• Welcome to ScubaBoard


  1. Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

    Benefits of registering include

    • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
    • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
    • You can make this box go away

    Joining is quick and easy. Login or Register now by clicking on the button

cold water exposure suit debate

Discussion in 'Exposure Suits' started by arcticat99, Oct 18, 2016.

  1. BurhanMuntasser

    BurhanMuntasser Dive Charter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Nomad
    5,596
    1,801
    113
    arcticat99 likes this.
  2. dumpsterDiver

    dumpsterDiver Banned

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location:
    9,003
    4,666
    113

    If you buy a quality suit with good neoprene, the suit should last a long time. I have used Cressi sub, a custom Elios and MAKO (which is Yamamoto neoprene) on many, many dive past the recreational depths and the suits held up very well.

    I checked the mako site and 7 mm suits are less than I thought.. you also need to consider that it includes a hood which is often a significant additional cost for most scuba suits..

    http://www.makospearguns.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=M2YRC

    Also, in general I think that wearing additional garments under a wetsuit does not add that much warmth. However, if the suit is at all loose and the garment helps fill any voids and helps to hold water, then you will get a big benefit - for example a wool sweater. Of course, a properly fitted cold water suit, is probably not going to have room for a wool sweater. :rolleyes:

    Thick wool socks worn under neoprene dive boots make a very noticeable improvement in warmth - as long as your foot still fits in the fin pocket. It does make the boot slide around a little over the sock, so be extra careful if you are scrambling over rocks, but otherwise the added warmth is pretty amazing.
     
  3. tbone1004

    tbone1004 ScubaBoard Supporter ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Greenville, South Carolina, United States
    15,723
    7,063
    113
    drysuits can't dump air quite as fast as wings can because they rely on air pressure so it is easier to get into a runaway situation if you use your drysuit as a buoyancy compensator if you are using large tanks. With al80's or lp72's the amount of extra gas in the suit is negligible anyway so it doesn't matter, but PADI teaches to use drysuit as the primary BC because it is easier, not because it is safer. In technical diving you can't use your suit as a BC, it's very unsafe because of the runaway mentioned above, is a very good way to get very wet as the seals will burp from the extra pressure behind them if you have to go head up or hand up for some reason, and is also a horrible way to kick around. With extra air in the suit, it will want to naturally migrate to your feet where you are at a higher risk of an uncontrolled foot up ascent, and you lose efficiency because your feet have big bags around them that cause unnecessary drag in the water and that bubble is far better controlled by the wing.
     
  4. BurhanMuntasser

    BurhanMuntasser Dive Charter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Nomad
    5,596
    1,801
    113
    Does SDI/TDI and others teach it different from PADI?
     
  5. spoolin01

    spoolin01 Solo Diver

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: SF Bay Area, CA
    1,525
    210
    63
    Ah, it's a compressed neoprene drysuit. I've just gotten a Pinnacle Black Ice, which seems to have similar specs, but have yet to try it out. I assume it's going to require undergarments to match the old 7mm uncompressed drysuit for 50F diving here.
    I would love to go back to wetsuit diving if I could stay warm enough, but have always figured a farmer john would be just as bulky as the drysuit without being quite as warm in the legs. If you're saying that hyperstretch isn't just a positive marketing term for "crushes quickly", I might give it a try. I don't actually dive below 60ft around here with any regularity. The pricing is certainly right.

    To elaborate, I'm moving more completely to solo diving at least for now, and am leery of the drysuit for it's fiddliness. A wetsuit has a lot of appeal in this regard.

    LOL, does anyone make one of these thicker than 7mm?
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2016
  6. dumpsterDiver

    dumpsterDiver Banned

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location:
    9,003
    4,666
    113
    Some wetsuits are made in 9 mm 3/8" I had one when I was a kid.. Probably you could get a custom suit made from that stuff somewhere, but you will need a lot of lead. One of the things that is VERY important to freedivers is to avoid wearing too much wetsuit.

    When a freediver goes down- he has no way to compensate for suit compression - so a thick suit will make a diver heavy at 40-50 feet .. of course scuba divers have BC's so the issue is addressed with the push of a button.

    The point is that freedivers need to wear the MOST efficient wetsuit possible. They want to minimize their wetsuit, so they have the least buoyancy swing. Most people will say that a 5 mm freedive suit is as warm as a 7 mm scuba suit with zippers and separate hood.

    This is why pretty much all freedive suits have a very similar general configuration,, it is warmer, and since the neoprene has nylon only one side, the rubber is more flexible and comfortable and they can often use a thinner neoprene.
     
  7. tbone1004

    tbone1004 ScubaBoard Supporter ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Greenville, South Carolina, United States
    15,723
    7,063
    113
    no idea, I don't believe in drysuit courses either, far better for mentoring imho, but that's why I don't teach in dive shops... The industry and I have many disagreements in that regard. For solo diving and diving in cold water in general I'm a firm believer that drysuits are safer than thick wetsuits if you know how to manage them properly while being a firm believer in diving wet whenever possible. Yeah, wrap your head around that one ;-) I believe in 3 suits. 3mm shorty, basically enough for long exposure in 80+* water. 5mm full suits with or without a hooded vest depending on the actual temperature and length of exposure, and drysuits, again depending on water temp and length of exposure. The 60-75* range is variable between the 5mm and drysuit depending on surface conditions and exposure time, and anything below 60 with total daily exposure exceeding 2 hours calls immediately for a drysuit imho.
     
  8. BurhanMuntasser

    BurhanMuntasser Dive Charter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Nomad
    5,596
    1,801
    113

    But it is extremely difficult to find XL or XXL sizes in free diving suits :)
     
  9. BurhanMuntasser

    BurhanMuntasser Dive Charter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Nomad
    5,596
    1,801
    113

    LOL, I don't know where to start to pick on this.

    :rofl3:
     
  10. spectrum

    spectrum Dive Bum Wannabe ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: The Atlantic Northeast (Maine)
    11,376
    817
    113
    I have a Bare Reactive and it is a nice suit. it's only as hood as the weakest link and on a full suit it is the neck opening.I have a hard time saying it dramatically better than the 12 year old Arctic it replaced though the arm and leg seal systems are slick. I wear the hooded step-in vest and together it's the next best thing to being in a dry suit.

    By virtue of being dry and having insulation control a drysuit will be warmer If you have the right garment. As we leave summer behind another huge benefit is your comfort when changing and on surface intervals.

    I prefer diving in a wetsuit when it is comfortable to do so. There comes a point where it's better to just go dry than to try to optimize the heck out of wet suits and the semi-dry cousins. As you move north that hurdle comes sooner. You are very north.

    Your buoyancy control may be that of a new diver but it's not uncommon for new divers in your neck of the woods to go dry from the get go.Even seasoned divers are usually off their game for 10 or so dives when they first go dry. Take a good class/ find a mentor of you decide to bite the bullet and invest.

    Pete
     
    arcticat99 likes this.

Share This Page