend, according to him, PADI says to use the BCD as your primary buoyancy device if you are diving a neoprene drysuit, but to use the drysuit if you're diving a shell type suit.

We agreed it makes absolutely no sense, particularly if you're diving a shell suit and get a runaway feet up ascent. . .