Dive Rite EX35 can light?

[stuartv]

I just recently saw that Dive Rite have this new can light. The specs sound pretty awesome.

EX35 Primary Canister Light | Dive Rite

4300 lumens
150 wHr battery pack
6 degree beam angle

The specs are a bit confusing, though. In one part of the description it says:

The airline approved 150Wh expedition battery canister provides 3.5 hours of burn time at max power,

But then, in a different part it says:

Burn time on 100% power mode is: 1 hour @ peak output + 5 hours of gradual taper. At 6 hours, the light flashes 3 times to indicate low battery and steps down to 1% power mode to conserve power for up to an additional 16 hours before shutting off.

WTF does all that mean? Can I get 3.5 hours on full brightness or not?

Also, another part of the description says:

The EX35 Primary Canister Light is operated using a magnetic push button on the head which eliminates the failure points associated with toggle or piezoelectric switches.

Huh? That's the first time I've ever heard of failure points associated with piezoelectric switches. Is that a thing? I have certainly heard of failures with magnetic push buttons. Never piezoelectrics.

The description says it uses a Cree XHP35 LED emitter. I found 2 specs for that:

XLamp XHP35 High Intensity LED | Cree Components

and

XLamp XHP35 LED | Cree Components

The "High Intensity" version lists a max output of 1483 lumens.

The other version lists a max output of 1712 lumens (funny that it's more than the "High Intensity")

None of those are 4300 lumens. However, my understanding is that higher outputs can be achieved by simply driving the LED emitter with more current and/or voltage than what Cree uses when they spec the output.

Which leads to the next observation from their product page:

The all new light head was designed from the ground up for maximum heat dissipation. The red anodized aluminum head efficiently removes heat allowing the Cree XHP35 HI LED to be driven at 35 watts while increasing service life and output.

So, I reckon they are driving at a power level way above what Cree specs, and relying on lots of big cooling fins and the fact that it will be operated underwater to let it run with so much power yet stay cool enough not to burn out right away.

Which led me to wonder about what the warranty is. The product page does not mention any warranty, but elsewhere on their site, I found this:

Lights carry the Dive Rite's general one-year warranty. Floods, broke bulbs, broke lenses, or punctured cords are not covered under warranty unless they are the result of a direct manufacturer defect.

Battery packs and individual battery cells are covered by a 90-day warranty from time of purchase.

At: Warranty | Dive Rite

That would make me nervous. Only a 1 year warranty on an LED light head that is being driven at more than double the LED manufacturer's spec. I say more than double because LED emitter efficiency is nothing like 100%. So, to get double the lumens out, you have to put in more than double the power.

Lastly, I know some people don't like the QRM setup. I watched some videos on this light and, though it does come with the QRM setup, you can remove that and attach the light head directly to the hard Goodman handle with no QRM at all.

All in all, this light seems to walk a line somewhere in between the less expensive Chinese lights that have slightly inferior specs and the more expensive lights, like the UWLD 35. And it's price reflects that at $1200 (on the DGX website).

Do any of y'all have any real-world experience with this light?

Anybody got any more knowledgeable insight into the idea of driving the LED emitter at double its spec?

It seems to me like if this light head had a 5 or 10 year warranty, it would be an option I would strongly consider. But, if the head burned out after 1 year and 1 month, I would be kicking myself hard for spending that much money on it. And the specs make it seem (to my non-lighting expert brain) like burning out is a very realistic possibility. A possibility that I generally don't worry about with other LED lights.

I wonder if it protects itself so that if, for example, it gets accidentally turned on out of the water will it melt down eventually, or will it be fine, even if just sits there, running on the High setting, until the battery dies.

 

[divad]

I'm glad you asked. I'm wondering too......after making a leap of faith on impulse.

 

[aviator8]

150 wHr battery pack

Well this is wrong. Per FAA guidelines that TSA is following 100Whr is travel safe if brought in carry on luggage. Whether TSA catches it or not is a different story, and if it travels in its canister most times it would probably go through. I would not risk it personally though.

Lastly, I know some people don't like the QRM setup. I watched some videos on this light and, though it does come with the QRM setup, you can remove that and attach the light head directly to the hard Goodman handle with no QRM at all.

Do you know what the beef with QRM setups is. I am going to order one for a Nautieye 1800 lumen Primary light I got as it just seems it would be more convenient to breakdown and store in its case.

I wonder if it protects itself so that if, for example, it gets accidentally turned on out of the water will it melt down eventually, or will it be fine, even if just sits there, running on the High setting, until the battery dies.

I would be surprised if the light did not have protection built in. It is usually a thermal protection circuit that will lower output once trigger temp is reached.

 

[stuartv]

I'm glad you asked. I'm wondering too......after making a leap of faith on impulse.

You have one on order?

Well this is wrong. Per FAA guidelines that TSA is following 100Whr is travel safe if brought in carry on luggage.

