Disappointed / Frustrated with my first OW class

[Doby45]

As I understand from my reading, mask pressures get increasingly tighter with depth - yes? Perhaps at 20 feet my mask would have been just right and not leaked and the instructor was bang on. But we were doing pool drills at about 3 feet under, which probably didn't have enough pressure to seal the mask in the way he was, in his overly hurried state, thinking it would. This could have been solved if he took more time to seriously examine my concern and wasn't in such a rush.

Your mask is one of those air spaces you equalize. So yes, if you ALLOW it to squeeze onto your face it will and it will also be painful. A simply puff of air from your nose will equalize the space and you will be good to go. The mask itself would appear to be a moot point and your main concern was the lack of assistance/instruction from the instructor.

 

[filmguy123]

The mask itself would appear to be a moot point and your main concern was the lack of assistance/instruction from the instructor.

Right on

 

[CuzzA]

Cuzza - agree with your self reliance independent outlook on students responsibility. Also 100% agree with DoctorMike. While the mask issue was a minor issue I get what you are saying - I am my own best advocate, etc. - at the same time, a student, even the best student, simply won't know what they don't know until they know it. A certain level of trust and dependency on the professional you are paying to train you is not only to be expected, but its actually to be required to learn anything. Imagine being a teacher and having a student who would argue with everything you told them and not listen. That's being unteachable. I asked, he told me, I asked again and clarified, he insisted. What else was I to do? Snorkeling experience is irrelevant here, because you aren't submerged. I was told the pressure would hold it in. It didn't. Should I have gotten into argument after already asking twice? Here's the thing, the instructor may have actually been right. As I understand from my reading, mask pressures get increasingly tighter with depth - yes? Perhaps at 20 feet my mask would have been just right and not leaked and the instructor was bang on. But we were doing pool drills at about 3 feet under, which probably didn't have enough pressure to seal the mask in the way he was, in his overly hurried state, thinking it would. This could have been solved if he took more time to seriously examine my concern and wasn't in such a rush.

Filmguy, I hope you didn't take my post the wrong way. Like I said, it's all in hindsight and a valuable lesson learned. And I agree with you, the pro should be helping you, but we know for a fact that isn't always the case. Again, I'm not casting blame, now you know, if anything isn't right, you stop until the issue is solved.

Your instructor was wrong. It doesn't matter if you're above, at or below the surface, your mask should hold a vacuum seal. Snorkeling doesn't necessarily mean floating on the surface. We dive down when snorkeling. The mask should not leak at any time.

As mentioned, you sould buy your own mask, I'm surprised that wasn't required. But just so you know when you go mask shopping, the proper way to fit a mask is to hold your breath, place it on your face without using the strap, push gently to expel excess air and it should hold on your face. You should be able to look around and bend over and the mask should stay put. It should also make a pop sound when you pull it off your face as you continue to hold your breath.

 

[MAKO Spearguns]

The above is true with respect to mask fitting. Some people find that the test needs to be done with a snorkel or regulator in your mouth or even bite your bent index finger. Have a regulator in the mouth changes the shapeOf some people's faces and can cause creases and wrinkles to form.

Btw the mako min mask is guaranteed to fit.

 

[filmguy123]

CuzzA not taken the wrong way at all! I really do appreciate it. You are right. I only meant, this was their bad and I shouldn't *have* to be responsible for that kind of stuff. That's their job. But I 100% agree that unfortunately that's the honest reality all too often, and it doesn't matter at the end of the day if its someone else's fault if I were to find myself with DCS or OOA. I'm still the one who suffers the consequences. This was a great way to learn that lesson, and I will take that knowledge with me to any dive boat I find myself on in the future. You can rest assured I'm going to be the one carefully analyzing the proposed dive plan and double checking it for any tours I pay for in the future.

I've learned this with medical care too - that I am not only my own best advocate, but that I better be. It's all been minor issues, but I quickly learned that if you are knowledgeable, its shocking how many things get done wrong by the pros. I make it a point every time I am in to learn what they are dosing me with and how much, how thorough they are checking something or what they could be overlooking. And it's paid off a number of times. Unfortunate, but true.

RE: the mask, they actually *encouraged* us NOT to buy a mask. I was told they have lots of masks, we should try out a new one every OW session, and then purchase one only after a few weeks and before OWW to ensure we have tried out different gear so we can find something that we like. Makes enough sense. I'm really not too hung up on this issue though, like another said, the mask isn't a big deal to me, it was merely illustrative of the lack of attention and assistance.

 

[Lorenzoid]

. . .
RE: the mask, they actually *encouraged* us NOT to buy a mask. I was told they have lots of masks, we should try out a new one every OW session, and then purchase one only after a few weeks and before OWW to ensure we have tried out different gear so we can find something that we like. Makes enough sense. I'm really not too hung up on this issue though, like another said, the mask isn't a big deal to me, it was merely illustrative of the lack of attention and assistance.

