Eagles Nest Again

[ofg-1]

If that’s is true, were his dive weights still on / off him, when his dive buddy found him?

Depending on tank configurations, cave divers rarely use any weights.

 

[PfcAJ]

If that’s is true, were his dive weights still on / off him, when his dive buddy found him?

That’s a level of detail I don’t have.

 

[Dan]

What scenarios would an experienced cave diver be in an uncontrolled ascent situation and how to avoid / arrest / control it?

 

[PfcAJ]

What scenarios would an experienced cave diver be in an uncontrolled ascent situation and how to avoid / arrest / control it?

Siltout, loss of awareness of vertical movement, up up and away.

I’m not convinced the team was “experienced” either. Seems like at best their certifications to even be at eagles nest are in question.

 

[Ken Kurtis]

"This was a fairly simple technical dive within his capacity. Something just went wrong."

I am not at all a technical diver. But so much of diving is dependent on mindset whether it's rec or tech and everything in-between. I cringe when people tell me they're making the "easy" rec dive. The underlying implication is that it's so not-challenging, nothing can go wrong. I cringe even more when I hear a phrase like "simple technical". To my way of thinking, that's an oxymoron that's inviting trouble. A technical dive requires attention to detail and discipline that should take "simple" out of the equation. (And yes, I understand it's a relative term.) A tech dive by definition probably has less margin-of-error and perhaps greater penalty/consequences when things go south. To throw "simple" into the mix to my way of thinking is at least a pink, if not red, flag.

 

[LiteHedded]

is it true that the deceased was an intro to cave diver?

 

[boulderjohn]

I am not at all a technical diver. But so much of diving is dependent on mindset whether it's rec or tech and everything in-between. I cringe when people tell me they're making the "easy" rec dive. The underlying implication is that it's so not-challenging, nothing can go wrong. I cringe even more when I hear a phrase like "simple technical". To my way of thinking, that's an oxymoron that's inviting trouble. A technical dive requires attention to detail and discipline that should take "simple" out of the equation. (And yes, I understand it's a relative term.) A tech dive by definition probably has less margin-of-error and perhaps greater penalty/consequences when things go south. To throw "simple" into the mix to my way of thinking is at least a pink, if not red, flag.

I understand your point, Ken, but I think people use that term when talking about a place like Eagles Nest because that site has the potential to be extraordinarily difficult and dangerous. The immediate assumption when hearing about the site is that it did involve such an activity. I am a certified cave diver and trimix instructor, but the two divers who died there last year were doing something I would not even consider doing--it was far beyond my experience and training. On the other hand, at the same site, you can do a dive that would be within the training and experience of any certified cave diver. I believe the writer's purpose was to make that distinction. It would like discussing a fatality on Everest--it makes a difference whether it was the final ascent on a new route or a hike at the base camp.

 

[Dan]

Siltout, loss of awareness of vertical movement, up up and away.

I’m not convinced the team was “experienced” either. Seems like at best their certifications to even be at eagles nest are in question.

From what I understand, buoyancy control is one of the most important aspect of cave diving to avoid touching the ceiling / bottom & causing siltout. So, to be in a situation where a diver loss of awareness of vertical movement faster than the safe ascent rate and made the diver passed out due to AGE seems unlikely.

 

[PfcAJ]

From what I understand, buoyancy control is one of the most important aspect of cave diving to avoid touching the ceiling / bottom & causing siltout. So, to be in a situation where a diver loss of awareness of vertical movement faster than the safe ascent rate and made the diver passed out due to AGE seems unlikely.

Siltouts can be quite disorienting. Zero visual reference, and if you aren’t in contact with the line or cave you have no tactile reference either. It’s not at all far fetched for a diver to lose control. Arresting an ascent is also difficult due to the size of the BC, drysuit, and inertia of all the equipment.

 

[boulderjohn]

In all technical diving, including cave diving, the skill we call buoyancy control is more difficult than it is for recreational diving. That is primarily because technical divers carry so much gas and extra gear in general that they are very much diving in a way that a recreational diver would consider to be grossly overweighted. This means their wings usually have a lot of air in them to compensate. This makes expansion and contraction of the wing due to changes in depth much more of an issue. If a diver is beautifully neutrally buoyant and has a change in depth while task loaded, they can very easily lose control.

Let me describe what happened on two successive days while I was getting cave certified. The following event happened in exactly the same way on two different days with two different fellow students. In each case, we were exiting the cave, with me in the lead and my training partner following, with the instructor trailing behind. We went through a large room, with a very high ceiling, and then entered a smaller tunnel with a much lower ceiling. The instructor signaled the student in front of him to be out of air, and the student gave me that signal. I shared air, and the student took in a big breath upon receiving my regulator. Within seconds that student was pinned to the ceiling because of that quick change in buoyancy. I am quite sure my instructor anticipated that, which is why he waited until we were in that low tunnel. If he had started the drill in the large room we had just left, that student would have dragged me all the way to the ceiling. As it was, it was just a good lesson and no harm done.