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Diver dead after accident in Lake Ontario near Oakville

Discussion in 'Accidents & Incidents' started by DandyDon, Sep 2, 2010.

  1. DivingPrincessE

    DivingPrincessE Contributor

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Miramar & Fort Lauderdale, FL
    I believe people are discussing the cert level because the deceased diver was diving in an area that was beyond recreational limits, without a proper post-recreational (tech level) certification. This was compounded by both the media and his wife calling him a "tech diver", which it appears he was not. There is no information to indicate that this contributed to the accident, though I'm sure it didn't help the situation.

    It seems to me (a casual observer) that many of the diving accidents we read about here on SB occur when people are diving beyond their training/skill level and/or are not in good physical shape. This definitely doesn't account for ALL accidents (there are freak things, gear failures, healthy people who have heart attacks and panic attacks, etc) but just seems like a lot of accidents are caused by the two things I mentioned.
  2. Stoo

    Stoo NAUI Instructor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: Freelton & Tobermory, Ontario, Canada
    All of the studies related to diving fatalities that I have read certainly back this up. It seems that the increasing use of rebreathers might shift this a wee bit as there seems to be a disproportionate number of fatalities involving experienced divers on RBs.

    That is purely an observation. I have no idea if that is actually the case.

    I also suspect that as diving is practised by more of us that are approaching our "Golden Years", you will see health/fitness related accidents increase. I see people climbing onto boats in Tobermory that couldn't walk around the block without wheezing.

    None of this is especially relevant to this thread's topic, but it does make you wonder if enterprising dive shops will start to offers Senior's Discounts on fills!
  3. divereh

    divereh Master Instructor

    # of Dives:
    Location: Ontario
    That is the problem, it should be up to the charter operator to ensure divers are qualified to do the dives. Aquaholic, I hope you get sued and shut down and possibly criminally charged.
  4. Dhboner

    Dhboner DIR Practitioner

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Toronto

    That is totally out of line. The details of this tragedy have yet to be publicized so it is still only speculation that a lack of training was the direct cause of the accident. I can almost guarrantee you that every day of the summer in Tobermory an "unqualified diver" dives the Arabia or the Forest City...both advanced dives (as I'm sure you know). The only person who really knows your competence is your regular diving buddy. I could show up on a charter armed with my PADI Advanced and my Deep Diver card and still not be qualified to do a dive to 120 feet. The charter operator can only do so much to ensure that the divers are prepared for the dive. Hell over the years I have known people who "padded" their logbook with ficticious deep dives just to get on an advanced charter for a trophy dive.

    It is up to the individual diver to make an honest assessment of his/her abilities and experience before undertaking any dive...a charter operator can only do so much.

    Bob (Toronto)
  5. Jim Lapenta

    Jim Lapenta Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Canonsburg, Pa
    A charter op only needs to get divers back and forth from the site. They can check cards and logbooks but as has already been noted it is up to the diver to determine of they are qualified to do the dive. If they are not sure they should stay out of the water. If the op has to assess every diver and tell some they need to stay on the boat or on shore then expect prices to go up dramatically. What about the ops that do not use a DM in the water? Should they have to hire one to keep the nitwit with the advanced card from killing themselves? The diver is supposed to know what their limitations are. If they don't then they screwed up somewhere when it came time to make a judgment regarding their training, abilities, and or skill level. To wish some one be sued because they expect divers to be responsible for themselves is mean spirited and childish. If a person is not capable of diving in the condtions the boat goes then it is up to them to stay on land. If they choose not to and get hurt the op is not to blame if they gave an honest briefing that includes the recommended skill level the diver should have. And the diver should be capable of seeing that when the op tells them depth, current, vis, and temp. If that is not enough info for them they should have stayed in the pool.
  6. David_57

    David_57 Solo Diver

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Montreal, Canada
    Sorry disagree with many maybe some
  7. Ayisha

    Ayisha DIR Practitioner

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Toronto, Canada
    Training or skill level were not the direction the coroner was going in for cause of death back in September. The coroner was apparently investigating the dive shop that provided the victim's fills - NOT Eric or Aquaholic - for bad air. This has not been confirmed publicly and it has been very hush hush. However, many divers in Ontario are aware of it.

    Jim, we don't have DM's here that go in the water unless there is a course going on. The typical charter takes you to the dive site and moors; gives a dive briefing if wanted; they often tell you a maximum time they need you back by, they supervise exits and entries, assisting if necessary, and they wait for your return. I don't know of any guided dives in Ontario, and divers usually get independent really fast as a result, if they can tolerate the conditions.
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2010
  8. Jim Lapenta

    Jim Lapenta Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Canonsburg, Pa
    That is the way I like to dive and think all divers should be capable of doing so as well. You have to invite me and my friends up some time and show us the good stuff!
  9. Ayisha

    Ayisha DIR Practitioner

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Toronto, Canada
    Anytime Jim! We'd be honoured (no, not a spelling mistake - the Canadian spelling)!
    There are many beautiful, well preserved wrecks here, some in warmer (70+F), clearer water, some in extremely cold (38+F), low viz water. How long have you got? I always run charters with my friends throughout the summer and you're welcome to join us.

    I hope that all of our dive shops will have inline CO monitors for recreational divers long before next summer. According to the Ministry of Labour, inline CO monitors are supposed to become mandatory in the next year or so, but most dive shops in the outskirts don't have them and many don't in the Greater Toronto Area either. There has been a push by MOL inspectors to get them installed though. I hope it is successful.
  10. Jim Lapenta

    Jim Lapenta Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Canonsburg, Pa
    Been diving in the St Lawrence when the lake flipped and water went from 68 to 61 overnight. have about a dozen dives in Lake Erie with 38-40 degree temps to max of 155 ft. Ice cert and going back to assist teaching an ice class in Jan if everything goes to plan. Would be looking at the Aug-Sept time frame.

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