I suspect what that means is that it's done like (I think) UWLD (and others?) are doing theirs. Meaning, the batteries inside the can are in separate 50 WHr packs. So, you're traveling with 3 x 50 WHr, not 1 x 150 WHr. Which I guess is TSA-compliant. That would also explain why the connectors on the underside of the lid have 4 banana plugs - 1 ground and then 1 positive for each of 3 separate packs.

 

[stuartv]

I would be surprised if the light did not have protection built in. It is usually a thermal protection circuit that will lower output once trigger temp is reached.

Understood. I'm more wondering about how reliable/robust that protection is. It's one thing to keep it from self-damage if you turn it on and you're holding it in air. It's another thing if it's packed inside, say, a bag full of other stuff, so it's basically got insulation and no air flow around it, and then it gets turned on.

 

[aviator8]

I suspect what that means is that it's done like (I think) UWLD (and others?) are doing theirs. Meaning, the batteries inside the can are in separate 50 WHr packs. So, you're traveling with 3 x 50 WHr, not 1 x 150 WHr. Which I guess is TSA-compliant. That would also explain why the connectors on the underside of the lid have 4 banana plugs - 1 ground and then 1 positive for each of 3 separate packs.

that makes sense

 

[tbone1004]

if you search here, we talked about it when it came out. It is in fact being driven that hard, and it is in fact REALLY bright, and it does get quite hot underwater. Durability stands to be seen since it is a new light but I doubt it will last as long as something being driven to normal tolerances.

Failure on Piezo is theoretical since it is technically a thru-port where magnetic switches aren't, however magnetic switches are moving parts and are prone to getting stuck with sand and grit. I can't stand them, but others love them, to each their own.

@aviator8 160wh is still allowed, they have UN38.3 approval on that battery pack. @stuartv multiple small packs makes no difference in the certification, total watt hours and having passed the tests counts. Light Monkey is doing some seriously shady stuff with theirs to allow packs greater than 160wh to fly where they claim that because they aren't connected to each other it counts since the packs are individually UN38.3 certified. The problem is the actual wording says that since they are non-removable and in the same device, it still counts. UWLD only has 2 wires going to and from the battery, those 3 packs are connected as soon as they are installed in the canister.

in terms of thermal protection, where it is doesn't really matter. The thermal circuits are on the boards themselves, so as soon as they hit whatever threshold temp they are programmed for, they'll cut off. It will happen faster when insulated, but it will still cut off at the same temperature.

 

[aviator8]

160wh is still allowed, they have UN38.3 approval on that battery pack

Yes 101-160 WHr is technically possible with written airline approval. I have never tried that so I cant comment on how easy it is to do. My gut tells me it would be a pain in the butt to get in hand and you would probably have to do it each time you traveled.

 

[stuartv]

if you search here, we talked about it when it came out. It is in fact being driven that hard, and it is in fact REALLY bright, and it does get quite hot underwater. Durability stands to be seen since it is a new light but I doubt it will last as long as something being driven to normal tolerances.

How hot is "quite hot"? If you're in warm-ish water, does it get hot enough to be uncomfortable to grab the light head with a bare hand? (while in the water)

Also, do you know anything about the seeming contradiction in their blurbage? Can run 3.5 hours on High vs 1 hour at full brightness and then gradually dimming?

They claim 2150 lumens is the next lower brightness setting. Is that so bright that you would not even use full power very often? If you do run it at 50%, any idea how long it maintains the full 2150 lumens before it starts to dim?

I have no idea whatsoever about cave diving. Do people usually run their light on Full power all the time? Of course, I mean, when they are using lights of this general class of brightness - like this one or the UWLD 35 or the LM 32-VF. It seems like 4000-ish lumens might actually be overkill (in such a tight beam) in a cave, but what do I know about cave diving? (nothing, really)

 

[tbone1004]

@stuartv in cave water you can definitely grab the light head no problem, but you can feel the heat coming off of it. Any of the big boy lights you'll feel the heat on the lens as well.

No idea about their driver mechanism on which one is right. I didn't have it in the water long enough to find out, was only about 2 hours and you can't see the brightness dropoff during that duration.

When @The Chairman and I were diving in Olsen at Peacock Springs a couple weeks ago I did all of my dives on a Cave Adventurers backup light and he was diving my LX20. They are both more than bright enough with the backup light being comparable to a 10w HID that was the standard for a long time and the LX20 being about 50% brighter. I didn't even have mine on full power the whole time. Do I enjoy my LD35 on high? Absolutely! If I'm on the trigger, in big cave, or just am in the mood for a lot of light, nothing I have dove beats it and I usually have a pair of Cave Adventurers video backup lights on my helmet. These dives didn't require that much light since we were going into some smaller passages, kicking very slowly, and was in familiar cave. Diving with small lights vs big lights changes the whole experience of the cave and it's nice to dive with small lights sometimes. The key with the big boy lights is the ability to kick them down when there is too much particulate in the water and the backscatter gets bad.