Good advice. Find a mask that you feel fits properly. You have plenty of time to try out masks and other gear, and that leads me to say that similar thinking could be applied to your other gear choices. You know, you can probably try out various BCs, including a BP/W, and various regulators before you buy. Maybe not every brand you have in mind, but some. I rented gear for quite a few dives before I decided to buy my own. Depending on where you live and how you network around the dive community, you may also be able to simply borrow stuff from various people. Try before you buy.

 

[filmguy123]

Lorenzoid - for sure. Really great advice. Would definitely like to try both a BC and BP/W in person before committing to one (for you BP/W aficionados, don't worry, I'll have someone who knows one well show me the ropes to make sure I experience it "right"). Same with comparing Hollis F1s, Force Fins, etc. I'm glad I've learned so much about all the options first, because it enables me to actually know what to try and to look for. I'd be lost otherwise, or just relying on the discretion or opinion of a single shop owner or dive buddy. But trying it in person is the only way to really understand it and know.

 

[oly5050user]

i had a class that 6-1 -- do not be afraid to speak up and voice your concerns --- a simple thing like a mask is important IMO -- if you get underwater and are having problem it could ruin your whole dive.

also an instructor that races through a class is NOT a great instructor in my opinion. you are the one paying him, not the other way around. i would stop in at the dive shop and voice your concerns and maybe find another place to learn from if you are not happy with the instruction you are getting.
makes a very good point.

I would say that an instructor that stops the class progress for too long a time for 1 problem student who does not get it is wrong and unfair to others in the class who show up on time and prepared and not a very good instructor.
If a student signs up for a group class and needs individual help while the rest of the class gets it right it is not fair to the other students to be held up and have their time in class delayed by spending an inordinate amount of time with the individual that has issues. Everyone paid for a group class and this can happen. Group classes are less expensive than private for a reason. It's a GROUP class not a one to one private class with individual attention. When you ride in a taxi it costs more than a bus for the time saved and comfort it delivers. Same with a private class vs a group class. More times than not are they not comfortable swimmers. I say continue the course on its schedule for the rest of the group and either recycle the person with problems into next class at no charge or suggest an upgrade to private class. Everyone learns at different rates and if someone knows they are slow elearners, poor swimmers, scared some how of being in the water they should be prepared to pay a bit more for the extra care they need. Instructors are paid little enough as it is and to expect them to work on their own time after class with 1 person that does not get it is unfair to the instructor and only cuts into the instructor per hour pay to less than minimum. After all people it is a business.
Very often I have worked with a problem student while the rest of the class that finished and completed their objectives pratice in the pool on their own. I am not a ogre, But to have a class of 8 up to module 4 and one student who still cannot make a controlled descent or clear a mask of water without difficulty , you have to ask why this person is having so much difficulty while the rest of the group is doing great. That student should be in a private class and be charged for it.

 

[urbaneve71]

i agree -- but going over good mask preparation is essential and that is important. it doesnt take but less than 5 min to teach someone the basics of proper mask techniques. it does not take and "extraordinary" amount of time to help someone out. if they are not comfortable swimmers then maybe they should not be diving.

in my dive class we had to swim a certain amount of pool length to be considered for the class. so your point is moot. if you think that having a poor fitting mask is not that important i certainly would not want to be in your class. my instructor was very through about that. he even went as far as teaching us how to clear our mask, thererfore, a mask must fit right in order to do so.

a private class in unnecessary for something as simple as learning how to properly fit a mask.

 

[Thrawn7]

I did my OW through SSI on a cheap USD $150 course last year (including all equipment rental and transport from the dive shop)

Had 10 people in the class. 1 instructor + 1 trainee assistant instructor.

e-Learning prior to class
Monday night. 1.5 hours classroom + 2 hours pool session
Saturday. 2 hour classroom + 2 open water shore dives
Sunday. 1 hour class + 1 hour pool session + 2 open water shore dives

Most of the students barely understood the theory before the class. Prior to class we had barely any idea what the equipment were and zero clue on how to put it together. We definitely went through the instructions at a fast pace with little time for individual attention.

There are of course stragglers and one couple decided they didn't want to proceed (they weren't comfortable in water).

Of course there are the usual issues here and there and they weren't always 100% resolved on the spot. But you have to keep in mind that you will be doing this over and over during the course and there will be plenty of opportunities to try different things to get it right. Expecting a perfect mask on your 1st go is rather naive. Mask floods are so common that there's nothing wrong with experiencing it early (particularly during a pool session)

One of the nice things about doing things in a big group is that you see a wider range of "glitches".. you get to see how other people handle problems and perform skills. Their problems are a learning experience for you and vice-versa.

Overall I was very happy with my OW course. We didn't really finish the course as fully ready autonomous divers.. but frankly need to get a lot more diving experience anyway. And the money saved over a private course goes a long way towards paying for another 10 dives and an Advanced course