Diabetes and Diving???

[peterbj7]

There is a profound difference between insulin-dependent diabetes and diabetes that is controlled by diet/drugs. I am one of the latter, having been diagnosed very early in the illness (I had annual medical examinations for flying and commercial diving, so it was picked up long before it would otherwise have been) about 8 years ago. I am an instructor registered with several agencies (not NAUI) and a technical instructor. I frequently do long and demanding dives. Because my problem is excess blood sugar, not too little, I am in no danger of my status changing underwater and the diabetes has zero impact on my diving or in fact any other of my activities. There are many other diabetics with a similar condition. Many people who don't have diabetes think there is one condition called "diabetes" and hypos are a fact of life for them. That simply isn't true. Nonetheless I was initially denied medical clearance for diving/flying in the UK until I appealed. Luckily some reason had sunk in to the minds of the physicians who decide these things, and they said I could have clearance "so long as my diabetes was well controlled" - missing the point that even if it weren't I still wouldn't be a danger to myself or my students.

I'm not complacent, and realise that my diabetes could change in character so that a hypo could become a possibility. Until that point however, and I'd have plenty of warning, I can continue extreme diving and teaching in complete safety (well, wrt diabetes!) with a completely clear conscience.

On another subject, in the UK there is such a thing as a 'diving physician" who is an ordinary physician with additional specialist training. Similarly there are also physicians specially certified to conduct flying medicals. A far better system than just going to any physician and hoping they know something about the subject.

 

[pasley]

In line with all this, does anyone know of a waterproof pill bottle (or something like a pill bottle), which can go down to, say 100' +/-, which can store glucose tabs ? Both my son and I carry gel, in case he should need it (I do not have diabetes), but I would also like to carry some glucose tabs for him, in case we find ourselves needing to do a significant surface swim. He has mentioned to me that if that scenario occurred, and he needed glucose for, or during, the swim, that he would like the option to maybe take glucose tabs instead of gel.

Ben

Why the aversion to the gel? IMHO you would still need to carry the gel as well as the pills in case you needed it at depth. I will agree the surface swim is a very likely scenario for needing glucose, but in a current you may need it at depth too. I would also be concerned about condensation ruining the pills inside the container. The high humidity environment coupled with the chilling effects of diving could result in moisture inside the container unless you sealed it up at home and put in a desiccant pack. There should be several waterproof containers certified to that depth available. You may be able to do one of those vacume sealed plastic baggies too.

 

[reticentDiver]

Why the aversion to the gel? IMHO you would still need to carry the gel as well as the pills in case you needed it at depth. I will agree the surface swim is a very likely scenario for needing glucose, but in a current you may need it at depth too. I would also be concerned about condensation ruining the pills inside the container. The high humidity environment coupled with the chilling effects of diving could result in moisture inside the container unless you sealed it up at home and put in a desiccant pack. There should be several waterproof containers certified to that depth available. You may be able to do one of those vacume sealed plastic baggies too.

My regular buddy is a type-1 diabetic. We both carry gels and have practiced him consuming them under water to make sure he would have no trouble if it is needed. Lately we have been experimenting with using a bladder (camelback or similar) full of sugary liquid for the event of a long surface swim or wait. Again, we have practiced using this with good results.

 

[DiveBen]

ReticentDiver, my son and I plan to practice him taking the gel underwater at the next dive, which will be in a Florida spring. What should we expect when we open the gel tube underwater? Would the water flood into the gel tube? Or would the gel be pressed out due to the water pressure??? I am thinking that one or the other would occur, before being able to cover the openning with a finger tip.
Also, how deep can you take one of those bladders you mention?

 

[KrisB]

ReticentDiver, my son and I plan to practice him taking the gel underwater at the next dive, which will be in a Florida spring. What should we expect when we open the gel tube underwater? Would the water flood into the gel tube? Or would the gel be pressed out due to the water pressure??? I am thinking that one or the other would occur, before being able to cover the openning with a finger tip.
Also, how deep can you take one of those bladders you mention?

I had expected someone else to get here first, but I can answer a couple questions.

It is unlikely that water will "flood into the gel tube" or that the "gel would be pressed out due to the water pressure".

Consider that the gel is a substance that is not subject to substantial compression due to water pressure -- it is liquid/solid, not gaseous. If, however, your tube is only half gel, and the other half contains an air pocket, it could happen that it would suck some water in as the pocket expands to regular size (depending on the composition of the tube container).

As I suspect this gel is rather expensive, you could practice by using CapriSun drink bags -- that'll get you a feel for things.

Having consumed some of the latter underwater in salt water, I can tell you that the two want to mix -- if you don't plug the straw with your finger, your first gulp will be very salty. ALSO: the action of sucking on the straw wreaks havoc on the equalised air spaces in your head -- try to squeeze the tube/drink container more than sucking it out.

 

[ScubaVideo]

My son (and dive buddy) was diagnosed with T1 diabetes in late 2008. About one year later, he pursued and received his OW cert, and earlier this year, his AOW (along with myself). He is 17 years old right now, and is developing into a really good diver. He has good control over his diabetes, and so no issues thus far. He has 31 logged dives so far, and counting. Although the LDS which certified him seemed a bit hesistant at first, they nevertheless agreed to provide the training and cert. I think what may have been the deciding point for them, especially due to his young age, was that I was going to sit through the class myself, as a refresher, and also be his buddy for his OW cert dive (it was a great experience to share with him).

In line with all this, does anyone know of a waterproof pill bottle (or something like a pill bottle), which can go down to, say 100' +/-, which can store glocose tabs ? Both my son and I carry gel, in case he should need it (I do not have diabetes), but I would also like to carry some glucose tabs for him, in case we find ourselves needing to do a significant suface swim. He has mentioned to me that if that scenario occured, and he needed glucose for, or during, the swim, that he would like the option to maybe take glucose tabs instead of gel.

Ben

OMS sells this BCA298 and BCA299 which I believe is the same as this tube. I have the BCA298 and purchased it from OMS's site - here at omscloseouts.com

 

[DiveBen]

Thanks for the input to my inquiry. Kris, you gave me something to think about. Basically, I am believing that there is an air pocket in the gel tube my son is carrying. Because of that air pocket, I am believing that immediately upon twisting/breaking off the cap, there will be a reaction. However, the reaction may be so small, that it is negligible, assuming a finger is quickly placed over the openning. I'm just not sure. I do see your point, and will take advantage of your idea about trying it out with a juice pack. Maybe at 10 feet or so, since I don't think the Capri juice pack can take much pressure.

Scubavideo, thanks for the great links. I'm going to pursue the BCA299 item, and see how it turns out. Except for the length, that is exactly what I had in mind. Maybe just a couple of inches shorter, but nevertheless, it fits the application I am looking for really well.

Ben

 

[pasley]

OK, lets look at this another way. If nothing happens on the surface when you remove the lid, the same will be true at depth.
Assumptions.
1. this is an air bubble inside the tube.
2. Air bubbleis at 1 ATA at the surface
3. External pressure is at 1 ATA at the surface of the ocean (acutally this is basic physics and not an assumption).
4. Because at the surfade the pressure inside the tube is equal to the pressure outside the tube when you remove the lid, provided you do not press on the tube nothing happens.

Now we move to 99 feet depth in sea water. Because the water pressure outside the tube (think toothpast) is squeezing on the tube, but when you open it it is also squeezing with eual pressure back on the mouth of the tube, I suspect nothing much if anything will happen. If anything, the pressure inside the tube may (I doubt it) be less than outside particularly if there are compressible air bubbles in the gel (remember the air bubbles in the gel or inside the tube are put there at 1ATA.).
External Pressure 4 ATA, Internal Pressure of tube 4 ATA, Pressure of air bubble in tube is 4 ATA. Everything is in equalibrium. Again, nothing will happen when you remove the lid.

 

[eelpout]

We use camelback bladders all the time when we do deco dives to keep us hydrated. OJ in one these bladdes would work very well.
Deep Sea Supply https://www.deepseasupply.com//sells one that goes between twin tanks, you might want to ask Tobin (at DSS) if he has any ideas for modifying his bladder system.

Good luck,
Jim

 

[KrisB]

OK, lets look at this another way. If nothing happens on the surface when you remove the lid, the same will be true at depth.
Assumptions.
1. this is an air bubble inside the tube.
2. Air bubbleis at 1 ATA at the surface
3. External pressure is at 1 ATA at the surface of the ocean (acutally this is basic physics and not an assumption).
4. Because at the surfade the pressure inside the tube is equal to the pressure outside the tube when you remove the lid, provided you do not press on the tube nothing happens.

Now we move to 99 feet depth in sea water. Because the water pressure outside the tube (think toothpast) is squeezing on the tube, but when you open it it is also squeezing with eual pressure back on the mouth of the tube, I suspect nothing much if anything will happen. If anything, the pressure inside the tube may (I doubt it) be less than outside particularly if there are compressible air bubbles in the gel (remember the air bubbles in the gel or inside the tube are put there at 1ATA.).
External Pressure 4 ATA, Internal Pressure of tube 4 ATA, Pressure of air bubble in tube is 4 ATA. Everything is in equalibrium. Again, nothing will happen when you remove the lid.

That's true. The one exception is if we're talking about a flexible, though rigid, container. Think shampoo container (or a hand lotion tube). As its contents are emptied, the container maintains some degree of its original shape by replacing it with air. If you take this container underwater, that air bubble will be a fraction of its size at the surface. The container will want to re-expand and as such will suck in a small amount of water.

Does that make sense?